PDA

View Full Version : Frog American Racing, CMH


docsavage
2005.03.01, 11:56 PM
After an agonizing couple of months trying to race XMODS, I finally gave in and dropped loot for an 01. Second race in the series my son got his, a thrashed veteran for 35$! Thanks J! Boy do I feel stupid.

We had several really good races, with mediocre results, I have two fourth place finishes. He has one fourth. The boy shows real talent, if he can just settle in. I have the same problem, but my race is only for mid pack, the 01 just isn't as stable as the 02. And therefore, slower (in a stock configuration). Mid series I will be upgrading to the 02, and give'm what-for.

We were talking about having an Open class, where the cars are stupid fast, with LiPoly's or Lithium Ion. Sounds sorta dangerous, but fun.

It's tough to wait the week in between races. But we always have a blast racing.

Macs Tom Thumb Mini Z Speedway is awesome. I can't say enough good things about Macs Tom Thumb. If your in the Columbus Ohio area, and looking for a place to race, Macs is it! 5$ per class. Pits with electric, parts on hand (of course!), and year round racing, every other Weds night at 6pm. The 9th and the 23rd this month (March) '05. With open practice on Tues prior to the race, 6pm-close.

Come race with us!


Fart (Frog American Racing Team)
Westerville, Ohio

MACS TOM THUMB FAMILY HOBBIES
460 N WILSON RD, COLUMBUS, OH 43204
Phone: (614) 274-5150

will3kgt
2005.03.06, 02:58 AM
I think I'll make a trip there this summer. I meant to last summer but I was busy with golf tournaments. They race outside during the summer am I correct?
I think SonicFury & I can make an appearence form MI. :cool:

Dustin
2005.03.07, 11:36 AM
Tom Thumb Hohhies always races indors in a hobby store on RCP. It would be great to seem to new faces.

Dustin Richards
CEO
Ripped Racing Products

docsavage
2005.03.16, 06:32 PM
I wondered when you would pop up on this here thread.

Dustin would know.

We used to race 12th/10th scale in the lot there years and years ago.......the miniz speedway has all the R/C racing wrapped up at Macs these days, that's a good thing. One race Stocker bodies, it sprinkled during our main, what a blast!

docsavage
2005.03.16, 06:42 PM
Well the old man dropped for an 02MM, tired of getting smoked by these other dudes.

Just a world of difference in the two cars.

A little dremel action on the rear wheel wells, and the Cerumo Supra body fits real nice. Looks awesome with the diablo rims too.

The Diablo body will get a UOP Shadow sticker scheme, 101, Universal Oil Products. A 70's Can-Am team powered by Ford, and funded by an ex-CIA spook. Nice right. Awesome cars awesome drivers.....those were the days.

Endurance race in two weeks at MACS is the word. 2 hour enduro.....phew. Longest (RC) race I was ever in was 12th scale, mini INDY 500....I think we ran like 45 minutes or something. Grueling in the June heat. Third place.....the dude who won was prolly cheatin. His car was sick fast. Damn BoLink.

The 01 chassis is open if someone wants to join in the fun, buy the thing, or just run it (with team orders of course). Anyone in CMH wanting to check out the miniZ race thing, gimme a shout, we'll make a deal of some sort.

Looking really forward to the race next week.


SHADOW PIC attached

Anyone interested in Mid-Ohio, USRRC or INDYCAR, RunOffs, or vintage Can Am pics, or video hit me up! Got tons....

docsavage
2005.03.23, 10:48 PM
Man what a race. Thanks to all the other stock racers, I think we have all finally figured out how to run together. Some really great racing. Yours truly TQ'd, by only 6 100ths! Props to Dustin, Ed, and Chris. You guys all ran great. Won the first heat, came in second in the 2nd heat. The main was pretty awesome, I got the hole shot, led a few laps here and there, but it was mostly the Dustin show. Gonna really have to improve my consistency to beat these guys!

Justin had a good night too, made the A Main, came in last, but it was a tough race. Making the A was good enough! He's improving. Busted his daggone H plate in the main though, but he did finish. Unreal.

All the racing was really compettitive, as usual. Someone else can write up the races that don't involve Frog American Racing.


There is some hope of bringing a championship to the FART stable in this series. Gonna take alot of luck, and consistency. It ain't over till the fat lady sings.

docsavage
2005.03.24, 09:43 PM
Anyone got the points structure? Mike said he was gonna send the rules, I never got them. Anybody?

will3kgt
2005.03.27, 12:45 AM
Are there any pictures from you r races?

Dustin
2005.03.29, 12:33 PM
I will try to post pics. Although there are no promises. I race 3 classes and am trying to dial in my overland on top of that. So needless to say i am a little busy but i agree pics are cool and i will try to post some.

On another note how do you put the pics directly in the thread insted of inserting atchments. Does any one know. Thanks later

saiyan
2005.04.02, 07:34 PM
Hello. Do you still have the 01 for sale? what would you want for it? Be willing to ship it?
I would be interested in seeing some pics of this track. I'm thinkin about takin the family on a road trip to see my family who all live up and down the east coast, and i'm compiling a list of tracks that may be along the way to stop in and run some practice laps or something.

docsavage
2005.04.07, 05:10 PM
I'm keeping the 01, gonna upgrade it for mod class racing.

Our track is RCP, you can find them online. We run 14X10, to me it's large. And taking pictures of these little cars is tough. Too small, too fast.

4/6 race was just completely FUBAR, I had to use the narrow 01 rims on the rear, somehow I bent the 02 rims. And it was just for crap all night. The car was fast but just unstable enough to make me look like an amatuer, oh wait we are amatuers!

Good job Brian! Dustin I appreciate your track manners immensely, wish I could say the same of the rest.

Feeling rather snakebit. Can't afford any more nights like that one. Or the series is shot..

saiyan
2005.04.08, 12:01 PM
Maybe the next race will go better for ya. There have been days when i'm racin my Pro2 and it seems like it's all i can do to finish a whole lap let alone a heat or main. :o

docsavage
2005.04.11, 05:47 PM
Due to increasing economic pressures, I have accepted a travelling position. I'm sure any of you who pay bills realize that nothing is getting cheaper. So, I'll be on the road half of this year. I just don't have any other choices. Serve it up for Bagdhad.

My apologies to Dustin, and Jason. But, go ahead and build your cars, I'll be back now and then to race, just not for points.

Not sure about Justin, hopefully someone will take my place and get him there so he can keep racing.

So Long for now. When there's anything new I'll post.

