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mailboxck
2008.01.02, 12:51 AM
I just recently ordered two Firelap 2.0 McLarens from ToyEast for Christmas. It was due to arrive on the 26th of December 2007, but it only got here on the 2nd of January 2008 due to the Christmas rush. Everything that I ordered arrived, however, one of the Firelap boxes had a small dent in it due to shipment. But none of which are ToyEast's fault.

Review of the Firelap 2.0

The Firelap McLarens were packaged well. What's included in the package are:
Firelap 2.0 chassis
McLaren body
AFM2 Transmitter
Instruction Manual
Parts Bag

The looked pretty good and as a previous owner of a Kyosho MR02, the Firelap stands up to the nearest competition. However, the plastic parts are not as well molded as Kyosho, but I'm not complaining for the price. As promised by Fangel from Firelap/Iwaver, the new chassis did come in a dark plastic color instead of the previously released light gray chassis. Because of this I am sure that what I got is the new Firelap 2.0. What I cannot confirm as of now is the durability of the chassis as I have not yet played with my Firelap as I am writing you this article. But one thing I definitely noticed is that the Firelap now has a servo saver. It was pointed out before that the old Firelap chassis didn't have a servo saver and merely have a plastic gear which looked liked one, but didn't serve a purpose. Now I can proudly say that the new Firelap does have a functioning servo saver.

Review to be continued...

kazuyalee
2008.01.02, 01:43 AM
Thats great! Im thinking of buying one myself because it is compatible with Mini-Z parts etc and is so much cheaper and still seems like a quality car. Can't wait for the review :)

Hope it comes out great!

mailboxck
2008.01.02, 03:28 AM
Continuation...

http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d85/mailboxck/Body.jpg

The McLaren body looked nice, but there were some imperfections here and there. Iím not complaining as the imperfections were small enough to ignore. Everything looked fine until I mounted the body on the chassis. Once again, the body sits a bit too high on the chassis that made it have a silly stance. I was expecting Firelap to do something about this but a little modification should solve this problem.

http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d85/mailboxck/Side.jpg

http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d85/mailboxck/Chassis.jpg
The chassis looked good. Itís very well made compared to the previous version of this car. The plastic parts snapped perfectly in to place without a hitch. The only problem I saw with the car is that the gear differential felt a bit too tight. But this could be a good thing if youíre racing on a slippery surface. Because I drove the car stock, it didnít have bearings which made me feel a little bit of torque steer. But yet again, you can always remedy this by buying a set of ball bearings which I believe is a must for all racers. The suspension worked flawlessly. The rear h-plate looked a bit flimsy, but it does the job for now. It was a surprise to see the front suspension working so well. The king pins were not that smooth but smooth enough not to bind, a great plus for the new Firelap 2.0. The only weird thing I noticed that my yellow McLaren came with black front springs, but the silver one came with green springs. I donít really know if thereís a difference in spring rate or if itís just aesthetics. Everything looked well for the new Firelap 2.0, until I decided to install batteries. My 700mah AAA Sanyo batteries fit in well, but I couldnít say the same for my taller 900mah AAA Sanyo batteries. I wouldnít call it a snug fit as I could see the plastic flexing just to accommodate the taller batteries. But a quick fix for this is by trimming or bending the battery terminals on the chassis. Overall, Iíd say that Firelap got the car right this time, but some things can still be improved on here and there.

http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d85/mailboxck/Top.jpg
http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d85/mailboxck/Bottom.jpg

The kit includes an AFM2 transmitter. I have previously purchased an AFM2 radio set a couple of months ago and I see some improvements from the one I got in my Firelap. The new one felt a bit more solid and the throttle and steering controls were better. Since the car does not include a brake function, the ABS capability of the transmitter should come in handy. Itís not that big to be jumping for joy but I sure do appreciate Firelap for continuously improving their product.

http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d85/mailboxck/Parts.jpg

In the parts bag, you get as assortment of spare parts and some option parts. Hereís whatís inside:

3 Pinion gears (8T, 9T and 10T)
Motor mount spacers to adjust the gear mesh
Extra wheel nuts
Extra king pin c-clips
2 extra front tie rods (just not sure if theyíre different in toe set up)
An extra motor mount to change it from an MM to an RM
H-plate for the RM set up
Gear cover
Antenna
Pinion gear remover
Wheel nut wrench

Overall, Firelap has given a solid deal. I cannot say that the car's solid, but they were able give us a pretty good car for an affordable price. I am happy to see the improvements they have made over the previous car. It's a fun toy which can be turned into a racer which can only give you lots of fun.

http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d85/mailboxck/Kit.jpg

Red Team
2008.01.02, 04:18 AM
Thanks for such a precise review....that's what I was waiting for before buying one of the Firelap models.

mailboxck
2008.01.02, 05:00 AM
You're very welcome.

My question for Fangel is, will the I sport motor work for a stock Firelap 2.0?

Is the I stock motor really like an x speed motor?

alien.46.uk
2008.01.02, 02:55 PM
I don't think you have the body sitting right ... I had the very first firelap 2.0's before any of the updates ...

I also had the Mc'Laren F1 body and it sat down fine, it didn't stick up at the top like that.

mailboxck
2008.01.02, 07:04 PM
Well, believe it or not, I installed the body properly and that's how it looked. I actually got two and both sat up that high. I read somewhere that the reason for this was that the iwaver/firelap chassis were lower that's why the body stick up that high. Is this true?

mailboxck
2008.01.02, 10:28 PM
Another question for fangel, does Firelap offer replacement parts such as the chassis, motor mount etc? I can't seem to find them on toy east. Plus, will you release a graphite or carbon fiber h-plate? Because I dont think that the plastic will last long

mailboxck
2008.01.02, 11:10 PM
With a fresh set of batteries, I drove the car this morning. Since we have marble floors, i could only use up to around 20% of the throttle around our livingroom or else risk hitting something or spinning the car around. There was indeed a lot of torque steer but a ball diff and bearings should solve that problem. The car handled ok, even better if you remove the mono shock at the back.

But as I checked the manual, I was disappointed about some things that they didn't include in the box but labeled them on the manual:

1. Rear shock and spring for the RM set up
2. Front and rear springs with different stiffness

And while driving, I tried out the ABS on the transmitter. I found out that the ABS was useless. It removed reversed and what it did was put the car in reverse for a short blip when you let go of the throttle. I don't know if this is my fault or not but I was happy to drive it without ABS

mailboxck
2008.01.03, 07:10 AM
Since the Firelap came in MM, I tried the hardware included to turn it into an RM

By following Kyosho's example. We can see that it almost useless to run this configuration as the "shock mount" (looks like a T from above) on the motor mount hits the plastic part that's between the motor terminals.

http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d85/mailboxck/IMG_3310.jpg
http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d85/mailboxck/IMG_3309.jpg

But, after inspecting the Firelap's manual, I see that they have a different approach of mounting the shock. The plastic part between the motor terminals (different from kyosho) is actually their shock mount for the RM configuration. And an additional mounting point was on the motor mount. And the T shock mount is removed. Here it is:

http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d85/mailboxck/IMG_3312.jpg
http://i33.photobucket.com/albums/d85/mailboxck/IMG_3311.jpg

So as you can see, the Firelap looks ok in RM configuration but different from Kyosho's approach.

hrdrvr
2008.01.03, 07:36 AM
The ABS is worthless on a car without a brake function.

Good review. I hope you continue to document your steps. I got frustrated with mine and quit using it. My review went downhill, and I gave up on the car. Ive got enough Zs to drive, and stopped wasting my time with this one. It was a LOT slower than any Z. I put an ATM stock R motor, which is uber fast in other cars, and I couldnt keep up with a stock 02 on the straights.