On the other hand, I'll be racing around the country, hopefully!

docsavage
2005.05.04, 09:59 PM
It was a really nice day here in CMH, and the turnout was slim.

But I think most of us had fun. I did, even though I couldn't get the car sorted.
Dustin again, I have to say thank you for the clean racin' (mostly) the jump in the track was in the worst place possible, end of the front straight. Mod class was like watching Evel Knievel jumping the Colorado River. It was sort of sad. Didn't help me out in stock either. Wickedfast down the straights, nothing in the corners.

I did better in stock with my kids 01, which is box stock. The car was just unruly with the new front tires. I've never had new ones on this car, and it was just hell.

Anyone got any hints for tuning the 02 ball diff. I think it's a Kyosho diff. No matter how I set it, tight, or loose, or anything in between, it wants to drift one way or the other down the straights.

Back for now!

FART

docsavage
2005.05.05, 08:53 AM
Frog A M E R I C A N Racing


Dustin apparently had some problems with the PN race in NY. He smoked 'em, and they changed the rules on him, MID EVENT, and disqualified him. I'm a big stickler for rules (usually), enforcing exsisting rules is VITAL to the hobby. Changing rules during a compettition is something not even the SCCA would do! It's really childish, and stupid. Even worse they drove all the way to NYC, just to get crapped on by the guys from PN.

If that's how it's gonna be with them, I'm not sure I wanna race in a PN event.

Bottom line is Dustin was whipping thier azzes, so they changed the rules in a direction they knew would disqualify him. And didn't bother telling him until the racing was done, and he had won.

NO RACING ORG in the world would be so low. NONE. This is what happens when a shop, and munufacturer establish, run, and administer a series. I'm glad to say that Mike (Mac Tom Thumb Hobbies) runs a class act, shows no partiality to anyone, and sponsors no drivers. He just runs the race, and gives up his limited free time to host some fun as he11 racing.

We should appeal to ROAR and get a miniz class, then PN can SPONSOR some racing, and leave the machinations of the racing to impartial officials. I mean wow what a sweet deal for PN, the host shop PAYS for the race (upwards of 500$), PN officiates, the local shop has to clean up, provide the track pay for the electricity, all PN has to do is get there. And on top of all that, when a talented racer shows up, and beats on them, they change up a rule, and bingo the PN racers win. WIN WIN WIN for PN.

I have a measure of respect for Dustins driving, obviously his tech skills are at LEAST the match of his driving ability. And every lap I can stay ahead of Dustin I consider myself lucky. But he always gets around.

Dustin, feel free to rip them apart in this thread.

Tubaboy
2005.05.05, 09:45 AM
What was he disqualified for? I would like to know more details on this, as would many other racers planning on attending events. What rule did they claim he violated?

Thanks!

TITANIUM
2005.05.05, 11:55 AM
Frog A M E R I C A N Racing


Dustin apparently had some problems with the PN race in NY. He smoked 'em, and they changed the rules on him, MID EVENT, and disqualified him. I'm a big stickler for rules (usually), enforcing exsisting rules is VITAL to the hobby. Changing rules during a compettition is something not even the SCCA would do! It's really childish, and stupid. Even worse they drove all the way to NYC, just to get crapped on by the guys from PN.

If that's how it's gonna be with them, I'm not sure I wanna race in a PN event.

Bottom line is Dustin was whipping thier azzes, so they changed the rules in a direction they knew would disqualify him. And didn't bother telling him until the racing was done, and he had won.

NO RACING ORG in the world would be so low. NONE. This is what happens when a shop, and munufacturer establish, run, and administer a series. I'm glad to say that Mike (Mac Tom Thumb Hobbies) runs a class act, shows no partiality to anyone, and sponsors no drivers. He just runs the race, and gives up his limited free time to host some fun as he11 racing.

We should appeal to ROAR and get a miniz class, then PN can SPONSOR some racing, and leave the machinations of the racing to impartial officials. I mean wow what a sweet deal for PN, the host shop PAYS for the race (upwards of 500$), PN officiates, the local shop has to clean up, provide the track pay for the electricity, all PN has to do is get there. And on top of all that, when a talented racer shows up, and beats on them, they change up a rule, and bingo the PN racers win. WIN WIN WIN for PN.

I have a measure of respect for Dustins driving, obviously his tech skills are at LEAST the match of his driving ability. And every lap I can stay ahead of Dustin I consider myself lucky. But he always gets around.

Dustin, feel free to rip them apart in this thread.

you sure seem to be quick to run PN's name in the mud....
I highly doubt things transpired as you have posted....
I was not there...but from what I know of the PN organization I would be willing to stand behind them without even knowing the details.

Docsavage, are you witness to these events you claim? or is this hearsay from a rouge source?

docsavage
2005.05.06, 10:40 AM
TITANIUM WROTE:you sure seem to be quick to run PN's name in the mud....
I highly doubt things transpired as you have posted....
I was not there...but from what I know of the PN organization I would be willing to stand behind them without even knowing the details.

One thing is clear in this whole thing. There is a language barrier with PN, and I don't hold that against them. But it is a factor. But if I really wanted to run them into them into the mud, I would say they did it to save the airfare (reimbursement) for the Nationals in Vegas!

You go right ahead and stand behind them, the fact of the matter is, they changed the rules on the website in the middle of the racing. Then disqualified him. They let him go ahead and race, in violation of the rules then disqualified him after enough races had been run, so his disqualification would keep him from winning. The issue was traction compound, which per Dustin he was using ON THE DRIVER STAND. He wasn't the one hiding anything, they were.

I'll say this again, not even the SCCA, possibly the most idiotic body in motorsports, would change the rules DURING an event.

Any good racer knows the important thing is what ISN'T in the rules. That is where
innovation comes in. I would be willing to bet the traction compound wasn't even needed for Dustin to smoke those guys. He really is that good. Gotta respect the skills.

I know Dustin personally, he isn't a liar, or a blowhard. As a matter of fact he's the most level headed kid of his age that I know. I take his word on this, for sure. The one time I out qualified him (without cheating, and not since) it was only by 6/100ths, he is in reality the best racer I have ever run against (in twelve years). I can imagine the PN guys sitting around talking about how they could beat him.

I don't know anything about PN (maybe if they could get the language thing together on thier website so it makes any sense), but I know how it goes when a shop/manufacturer runs races(and some clubs too), the sponsored (or local) racers always get protection. UNLESS the owner has a bit of decorum. Which is rarely the case. We are really lucky here to have such a fair guy as Mike running our series. He really is a class act.