I got one of the older grey FLs last year around Feb for my birthday. The Tx was awesome but only lasted about 5 months before the steering wheel started getting really hard to turn. A few months ago two of my friends and I bought the new versions all at the same time. I wanted a replacement Tx, and those guys wanted something better than the stock Tx, that they could run multiple cars off of. Well, long story short, none of the three Txs have ever worked correctly. On one model they work fine, but on the other 9 the wheels will only turn right, not matter which way you turn the wheel. Also, on mine the first model wont go into reverse. I know how to use the Tx, and have all the settings right. I tried a master reset on all three, but none of the problems were resolved. I wil say that fangel offered to help me out with mine. Once I found out that the other guys had the same issues (3 of 3) I wasnt sure if getting a replacement would be worth anything more than a waste of shipping fees for toye@st. The other two guys only run two cars, so they are fine readjusting the first model to run both of their cars. Ive got 7 or 8 cars, so I asked Santa for a Helios this year, and he brought me one :D

I found the same problems with mounting, but believe its the body, and not the chassis. All three of ours sat like yours does, and sat the same way on my old FL chassis. The old one had the same problem. Its nothing that cant be fixed with remounting the side mounts, and/or some well placed shims :D

new version
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v618/freekfornature/RCs/Firelap/2007-09-13071.jpg

old version before mods
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v618/freekfornature/RCs/Firelap/P1170038_PB.jpg

and after some slight modifications
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v618/freekfornature/RCs/Firelap/P1210003_PB.jpg

Here is a link to my PB gallery hosting all the pics that I was going to use when I did a review. There are also older pics from the first FL I bought and kind of reviewed. The old thread is floating around here somewhere.

http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v618/freekfornature/RCs/Firelap/?start=0


Im not sure if toyeast carries the replacement parts you are looking for, but Kyosho parts are a direct fit (one of the huge advantages to this chassis), and are readily available in the states.

In my kit I had all the parts to switch to RM from the MM set up. There are some mounts that go onto the RM pod that allow you to use the same shock/spring from the MM set up, so you should be good to go on that one.

I had one of the old Iwaivers, and it came wiht a few different grades of springs. I was kind of dissapointed when my first FL didnt come with them aswell, but for the $$$ I really couldnt complain about the extras that came with the box set.

Good luck, and agin continue to document this as you use it.

Oh yeah, Ive got a question; will you be racing this at any point? or is it going to be an "around the house beater" :D ?

mailboxck
2008.01.03, 07:59 AM
Thanks for the compliments.

Fortunately for me, the two cars I got were ok. Steering, throttle etc. But these cars are not technically mine. One is sold and the other one I am still selling. I do have another one coming soon for myself. As of now, they will be a living room racer but there are talks of opening up a shop within the year.

Yep, it's the bodies fault and not the chassis. Thanks for the tip!

fangel
2008.01.03, 09:06 PM
I actually replied yesterday, but the post disappear! (V.V) Anyway let me replied to them one by one.

Let me start off by saying, Thanks for the great review!
The Spring color issue was actually the factory once decided to shipped with color spring which is the same as the black one, but we had warn the factory afterward to pack according to spec. So this has been fixed and future product would be shipped as black.

The Steering issue that you had could be easily fixed with Ball Bearing and Differential upgrades. Also the battery has always been an issue for not this product but all the other product out there, but it could be easily fixed with just some pushing or pulling on the metal contact.

I'm glad that your TX feels more solid, since we did warn the factory to assemble it more carefully and make sure the parts are not just thrown together.

NR2 stock will run with i-plus motor with ease. The i-stock motor is similar to the original X-speed motor.

We currently don't have all the original parts in our store since most of the parts has been put into production and not in spare parts.

The ABS function is kinda useless for me too, basically you could do better controlling the throttle with your own skilled finger. But ABS should serve beginner well.

As for the body issue, I think I have to agree with Hrdvr. I believe it is the body itself causing the problem, I'll reflect that to the factory to get it fixed for next production. In the mean time I guess you would have to fix it by remove and re-gluing the side body mount.

Thanks for the review again, and I would like to point out that the Firelap NanoRacer 2.0 has greatly improve on quality and performance. For the price, it is a great deal for both introductory product and for skilled racer.

mailboxck
2008.01.03, 09:48 PM
Wow! Thanks for the speedy reply fangel. This is why I like iwaver and firelap. Yep, I believe the steering issue will be fixed with bearings and a ball diff. I have both, just didn't install them yet.

mailboxck
2008.01.03, 11:08 PM
I just installed a ball bearing kit. It fitted well, but I had to dremel the rear motor mount a bit to fit one of the bearings properly. This is certainly a bad thing for a beginner. But hey, now it fits ok.

After upgrading to ball bearings, the car felt a lot better. It handled like it was a whole new car. It did have torque steer but it's more controllable now. And on a marble floor, I could actually do "controlled" drifts. Well, I can only do a 90deg turn while drifting and it's not always good. But still, I can drift!

fangel
2008.01.04, 01:33 AM
Thanks for the update, what was the problem with the rear motor mount that is causing a trouble with bearing installation? I had never encounter this.

The traction and power ratio on a smooth marble floor is very delicate, it's actually fair hard to have the chassis setup properly to have "Fully controllable" drifts on it. Hey! It might be just me, I'm a beginner, what do I know.

mailboxck
2008.01.04, 08:07 AM
Well, the right side (differential side) fits well, but the left side won't fit in. Even if I put pressure or hammer it with my screw driver, it wont fit. But I dremeled it so now it's ok.

I also put in foam tires on the back and stock tires in the front and now driving it is a blast! Still on marble floors of course. It became even better when I installed the Iwaver I-plus motor. It's certainly quicker, but also less torque. I can drive the car better because with less torque, I can accelerate harder without spinning the car out. This is a fun car. More fun than my old MR02. Well, I can't say that it's because this car is better, it could also be because I now have more experience in rc that's why I'm having more fun.

mailboxck
2008.01.04, 10:10 AM
I took the car apart today. One thing I did was re-adjust the battery terminals so it would fit my 700mah and 900mah properly. As I installed the I-plus motor, I noticed that Iwaver put the wires wrong. So now I screw in the red wire to the (-) and the black wire to the (+).

When checking the PCB, I saw that the fets were on top of the board and not the bottom. This is can be good or bad. It's bad because you don't have a place to stack fets. Good because you can see it easier.

mailboxck
2008.01.06, 07:43 AM
Another question, what is the stock motor that's included in the kit? Is it the I-stock motor or another type of slower motor?

fangel
2008.01.06, 08:13 PM
The bearing issue is kinda strange, never heard of this before, but I guess it's is a simple fix since it's only plastic.
I believe that the build quality and the on par performance really does help to make the driving experience enjoyable. Of course your advancement in RC also helps a great deal, since you can now do what you want to do and your only restriction is the chassis performance and not yourself.

I did noticed that battery wire color things before, but I guess the factory never took the matter seriously since it's not a performance and quality issue.

As for the FET, I guess you are right about the stacking, but then you could cool the FET much better since it is on top and you could install a heat sink or have holes cuts out in the body to allow better ventilation.

The motor that came with the Kit is an i-stock equivalent motor, it's different from i-stock because of the chrome casing and the thickness in wire. It's basically the same in both performance and quality wise since it is from the same supplier.

mailboxck
2008.01.06, 09:11 PM
I tried to install the 9T pinion today. It was hard. I had to download the kyosho manual to understand. Because the Firelap didn't mold into the plastic which motor space is used for which configuration, I had to do some guess work.

Basically I had to compare the 6 parts and find out a way which is which. Honestly, I think that the original set up included in the kit is wrong, that is why the gear mesh is not so nice.

You have to check all the 6 parts against each other. For the 9T, what you want is for the motor to be as far away from the diff as possible, and vice versa for the 6T.

mailboxck
2008.01.06, 09:41 PM
Testing all of the pinions now...

6T (original) was pretty good...good gear mesh
7T...the gear did not mesh at all and the pinion was hard to install (I think i should use the 6T spacers for this instead of the 7T like Kyosho
8T the gear mesh was just perfect...i love it
9T the gear mesh was a big tight, if you stop at the wrong place, you have to give the car a little nudge to get it back running or else the motor does not have enough torque to run the car, but give it a bit more time and it would run ok too

fangel
2008.01.07, 04:54 AM
hum...interesting...
many interesting information and insight.
I have not heard of this before, I guess it is the plastic molding issue.
Since I had personally tried each of the pinions before and they all works very well.
I guess the problem with 7T is quite unique, I'll look into that when I find the time.
I guess the 9T is fairly normal, just that with a weaker motor it will becomes a problem.

mailboxck
2008.01.07, 08:02 AM
Well, if you want I can re-try them when I have the time and include pictures aswell. See, I can be a product analyst for Firelap :D Are you hiring ;)

mailboxck
2008.01.07, 10:21 PM
Well, I was playing with my Firelap around the house this morning with my i-plus motor with 8T pinion. I was only using half throttle as I dont have enough grip with marble floors. Then suddenly, the car stopped. I tried to make it go into reverse but it wouldnt budge. I picked it up, checked the wires, put it back down and tried to give it throttle, still no response...until...