So you go ahead and stand with them on this. It would be a much different story if it happened to you. :cool:

TITANIUM
2005.05.06, 06:19 PM
fyi, i read your latest post, i think your way off...so in respect for the topic, later....

docsavage
2005.05.06, 09:11 PM
Dustin cannot discuss this topic as he is entering into litigation with Pn.

All of this is direct quotes from Dustin himself.

And the GOOGLE caches cannot be disputed, as they are kept by GOOGLE, and are not accessible. The fact that Mr. Ng, to date has not responded to a perfectly legitimate, and reasonable request, I have to assume he is not concerned with his reputation. Dustin on the other hand, as a sponsored driver with a bright future in R/C racing, is very concerned with at LEAST clearing his name.

Let the evidence speak for itself.

GOOGLE cache of the website prior to the race, up to the Sunday night of the race weekend.

Check out the line that says tires, I see nothing about traction compound there.

The bottom line says it all. My translation, in light of current events is this (The official reserves the right to change the rules at any time, with or without notice, tough luck for you racers!).

http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:eZAs2g5ALBUJ:www.pnracing.us/2005worldcup.htm+pnracing+world+cup&hl=en

Now another interesting bit, this is the official entry form of the HOUSTON RACE to be held in June.

Says nothing about traction compound being illegal.

http://www.reflexracing.net/images/PNRegional.jpg

Here is the current page. Totally different story. This is where the true malfeasance lies. LIES being the operative word.

http://www.pnracing.us/usa-rules.htm

Now that you've seen the evidence, which is almost irrefutable. Read the kids story. And you tell me.

"I was in attendance with 4 other family members at the NY PN Race. It was a
great weekend and a terrible weekend. It was great because out of the four
classes I TQed two. I TQed stock and overland. I qualified 4th in mod. I
qualified 2 in f1 and won it. F1 was the first class to run the mains. I won
by a lap. The stock class I was leading by a lap. It was run second in the
order of mains. There was two minutes to go. However after the computer
crashed I was called to the judges stand. They disqualified me for using
traction additive. All my classes qualifying runs and mains that were run
were DQed. I had absolutely no idea that traction additives were not
allowed. We demanded to see entry form but they would not show it to us.
Philip at PN kept saying the rule was on the PN website. We left before all
trophies, free stuff, some mains including My stock make up main since the
computer crashed, my overland main, and my mod main."

"We got to our hotel Sunday night and checked the website that had the rules
on it there was nothing on it about traction additives. We saved the web
page because we thought they might try to change it. Sure enough they did.
On Monday the page with the rules was changed."

Of course no one knows the Pn side because they haven't said anything, and probably won't. Very uncool, the least they can do is apologize.

BigVxxx
2005.05.07, 11:08 PM
:confused: I also race with Dustin at TT Raceway and can say that he is a very good racer and plays by the rules. My only thoughts ont he whole issue is this:

If I see someone unknowingly breaking a race rule I would tell them so. That's just who I am, I wouldn't go crying to a race offical. No harm no foul in that type of situation.
Second, whether it's PN or a group of companies sponsoring an event they have no buissness race directing. The host site should be the ones to officiate and enforce the rules. This is how club racing should be regaurdless of whose sponsoring it. This eliminates situations like Dustin's. I just can't believe no singal racer or event staff never noticed Dustin doping his tires prior to mains. If they did and then waited to bone him during the mains then shame on them. I'm all for competitive racing, but racing should always be fun. This isin't ROAR\IFMAR championship racing. Dustin, if you read this, maybe you should go to another regional and beat them at their own game. You can run fast without thier parts!!!!

McLaren F1 T3
2005.05.07, 11:36 PM
BOOOOOOOOO! PN has really messed up this time. Bad choice to do this..!! I like the PN products like motor mount and motor, but this really is lots of BS. They will definitley suffer the consequences soon because as they say about karma "what comes around goes around." :mad:

TNB
2005.05.08, 02:40 AM
Says nothing about traction compound being illegal.
I know that the use of traction compound has been discussed on this forum by several MZR members since I was one of them. I also recall that the owner of NetZone where the Rialto regional was held specifically mentioned that he did not allow the use of traction compound. And although the Houston track "rules" and thread may not disallow the use of traction compound, it was also discussed on this forum since its use was prohibited at Rialto and during the US Kyosho Mini-Z-Cups.

Ironically, if this is a debate about one set of rules v. another set of rules (which appear to be the same set I saw on the Mexican website sometime ago http://www.minizracingtrack.com/Pn%20Racing/PN%20Racing%20mexico.htm ), it appears that there would not have been an F1 class to begin with to be threatening a lawsuit or arguing over since there was no F1 class in the first set of rules linked to on this thread. I also know that an Overland class was not run at Rialto like there apparently was in New York.
Read the kids story. And you tell me.
I TQed stock and overland. I qualified 4th in mod. I
qualified 2 in f1 and won it.
Consequently, this leads me to believe that the host track also had some input just like in the ROAR rules ( http://www.roarracing.com/ )where there is an "option" for the host track owner operator. Either way, it also appears that the rules posted before and after provide the officials with the power to officiate and decide the outcome (as what I believe was the same case in the Mini-Z-Cup).

Myself, I don't see and never have seen any mention of where an official has to inform someone if they are breaking any rules prior to the conclusion of a race, such as the use of traction compound, weight of the car, mods, and so on. To me, that would defeat the purpose of a tech inspection. Even in Rialto, one of the racers made a comment about someone elseís wing, but a formal complaint was not made and neither the race official or track owner operator mentioned anything at that time to my knowledge. The particular racer then modified his wing prior to the final race. Of course, everything here is either my opinion as is everything I have posted or based on what I have seen or heard in the past.

If this matter enters "into litigation with Pn" as previously posted and asserted, I would appreciate the court information and court case number so that I may follow it online. After all, it would be of public record if a complaint is actually filed and I would like to know if and how it may change any of the races in any future venues. One thing is for certain though and as I posted long ago, this is just one of the few reasons I would never host a race on my track.

ruf
2005.05.08, 05:55 AM
docsavage - Please remove reference of my website from this post and this letter. If you read my flyer, it clearly states that you should refer to my website for the rules. My website then links to PN's rules page. My flyer was published well after the NY Regional, and therefore has nothing to do with it.

In fact, I would recommend that you remove the post entirely. If there is indeed a lawsuit filed, you have seriously exposed yourself liability-wise. Just a recommendation.

Please do not judge, as you guys do not know all the facts. I do not either, but I have had contact with both parties, and everything is not as black and white as it seems.