I smelled smoke! I had reverse, but no forward and I knew it! The smell of smoke was terrible. I quickly took the car apart and checked. Yes, one of my FETs is burned. You can even see that it has a small bump on it. I already feared using the the i-plus motor. But I guess it was ok when I used it with the 6T pinion, but now I switched to 8T, the load on the motor was bigger.

This is really a bummer, what I would do for now is switch the two fets so at least I can run the car forward. I still have to find where I could buy fets.

fangel
2008.01.07, 11:52 PM
thats really terrible, I'm really sorry that this had happen.
I had a great time using the i-plus motor, but never ran into trouble with it in many different pinion gear. (I never tried all of them, and don't remember which one I did tried)

I would have to agree with you on the reasons, I guess it must have been a few things combine, half throttle + 8T + i-plus means the mysterious smoke will appear. Even though it happen to you, I would believe this is a unique case on it's own.

As for store where you could buy FETs, they sell it here at TinyRC.
http://shop.tinyrc.com/home.php?cat=411

kazuyalee
2008.01.08, 05:34 AM
Hello fangel and mailboxck. I've been watching this threat for a while now and I was just wondering, can't you just install a normal mos-fet that is being used in consumer electronics? :confused:

mailboxck
2008.01.08, 08:07 AM
Normal mosfet? These are normal mosfets, just that they're kinda hard to come by and you wont be able to buy them in your regular electronics supply store.

mailboxck
2008.01.08, 09:03 AM
Yep, I think my case is unique. But still, after running the car on the I-plus motor with 6T, the motor terminals do get hot. I guess driving the car at half throttle made it worse.

Anyway, as a quick fix, I swapped the motor terminals and reversed the throttle on the transmitter. So now, I use the undamaged reverse FET to make the car run forward.

Which FET do you think I should buy? The 4562DY looks ok?

hrdrvr
2008.01.08, 09:50 AM
The 4562s are good FETs. If you ever plan on running the car in any official events, you may want to think about 3010s to keep them legal for stock competetions. The 4562s are more powerful though, and the most common on mod cars IMO.

mailboxck
2008.01.08, 09:56 AM
The 4562s are good FETs. If you ever plan on running the car in any official events, you may want to think about 3010s to keep them legal for stock competetions. The 4562s are more powerful though, and the most common on mod cars IMO.

Wow! Thanks a plenty. But how to i mount the FETs. There is a p and an n channel FET I believe. How can I tell the difference?

mailboxck
2008.01.10, 11:21 PM
I just received another 2 Firelap Nanoracers. I got two Enzos. (I sell these cars, so don't think that I'm just a spoiled kid who buys so many toys)

After inspection and testing, I give both the cars an ok! The throttle and steering worked properly and the transmitters was good. The Enzo bodies were also ok but one of the Enzo's did have a little black streak at the front (can be removed with rubbing compound).

Other things I ordered:

Ball Differential
3Racing Aluminum Knuckles
Iwaver Aluminum Wheel Nuts
Iwaver Front Spring Set
Iwaver Rear Main Spring Set
Iwaver I-stock Motor
Iwaver Aluminum Damping Set

All of these things are for sale so I don't bother opening them up except for some things.

Aluminum Wheel Nuts
- These things are useful by replacing the original plastic nuts. They do not only give your car a nicer look but they also serve a purpose. The front goes in as normal, and so does the left rear wheel. But for the right rear wheel, I discovered something different. If you tighten the nut all the way through, it locks the GEAR DIFF. If you loosen it, it will also loosen the diff. So this "defect" could actually help the car. I can now use the right rear wheel nut to adjust the differential. But I don't think it will work for the ball diff.

Aluminum Damping Set
- This is damping set where you put in two small dampers at the side of the motor pod. It's all made of aluminum and is machined properly. Although in the picture from Toyeast, you install it in a RM set up, I believe you can also use it for a MM set up. However, one of the damper shafts I received was not threaded, so there's no way I can install this part on my car as of now. I'm still waiting for ToyEast's reply on what they can do about it. This is a quality control issue for Iwaver. The parts were properly machined, but you need to supply some of the mounting screws on your own as the kit does not supply all the screws needed for installation.

fangel
2008.01.11, 12:04 AM
I wish I could help with this, but I'm really not an experience modder.
I hope people see this post and could help you out.

mailboxck
2008.01.11, 12:27 AM
http://images.mailboxck.multiply.com/image/5/photos/57/500x500/11/IMG_3379.JPG?et=Pi3d0BLCHrWuoOwyisYkuA&nmid=75550470
The white Ferrari Enzo. As you can see, the body height problem is not so bad with the Enzo

http://images.mailboxck.multiply.com/image/5/photos/57/500x500/12/IMG_3381.JPG?et=oE0G7p7q9MNpZVOpOFPbfQ&nmid=75550470
http://images.mailboxck.multiply.com/image/5/photos/57/500x500/13/IMG_3382.JPG?et=TYtsq0EQHD07HarZZlTC2Q&nmid=75550470
http://images.mailboxck.multiply.com/image/5/photos/57/500x500/14/IMG_3384.JPG?et=XwofgMyoNr5tAwcKyEmNvw&nmid=75550470


Shots of both cars
http://images.mailboxck.multiply.com/image/3/photos/57/500x500/15/IMG_3392.JPG?et=OinZ%2BTbw4ggehfghsUBkSQ&nmid=75550470
http://images.mailboxck.multiply.com/image/3/photos/57/500x500/16/IMG_3397.JPG?et=cHxxVtrEkWUKewsWKhVQvA&nmid=75550470

Pics of all the cars I'm selling (yellow McLaren is mine)
http://images.mailboxck.multiply.com/image/3/photos/57/500x500/17/IMG_3400.JPG?et=4VqZ%2C33kEWlOMo7waKClAg&nmid=75550470

fangel
2008.01.11, 04:24 AM
kinda cool, but I the ride height issue is really a problem.
I'll reflect this to the factory, this should be fixed for sure.

mailboxck
2008.01.11, 04:53 AM
Actually, when running, you won't notice it. But yes, it can be improved as it's only a minor change for the factory.

hrdrvr
2008.01.11, 08:03 AM
The ride height is an issue for me. Ive had to modify every body that Ive purchased by Iwaiver/Firelap. You may not notice the look on the track, but once you start racing it, and every tenth counts, youll notice. A lower ride height really helps corner speed. The faster your car is, the more important this becomes.

As far as the diff tightening, are you talking about the stock diff? I didnt think they were adjustable. It could be you are just causing some binding and not tightening it for real. I guess you should be able to tell the differnce though, as it really seems like you know what you are doing :D I know some of the older ball diff designs were set up to adjust with the wheel nut. I think one (maybe more?) manufacturer is still producing this style, but most have gone away from it.

Have you tried using all the model memories on the Txs you have? This was my issue with the FLs I bought. Ill mention again that fangel was more than willing to help me out with the issues I had.

mailboxck
2008.01.11, 08:32 AM
Now I used the ball diff. Finally! The car handles amazingly well! I can have better adjustments here.

Well, I used 2 of the model memories with no problem. Why? What happens if you use all 10?

hrdrvr
2008.01.11, 12:00 PM
Ball diffs are the second best tuning hop-up IMO, next to tires. Of course bearings are a must too, but the diff is definatly an important buy.

About the radios; We bought three all at one time. The first model setting worked fine on all of them. The other 9 would only turn right, no matter which way you turned the wheel. I had a couple that wouldnt go into reverse as well. This happened on all three of them. The other two guys only have 2 cars each, so they arent worried about it. I wanted to run all of my AM RCs, so I ended up having to get something else. It must have just been a bad batch, as it seems no one else has experienced those same problems.

mailboxck
2008.01.11, 07:24 PM
Yep, must be a bad batch.