BigVxxx
2005.05.08, 01:29 PM
I agree with what you are saying in regaurds to ROAR officiating and tech inspections. However, if the violation is happening on the drivers stand in plain site I think threr should be a little more leanience. This series is more a product promotion then a series race. I hate to beat opponets by DQ's, but if someone is intentionally cheating then thats a different story. Again, I wasn't in NY so I' only going by heresay. I would still use there (PN) products, and a lawsuit.........well I don't know if thats a solution to this problem. :D



I know that the use of traction compound has been discussed on this forum by several MZR members since I was one of them. I also recall that the owner of NetZone where the Rialto regional was held specifically mentioned that he did not allow the use of traction compound. And although the Houston track "rules" and thread may not disallow the use of traction compound, it was also discussed on this forum since its use was prohibited at Rialto and during the US Kyosho Mini-Z-Cups.

Ironically, if this is a debate about one set of rules v. another set of rules (which appear to be the same set I saw on the Mexican website sometime ago http://www.minizracingtrack.com/Pn%20Racing/PN%20Racing%20mexico.htm ), it appears that there would not have been an F1 class to begin with to be threatening a lawsuit or arguing over since there was no F1 class in the first set of rules linked to on this thread. I also know that an Overland class was not run at Rialto like there apparently was in New York.

Consequently, this leads me to believe that the host track also had some input just like in the ROAR rules ( http://www.roarracing.com/ )where there is an "option" for the host track owner operator. Either way, it also appears that the rules posted before and after provide the officials with the power to officiate and decide the outcome (as what I believe was the same case in the Mini-Z-Cup).

Myself, I don't see and never have seen any mention of where an official has to inform someone if they are breaking any rules prior to the conclusion of a race, such as the use of traction compound, weight of the car, mods, and so on. To me, that would defeat the purpose of a tech inspection. Even in Rialto, one of the racers made a comment about someone elseís wing, but a formal complaint was not made and neither the race official or track owner operator mentioned anything at that time to my knowledge. The particular racer then modified his wing prior to the final race. Of course, everything here is either my opinion as is everything I have posted or based on what I have seen or heard in the past.

If this matter enters "into litigation with Pn" as previously posted and asserted, I would appreciate the court information and court case number so that I may follow it online. After all, it would be of public record if a complaint is actually filed and I would like to know if and how it may change any of the races in any future venues. One thing is for certain though and as I posted long ago, this is just one of the few reasons I would never host a race on my track.

TITANIUM
2005.05.08, 07:58 PM
Please do not judge, as you guys do not know all the facts. I do not either, but I have had contact with both parties, and everything is not as black and white as it seems.

I agree!...
I also have talked with a third party that is in witness to events...
and I must laugh at how this transpired...due to the attitude and actions of certain racers.

Philip is a good guy...too bad second hand accounts are whatís driving the smear campaign against PN.....
really, for those that read this attack on pn...look at it like this Ö.
"there's one in every crowd... "

ruf
2005.05.09, 03:23 AM
I'll say this again, not even the SCCA, possibly the most idiotic body in motorsports, would change the rules DURING an event.

Any good racer knows the important thing is what ISN'T in the rules. That is where
innovation comes in. I would be willing to bet the traction compound wasn't even needed for Dustin to smoke those guys. He really is that good. Gotta respect the skills.Traction compound is easily worth a lap over the course of a race. The race would've been much closer if there were no traction compound involved judging by the timing sheets that I've seen on the CORE website. Not to say that Dustin still wouldn't have won, but it would've been closer. I've talked with Dustin and I know he's a stand up guy. It was clearly just a mistake. I do not want to get into the details until I have verified certain things with him in order to avoid any offense on my part.

The rules were not changed MIDRACE. The rules were common knowledge on this board. The were simply enforced much too late in the race. This was a cup race that was designed to promote Mini-Z racing. The track owner actually provides very little in terms of financing the race. There was no vested interest in PN's actions. I would unfortunately have to do the same thing at my track under the same circumstances, but I would've probably had better accomodations to avoid the situation. All in all, it's a tough break for a good racer and a good kid. Frankly, I dislike the no traction compound and no foam tires, but rules are rules and that's what we play by.

docsavage
2005.05.09, 10:02 AM
I have achieved my goal, this topic is closed in this thread. After I have the last word of course.

I will do my best Mr. Chen.

THE TOPIC IS CLOSED

ruf
2005.05.09, 10:07 AM
I have achieved my goal, this topic is closed in this thread. After I have the last word of course.

I will do my best Mr. Chen.

THE TOPIC IS CLOSEDOur best is all any of us can ask for. If your goal was to inform people of the events that transpired during the NY Regional, then you may have done so at Dustin's expense and potentially to your own detriment. As fellow racers, we all deserve to know what happened, but in due time and with the approval of the parties involved and in an objective manner.

Oh, and please call me Joe or ruf. :D

Dustin
2005.05.10, 09:37 AM
To whom it may concern,

I have decided not to go forward with the legal litigation with PN. There are a few different reasons that prompt this. The main reason is that PN I just not worth the time nor financial investment it would take to win a lawsuit. For those of you who understand the legal system you know it would take close to a $10,000 investment to most likely only regain the $1,000 it took to me attend the PN Regional Qualifier event in New York.

My mind remains unchanged in my opinion of PN. They cheated to make themselves look good and to cover their own rear of a great mistake. I have tried numerous times to contact PN to resolve this problem but I have never received a single reply from them.

In regard to the decision and stance PN has taken, I will never again run PN products and encourage others to do the same. I refuse to support a dishonest, unethical, company such as PN, out of principle.

For those that have supported me in this situation, I truly thank you. It is you that keep people racing in this great sport.

For those that opposed me, well, not even a win for me in court will change you opinion of PN. You have stood by PN despite the irrefutable facts that I have brought forward. Your mind is made up and nothing will change you mind.

My stance regarding PN includes not attending any PN race in the future. I attended the PN Regional in NY TQed two classes and won two classes. I was among the fastest there and if there is ever a Mini-Z event that is not sponsored or run by PN, look for me to attend.

To PN, congratulations, you have succeeded in your dishonest actions and gotten away with it. My last request to you is that you in the future, run a better race, with clearly stated rules, so this unfortunate event does not repeat itself.

I whish all racers the best of luck in their future endeavors. In the end, to sum it all up ďItís just a hobby, Have fun raciínĒ. I have done so in the past, did so in NY, and will continue to do so.

I will now consider this entire event closed.