Yes, ball diffs are a must. But how about aluminum front uprights/knuckle arms? I heard that the plastic break easily?

mailboxck
2008.01.12, 09:27 AM
As you all know, one of my FETs is blown. This means that I do not have reverse. The thing is, without reverse, now I have brake! When I move the throttle to full reverse, the car breaks. I did a lot of tests today and found out that it did brake. Funny. :D

fangel
2008.01.13, 09:26 PM
The TX issue with Hrdrv should really be a bad batch, since we had not heard any more complain about this, and as I have said before.
Bearing, Ball Diff are really the must have, tires are also very essential because it provide the flexibility that you might want on the track.
In reality the break always worked, just that it's kinda hard to noticed it, since once you slam on the brake (reverse) your car kinda jerks and jump backward, now that the reverse is gone, all there is left is the e-brake that is programmed into the TX.

hrdrvr
2008.01.14, 12:27 PM
One of the guys that bought FLs with me brought his to the track friday. He removed the FETs and put on a single stack of 4562s. His car was aweseme. It did have a custom FET safe hand wound Flashsp-2 motor in it though :D

mailboxck
2008.01.14, 07:29 PM
Wow! Makes me want to buy a 4562 FET even more. Do you know how to mount them or know a guide how to?

fangel
2008.01.14, 07:35 PM
it all sounds so temping, I want to learn how to do FET modding...
Could someone give us a guild for the dummy? (just talking about me on this...)

hrdrvr
2008.01.15, 07:06 AM
Of course this guy is BA, and you shouldnt expect to get it this easily your first time :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rKzQXmRh6Og

There are also tons of thread floating around the board. Everything you need to know about FETs is right here on MZR.

Here is an awesome thread to start with.
http://minizracer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=10419&highlight=fet+installation

greekone
2008.01.15, 02:21 PM
He makes it seem so easy.

fangel
2008.01.15, 08:18 PM
the video makes it looks so easy, I know removing it is easy, but I saw the guy only solder one side of the by each individual "legs" (connector? I know I'm n00b, please correct me) and the other side for the whole side as one.

Wouldn't this cause short circuits between the legs? or it doesn't matter?
I personally am not a master solder, and find soldering small connector very difficult(maybe I should really go to take a lesson on electrical repair)

Any how, I believe that the video really does make the whole process clear, but still make it difficult enough for people like me(beginner)

mailboxck
2008.01.16, 08:56 AM
I got an Iwaver rear damper set with a defect (one of the shafts was not threaded). And I informed toyeast right away. I only needed to take a picture of the part with the defect and they immediately sent me a replacement! How cool is that!

hrdrvr
2008.01.16, 12:43 PM
Reguarding the legs on the FETs: The way I understand it, the legs from one side get information from different places on the board, therefore they need to be soldered seperate. On the other side of the FET all the leads go to the motor wires, which means that side can be soldered together.

fangel
2008.01.16, 07:43 PM
mailboxck,
Thank for your complement, we try to service our customer the best we could. All of our CS case would require some sort of prove and you have prove to us that it is defected that is why we send a replacement right the way.

Hrdrvr,
So that is the reasons, I was thinking something in that category as well. I know that the FET just regulate the voltage output to the motor, so one of the end should be just pure output since the motor don't have any regulator on it's own.

soulstice
2008.01.17, 10:08 AM
As for the body issue, I think I have to agree with Hrdvr. I believe it is the body itself causing the problem, I'll reflect that to the factory to get it fixed for next production. In the mean time I guess you would have to fix it by remove and re-gluing the side body mount.


I just got a yellow F1 GTR myself with the same issue. I actually have the first run of these in silver and red and they sit perfectly. I compared the position of clips on the newer yellow one to my older silver one. The same. So what's the difference?

It's the clips. Fangel, if you get the factory to just change back to the old clips this body will sit perfectly. The new clips have two issues as I see it, they don't seem to move in long enough, and the step below the main ledge is too far inward to the center keeping the body artificially high.

Honestly I understand QA issues here and there but this is a big oversight. Let us know when you fixed it because i definitely intended on buying multiples of these.

fangel
2008.01.17, 08:34 PM
Thanks for the info.
I'll spend some times looking at the clips design for the new and old bodies.
But as I have said before, it is not the chassis but the body.
So fix is possible, just have indicate the problem and provide the fix to the factory.