Sincerely

Dustin Richards

ruf
2005.05.10, 11:07 AM
Dustin has made his stance very clear and he knows how I feel about the situation, so this post is more to explain to others what Dustin and I already have an understanding about. I am happy to hear that Dustin has decided to against litigation. I really donít think thatís what this hobby should be about. I told Dustin earlier that Iím not a lawyer, so Iíd much rather settle this matter on the racetrack than in the courtroom. :D

I too would refuse to align myself with an unethical business, but I donít think that is the case with PN. I personally don't believe that PN was trying to cheat Dustin out of anything. The Rialto winner wasnít affiliated with PN, and the NY winner had only a remote association with PN. There was no vested interest for PN to disqualify Dustin. I really DO think he got the short end of the stick on this deal, but it happens sometimes.

The rules about traction compound were well known since Rialto. He didn't know about them, and a relatively unprofessional race organization failed to detect the error until much too late. As I understand it, there were verbal announcements at the NY regional about no traction compound because a lot of RCP track owners are afraid that it will degrade the track. In any case, I don't think that PN was being dishonest or unethical. I DO think that PN was being disorganized and Dustin paid the price. If he decides not to attend another PN event, then they will have lost an excellent contender for the World Cup and they have already expressed their regret.

As for PN not responding directly, Philip is not all that fluent in English and had his friend Bennett fill in for him. I inadvertently came into this situation when I invited Dustin to our PN regional, and he informed me of what happened in NY. Having dealt with Philip in the past, I knew that the level of communication would probably be unsatisfactory, so I took it upon myself to act as a mediator of sorts to help smooth things out with what I now believe to be a reputable company and a reputable racer. In order to re-establish that reputation, I have convinced PN to authorize a letter stating that Dustin was not intentionally cheating, and that he unknowingly broke a rule that resulted him his disqualification from the NY regional. This letter should help maintain his good standing with all of his sponsors.

As well as PN offering him free admission to the World Cup Finals, I have extended free entry for our Regional to Dustin. I have also offered him a place to stay to help offset his costs should he decide to race here in Houston. Weíd love to have the extra competition! If our past races are any indication, it should be a very efficient race on the biggest competition RCP track in the US! Having organized and managed numerous ROAR events in the past, I can guarantee that there will be no ambiguity about the rules at our Regional. I am in the process of drawing up a refined set of rules for our PN Regional to cover areas where the structure is ill-defined. I hope to eventually grow this into a proposal for ROAR sanctioning so that this sort of thing never happens again.

I would love for Dustin to come race at our Regional qualifier, using non-PN parts as an active form of protest instead of a passive boycott. Competition is what makes this hobby so much fun, regardless of its intent. Along the lines of what Dustin closed his statement with, here is my final perspective on this whole matter: we race toy cars for bowling trophies! :D It's for fun and thrills and camaderie. Let's keep it that way!

TNB
2005.05.10, 11:31 AM
Dustin,
I'm just curious like cats will be, but are you the same person who sat in the front row at the 2004 Kyosho Mini-Z-Cup (RCX) next to Aaron and Noel? I do remember someone racing at the event along with someone else whom I was informed was their father. If I recall correctly, a certain person also asked me about using my Futaba T3PK since there was a crystal issue and that person didn't want to modify their own AM Conversion Module to use the handout crystals. If I recall correctly, I also recall someone testing and tuning on the RCP Track prior to open practice. Of course, no traction compound was allowed at the Kyosho event either. Just curious.

TITANIUM
2005.05.10, 11:56 AM
TNB,
actually Noel pitted next to me...but the group next to him was from Ohio, Dustin was with that group....if you remember it was Dustin and his father, also Kyle ..Kyle was the tall guy with all the cameras of sort...then it was Rudy & Brett on the far side of them...

TITANIUM
2005.05.10, 12:02 PM
The Rialto winner wasnít affiliated with PN, and the NY winner had only a remote association with PN. There was no vested interest for PN to disqualify Dustin. I really DO think he got the short end of the stick on this deal, but it happens sometimes.!

nor was the Railto 2nd or 3rd position in any class for that matter....

TNB
2005.05.10, 12:03 PM
Thanks T. That does bring back some memories about the Kyosho Mini-Z-Cup and some memories regarding earlier posts about a few racers in the front row using "something" on their tires at RCX--Not you or Noel of course.

ruknd@aol.com
2005.05.10, 04:01 PM
Actually, South Shore Hobby's is not too far from me...not my local track but about 45 minutes away. It's a 1:10 place and doesn't even sell a single mini-z part. Locally, we don't care for the owner and choose not to frequent his track. Many of the racers there do come to our track, and are always welcome :D . Hence teh reason I chose not to go. Had it been at bigD's or HKS stayed open for it I'd be there (though not sure how we all would have fit at HKS :p ). That being said, it was pretty clear to me...an outsider, that compound was clearly not allowed...printed rule argument aside.

As for litigation...this is one thing that aggrivates the cr*P out of me. What has our pitiful society become that we threaten to sue over driving little toy cars around a foam track? FYI...I'd love to speak to any attorney that would represent you on such a frivilous lawsuit and tell him what a hack lawyer he is. A) for wasing the court's time, B) for wasting tax payers resources, and c) wasting you $$$ and makign you believe you actually have legal recourse.

GROW UP PEOPLE, LIGHTEN UP, AND HAVE FUN...THIS IS A HOBBY.

That aside...will I be seeing any of you Ohio people at CRCRC in the fall?

Tubaboy
2005.05.10, 04:01 PM
He may not have to make the trip to Houston. He will probably get a PN race in his backyard, last I heard. (This is about 1 1/2 months old information now... but it was firsthand from the shop owner).

Traction compound will leave a permanent residue on RCP. Personally if I was the owner of that track, and did not want people to run the stuff, I would have sent a bill to the above racer to replace his track. But it's not my track, so that neither here nor there.

In any case, the incident is unfortunate, and I doubt that ROAR will make this a sanctioned type of racing, as the market is to small, and it would have to be opened up to other 1/28th scale cars and brands. Our best hope is that Kyosho does something similar to Tamaya's Cup racing.

I'm also glad to see no lawsuits. Hopefully lessons were learned on all sides of this. Dustin could have asked prior to juicing his tires. PN Racing / The track should have looked at the ROAR event Templates and based their racing on that. Also, all must remember that it is very difficult to account for every little thing racers will do to get an advantage. When it comes to 1/10th scale, you have to tear the motors down because people will try to get away with Frankenstein stocks (when it's not a handout, and sometimes when it is!!) ie. mixing and matching Stock Motor parts to make it a higher class stock motor. At this point's it's a modified 27 turn motor...

ruf
2005.05.10, 04:12 PM
When it comes to 1/10th scale, you have to tear the motors down because people will try to get away with Frankenstein stocks (when it's not a handout, and sometimes when it is!!) ie. mixing and matching Stock Motor parts to make it a higher class stock motor. At this point's it's a modified 27 turn motor...There are always people that will try to cheat their way to the top. I think one of the main things to take away from this is that Dustin wasn't one of them. Actions have to be taken to ensure that something like this doesn't happen again (simple mistake with a big punishment). Hopefully I'll have it all covered at our regional. As for the real cheaters, kick'em all out. :D

I'm willing to let this topic die. Back to the racing! :cool:

TNB
2005.05.10, 04:16 PM
He may not have to make the trip to Houston. He will probably get a PN race in his backyard, last I heard. (This is about 1 1/2 months old information now... but it was firsthand from the shop owner).
What does this mean? If I threw a hissy fit, I could run a race all by myself? Since Dustin hasn't responded to my earlier questions, I've thought of another question since you brought up a special race--Dustin, did you have the option to compete in the other classes without the use of traction compound after DQ'd in the F1 class?

Dustin
2005.05.10, 05:00 PM
I did have the option of running after I had run the stock and f1 race. But at that point in the middle of the mains I would have had to buy all new tires. I would have had less than 5 minuits to instal them. Plus I had run tires all weekend that were dremeled down. I would not have had time to bring my tires to the point that i had worked all weekend to achieve. Also I would have had to buy tires from the PN related shop that was there and would not do so. Since in my oppinion I did not cheet. Why must I buy new tires and not the tires I want since I did not violate and "rule" but as Bennit Lo put it a PN "tridition" I did not know about.

Dustin
2005.05.10, 05:03 PM
What questions does anyone want answered. I will answer any.

TNB
2005.05.10, 05:04 PM
Dustin,
So basically you had the option to continue racing but chose not to do so. Was that also you at RCX?
Dustin,
I'm just curious like cats will be, but are you the same person who sat in the front row at the 2004 Kyosho Mini-Z-Cup (RCX) next to Aaron and Noel? I do remember someone racing at the event along with someone else whom I was informed was their father. If I recall correctly, a certain person also asked me about using my Futaba T3PK since there was a crystal issue and that person didn't want to modify their own AM Conversion Module to use the handout crystals. If I recall correctly, I also recall someone testing and tuning on the RCP Track prior to open practice. Of course, no traction compound was allowed at the Kyosho event either. Just curious.

Dustin
2005.05.10, 05:06 PM
ruknd, You bet you will see me if you come to CRCRC in the fall. Mini z's are my hobby from my hobby. Ofroad racing is what i love best. I race and practise on Sun and Wed. I also try to get to the carpet track once and a wile ontop of that.

TNB
2005.05.10, 05:13 PM
What questions does anyone want answered. I will answer any.
See my questions above.

Dustin
2005.05.10, 05:16 PM
I would have had to buy new tires, mount them, and still prepair for the race in less then 5 minuets. So yes under the circumstances i did not run 2 of my classes after I had run the other two.

Yes I did attend the RCX Nationals In Calif.

Yes I did sit by Nowel.

Yes my father was there and sat on my other side

Yes I did ask someone to borrow a module. I do not know if it was you.

As far as the practise I do not remember running prior to open practise.

I did not use any additives at RCX. It was clearly stated in the written rules. I always do my best to follow any rules that I am awair of. If someone had a problum why did they not ask to have my car closer inspected at tech.

Why wait a year to hash this out.

ruknd@aol.com
2005.05.10, 05:42 PM
ruknd, You bet you will see me if you come to CRCRC in the fall. Mini z's are my hobby from my hobby. Ofroad racing is what i love best. I race and practise on Sun and Wed. I also try to get to the carpet track once and a wile ontop of that.
Will be my first big travel event...I normally drive at LI Raceway...we tend to have alot of people travel out there and take up a few spots in the a mains :p .

TNB
2005.05.10, 05:43 PM
Dustin,

I'm just trying to put a face with the name. Quite frankly, I don't care what you did or did not do at RCX (or what anyone else did or did not do) and you should realize that since if I did, I would have filed a formal protest if I knew of a violation. The way I look at it is that the 2004 Cup is over and it's time to move on, but I am trying to get a better picture of the latter events by looking at past events.

It simply appears to me that someone must have protested at the PN Race. It also appears that you must have some notion of why RCP Track owners don't want traction compound used on their tracks after the Kyosho Mini-Z-Cup even if you didn't realize it was not supposed to be used in Rialto or in New York despite other posts.

I am also confused by the following post.

The issue was traction compound, which per Dustin he was using ON THE DRIVER STAND. He wasn't the one hiding anything, they were.

Did you really use the traction compound on the driver's stand? If you did, that would just seem strange to me to be the only person on the driver's stand using traction compound. After all, I wouldn't look at it like as though the lone ranger is the only racer who thought of it, but more of a question as to why no one else appeared to be using traction compound.

ruf
2005.05.10, 05:47 PM
Once the tires are sauced, they are softer. I'm going to be very strict about this at our Regional. The nice thing about sauce is that it has a distinct odor that never goes away, whether or not it's wintergreen-based.

The only way that Dustin could have run under the rules that I will be enforcing would be as last qualifier and with tires that have never seen sauce. The problem at this event is that it was caught so late. I would of course give him the chance to re-qualify in a later heat if the infraction was caught early enough. But if someone had been intentionally cheating, then they would not have had that option at our regional. Boot them, I say. I hate cheaters.

And I'm not saying that my way is the best way. I'm just trying to point out how we would have handled the situation if it had been us, so that people will know what to expect at our regional.

TNB
2005.05.10, 06:02 PM
And I'm not saying that my way is the best way. I'm just trying to point out how we would have handled the situation if it had been us, so that people will know what to expect at our regional.
Someone will probably claim that they didn't read your posts, aren't a member of the board, or didn't even read the entry form. And even if there is a sign going into the race area with all the rules posted, I can hear it now, "What sign?" That must be one reason one of my friends is sending his children overseas for schooling.

Tubaboy
2005.05.10, 06:03 PM
What does this mean? If I threw a hissy fit, I could run a race all by myself? Since Dustin hasn't responded to my earlier questions, I've thought of another question since you brought up a special race--Dustin, did you have the option to compete in the other classes without the use of traction compound after DQ'd in the F1 class?


It means that Columbus is probably getting a PN Racing. Mike had the contract from them, but had a couple of questions before he wanted to move forward, this was the weekend of the Rialto race I think. Nothing bad about it.

PB

Dustin
2005.05.10, 06:03 PM
TNB regaurding why i could not see that I was the only one using traction compound there for it was wrong.

1. I having raced 1/10 scale thought it was a 1/10 thing. Not to play down to mini z racers but they are not near to the same compition level of 1/10. No one makes mini z traction compound. But there is stuff that is made just for 1/10 and 1/12 cars. If you have not raced 1/10 how would you know what tire additives are or what they do. I have thought for some time that since I race 1/10 and there is dope there that is why I dope zs. I thought is was just a thing I carryed over from my 1/10. Since I dought there were many people who race zs and 1/10 where there is additive is common, I did not consider it abnormal that i used traction additive and no one else did.

2. However I am sure that there was some at this event who knew what traction compound was. If anyone knowes traction additive you know you do not put it on 30 sec before a race. I figure if ther is one useing he had done it in the pits. I racing 4 classes did not have time to apply. I ran my warm up laps and figured better put it on late than never at all. Again the problum is that i need to ask every one at the event the rules. No they should have been posted.

3. PS. my traction additives contain no wintergreen. I make my own as i have not have found one additive that I like how it performs and the resolts that it leaves one my tire.

ruknd@aol.com
2005.05.10, 06:03 PM
I prefer to use gravy to sauce :rolleyes:

Dustin
2005.05.10, 06:10 PM
I prefer to use gravy to sauce :rolleyes:

Ruknd, racing in Long Island you must know James Slick. He and I have raced against each other numerous times for years. He is a great driver.

TNB
2005.05.10, 06:17 PM
However I am sure that there was some at this event who knew what traction compound was. If anyone knowes traction additive you know you do not put it on 30 sec before a race. I figure if ther is one useing he had done it in the pits.
So did you see anyone else using traction compound?
Did you point them out to the racing officials after you were confronted?
So, basically you were using traction compound both on the Driver's Stand and in the pits?
The issue was traction compound, which per Dustin he was using ON THE DRIVER STAND. He wasn't the one hiding anything, they were.

Dustin
2005.05.10, 06:20 PM
Actually, South Shore Hobby's is not too far from me...not my local track but about 45 minutes away. It's a 1:10 place and doesn't even sell a single mini-z part. Locally, we don't care for the owner and choose not to frequent his track. Many of the racers there do come to our track, and are always welcome :D . Hence teh reason I chose not to go. Had it been at bigD's or HKS stayed open for it I'd be there (though not sure how we all would have fit at HKS :p ). That being said, it was pretty clear to me...an outsider, that compound was clearly not allowed...printed rule argument aside.

As for litigation...this is one thing that aggrivates the cr*P out of me. What has our pitiful society become that we threaten to sue over driving little toy cars around a foam track? FYI...I'd love to speak to any attorney that would represent you on such a frivilous lawsuit and tell him what a hack lawyer he is. A) for wasing the court's time, B) for wasting tax payers resources, and c) wasting you $$$ and makign you believe you actually have legal recourse.

GROW UP PEOPLE, LIGHTEN UP, AND HAVE FUN...THIS IS A HOBBY.

That aside...will I be seeing any of you Ohio people at CRCRC in the fall?


In regard to this post I did not sue them. I merely considered it and consulted an attorney. It is not because I did not win. I was not going to sue PN for burning myself on one of their motors. I was just considering my options. I was falsely called a cheater and wrongfully DQed. Since I did not commit this act then this was defamation of character. I had trouble with 2 of my sponsors regarding this. I understand why they would consider dropping me, I would not want a cheater representing me either. But the fact is I am not and PN wrongfully portrayed me as such.

TITANIUM
2005.05.10, 06:28 PM
1. I having raced 1/10 scale thought it was a 1/10 thing. Not to play down to mini z racers but they are not near to the same compition level of 1/10. .

ya I know what you mean...I got tired of 10th scale because it was much easier...
and also the dumba$$ ratio is much lower in mini-z....at a mini-z event you find one maybe two, as compared to a 10th scale event where the dumba$$'s come in multitudes.

TNB
2005.05.10, 06:35 PM
ya I know what you mean...I got tired of 10th scale because it was much easier...
and also the dumba$$ ratio is much lower in mini-z....at a mini-z event you find one maybe two, as compared to a 10th scale event where the dumba$$'s come in multitudes.
Well I got my laugh for the day. :D

ruf
2005.05.10, 06:39 PM
I was falsely called a cheater and wrongfully DQed. Since I did not commit this act then this was defamation of character. I had trouble with 2 of my sponsors regarding this. I understand why they would consider dropping me, I would not want a cheater representing me either. But the fact is I am not and PN wrongfully portrayed me as such.From other accounts that I have heard, no one ever came out and called you a cheater. And I think a lot of people will agree that you weren't WRONGFULLY DQ'ed. Again, I feel for you, and the results burned you bad, but "stuff" happens.

As for the sponsor trouble, I should have that remedied by tomorrow. PN will be issuing you a signed letter stating that you were not intentionally cheating and that you were disqualified as the result of a misunderstanding of the rules and regulations.

docsavage
2005.05.10, 11:31 PM
This topic is closed fellas.

The track in Houston looks really cool. Love the banked hairpins.

Elevation changes would be really cool. As long as they are drivable. The lump in the track last week was just friggin retarded.

Anyone got any hints on ways to tighten up the front end of the 02? My tires seem to be wearing only on the outside edge to center. I need some tips BESIDES adding more parts, I run in stock, and you can't change springs, or knuckles, tie rods etc. I think the steel kingpins are illegal too.

We run bearings, and have a free hand with tires, and wheels.

Dreaming of dirt ovals. Late model bodies, in 1/10th scale. Ahhhhhhhhhhh.

docsavage
2005.05.10, 11:35 PM
We got you what you wanted most.

Excellent that Pn is stepping up. At least a little, it's better than nothing.

Much better than I personally had hoped for, thank you Mr. Ng.

I guess I might leave my Ben Hur wheels at home if the PN event comes here.

Cheers!

ruf
2005.05.10, 11:44 PM
This topic is closed fellas.

The track in Houston looks really cool. Love the banked hairpins.

Elevation changes would be really cool. As long as they are drivable. The lump in the track last week was just friggin retarded.

Anyone got any hints on ways to tighten up the front end of the 02? My tires seem to be wearing only on the outside edge to center. I need some tips BESIDES adding more parts, I run in stock, and you can't change springs, or knuckles, tie rods etc. I think the steel kingpins are illegal too.

We run bearings, and have a free hand with tires, and wheels.

Dreaming of dirt ovals. Late model bodies, in 1/10th scale. Ahhhhhhhhhhh.Thanks for the compliments. I will pass them on to the track owners that set up the layout at Mobility Plus. The elevation changes are fine tuned for the first few hours of the day to get the transitions smooth. At first, I hated them due to my experience in racing 1/10 onroad where bumps are the devil.

As for counteracting coning on your front tire wear, you're kind of screwed unless you can adjust camber. If you are forced to run the stock kingpins, take some fine grit sandpaper to them and polish them up. It really makes a difference and they are almost as good as stainless after this treatment. I don't know exactly what your rules are, but could you slot the upper kingpin hole inward and then superglue the outside slop to add negative camber? This might be totally illegal, so I'd run it by your race director before you ruin a perfectly good chassis! :rolleyes: Or maybe heat up the stock steering knuckle and bend some camber into the plastic where the axle is mounted? Again, might be illegal so check first!

Tubaboy
2005.05.11, 10:13 AM
This topic is closed fellas.

The track in Houston looks really cool. Love the banked hairpins.

Elevation changes would be really cool. As long as they are drivable. The lump in the track last week was just friggin retarded.

Anyone got any hints on ways to tighten up the front end of the 02? My tires seem to be wearing only on the outside edge to center. I need some tips BESIDES adding more parts, I run in stock, and you can't change springs, or knuckles, tie rods etc. I think the steel kingpins are illegal too.

We run bearings, and have a free hand with tires, and wheels.

Dreaming of dirt ovals. Late model bodies, in 1/10th scale. Ahhhhhhhhhhh.

Doc, In the PN Race you can modify the kingpins, turnbuckles, tierods, etc. I would suggest that the place you race at, at least try to match the standard Stock Racing rules of the Competion races out there (whether it be Kyosho or PN...). Otherwise, when you attend one of these events, you'll get blown away by people who have their cars better tuned.

As for wear, I would suggest 1 degree Camber turnbuckles. It should make them wear more evenly, plus give you more turning power.

ruf
2005.05.11, 10:47 AM
We actually have a cost-control class similar to this at our track. It's a great way to get new people into the hobby. If someone was to compete at a larger open rules event, then of course they would want to hop-up their car accordingly.

As for the degree, I've found that 2-2.5 degrees gives you perfectly flat tire wear depending on how much roll you have in the car. 1 degree works well, but it still cones a little.

Tubaboy
2005.05.11, 12:50 PM
Yeah, 2' just gave me way to much turning for my taste. The rear of the car would slip out on me when I used that much camber. Although that was when I had my GPM diff on the car, and that thing was crap, so it could have been just a tuning issue.

PN diff balls are to big imo for this scale of a car.

ruf
2005.05.11, 01:22 PM
I agree that 1/8" ball in this scale is huge. That's why I use HCCA balls. Much cheaper than ceramic and lighter too. Just don't have the durability of ceramic but still more than regular steel. I've been doing diff rebuilds for people at the track for $10 including HCCA balls. They seem to be pretty happy with the results. I'm also selling a re-worked PN/3Racing diff that works just as good as the stock Kyosho. Still don't know if I'm going to bring my "ultimate" diff to market. Probably no one will spend that kind of money on Mini-Z. I guess I could put it up on the site and just build them as ppl order.

I've only used 2-3 degree camber with foam tires, so there is much more rear traction. Check out our setups on the website. I'll probably update the MR02 setups after this next weekend's race.

docsavage
2005.05.15, 10:08 PM
Mike is rather strict about mods in stock class.

CF H plates are allowed.

Freehand on tires and wheels.

Ball diffs are allowed.

Ball bearings are allowed.

That's it no other mods, with stock motors.

No suspension upgrades of any kind are allowed, outside of H plates.

Thanks for the tips on maybe tweaking a little on the suspension.

Mr Chen, could you maybe email me some more specific directions for tweaking the knuckles? And for slotting also?

Will have to run that by Mike. I need a little something else for the next series, I'm tired of the car being so dang skitish.

I turned (with a small lathe)some grooves into some worn out tires, and into the stock (hard as rock tires) this weekend. Will give them a whirl with some traction compound for the next practice. The stock tires with grooves cut into them seem to soften up alot. I turned them, and rounded the sidewalls a bit too. See what happens.

Yeah I guess the PN race will be really exspensive. As far as upgrades go. IF we even get the race.

Later!

ruknd@aol.com
2005.05.16, 10:59 AM
Ruknd, racing in Long Island you must know James Slick. He and I have raced against each other numerous times for years. He is a great driver.
schlick is one of the fastest drivers at our track...good guy too.

docsavage
2005.05.28, 01:34 PM
I am happy, and proud to announce that I've talked my dad into racing with me and JB in the enduro. Around 1974 Frog American was founded here in Columbus, Ohio. It began with my dad racing 2 stroke go-karts at Harrisburg Speedway, and all around the region, I think he raced at Nelson Ledges one year too. He was awesome, and has a pile of trophies to prove it. The early 80's were a dead zone for FART, until we discovered R/C racing (which cost just as much as running karts in the 70's). We had mixed results in 12th scale, but yours truly brought home the only major win at the ROAR NATS in '86. Dad also won the A main at Lake Whipoorwill in FLA (high banked oval).

More kart racing this time all three of us (mom too) raced 4 stroke karts. Dad was awesome (he's built a little smaller than me). Mom had some good outings too. My experience was less than stellar (they both got brand spankin new go-karts, while I was stuck racing a chromoly pig from the 70's). Although I did have several poles at Sycamore Speedway (near Marion) I love racing on dirt ovals. Enduros at Mid-Ohio (what a blast), and then came Bush 41. Pay cuts, and so on.

In the early 90's a few summers of running 10th scale dirt ovals (some races for money), and then a lull in the action until last year. HAd to talk like the devil to get dad to agree to race in this enduro. Says he has enough hobbies already! We'll see.

The enduro should be interesting, to say the least. 2Hours, Minimum 2 driver teams. Open suspension mods, open motors, nimh batts. We'll see I guess. Not hopng for a win, as everyone but Dustin is only racing for second place. BUT, this is a different story, alot can happen in two hours, luck is certainly a factor. Maybe time will be the equalizer. I plan on running the stage 2 radio shack motors, no fets. I can run with any of the mod cars with these motors (on the straights). Plus I have a pile of them. And at 3.95$ a piece I can afford to burn them up all day long.

Doc

Frog American Racing Team.