If anyone out there with an old and new bodies that are willing to help indicate the differences and the effects the clips has on the ride height to our factory. I would be more then happy to accept the report and make sure that they are heard on the factory level.

Fovea3d
2008.01.17, 10:30 PM
Hello,
I also noticed this problem. For my part I had to move the clips to sit higher (needed to shave the body reinforcements by 4mm to do so).

http://alain.galluser.free.fr/Z/SupportsCarroIW.jpg

As you can see the part of the clip that fits in the chassis slot has been relocated from center to a lower position.
This issue happened on both the Mc Laren and Saleen bodies.
On my pictures the yellow saleen with white clip is from an old batch and has a correct ride height.
The dark grey Mc Laren is from the new batch.

fangel
2008.01.21, 01:37 AM
Thanks for your insightive post, I use your post to reflect it to the factory and the development team.

mailboxck
2008.01.24, 10:10 PM
I just got my replacement part from Toyeast. A couple of weeks ago I ordered a damper set which had one defective shock shaft. After sending pics of the defective part to Miu from Toyeast, they immediately sent me a replacement part.

I got the part this morning. Although I was expecting an entirely new rear damper set worth $10 on ToyEast, they sent me a single replacement shock instead (which was the only problematic part in the first place). Well, I was expecting too much...hehehehe. At least they kept their word in replacing the problematic part. Good job ToyEast!

fangel
2008.01.27, 08:08 PM
I hope that has not cause too many problem.
The replacement shock is brand new and it should not cause you any more trouble.

bmxtrev
2008.01.31, 08:00 PM
i am saving up for an mr-02, but its $140. Looking at these things, for $50, i might want one of these instead. But if i order one from toyeast, will it %100 sure be the new version? with the old 2.0, a lot of people got crappy controllers, bad plastic, and bad molds. With the new and improved version of the 2.0, are these problems all fixed? i want to get one from toyeast, but i dont want to get one that will break [ tx too], cuz then i have to send it back and waste all my money on shipping fees. Also, does it handle just as good as the real mr-02? are the electronics and such just as good? i am asking all of this because if i can be sure that i will get a nice fl 2.0 thats just as good as the mr-02, i WILL buy one in a heart beat! :D

mailboxck
2008.01.31, 08:50 PM
Hi there,

Yep am sure you'll get the new one from Toyeast. I already ordered 4 cars and I got the new versions. Comparing them to the MR02...they're up to par. Although the plastic are not as well moulded as Kyosho, they're still good quality. The controller is top notch and the chassis is good. You also get some spare parts in the package.

The electronics are almost the same but this does not have brake function. I believe the FETs are of good quality, but you might want to upgrade them for more speed. If you are going to get one, I highly recommend the ball bearing set and the ball diff set.

fangel
2008.01.31, 09:37 PM
Bmxtrey,
Welcome to the forum, on behave of the community I welcome you.
If you buy from ToyEast, I can assure you that you will get the new version for sure. Because we do not have any stock left of the old version.
The plastic and quality has improved greatly, you could see the other review of the new version. Don't just take my word, ask around and I'm sure you will see a lot of positive review from the past version.

The Tx that comes with the NR2 is power by Inopo, the AFM2 is a very power TX with many Fine tune setting. I know some people buy the RTR set for the TX and RX.

We also have a wide collections of Iwaver, Firelap and Kyosho bodies on sales.

hrdrvr
2008.02.01, 09:37 AM
i am saving up for an mr-02, but its $140. Looking at these things, for $50, i might want one of these instead. But if i order one from toyeast, will it %100 sure be the new version? with the old 2.0, a lot of people got crappy controllers, bad plastic, and bad molds. With the new and improved version of the 2.0, are these problems all fixed? i want to get one from toyeast, but i dont want to get one that will break [ tx too], cuz then i have to send it back and waste all my money on shipping fees. Also, does it handle just as good as the real mr-02? are the electronics and such just as good? i am asking all of this because if i can be sure that i will get a nice fl 2.0 thats just as good as the mr-02, i WILL buy one in a heart beat! :D


IMO, it is a lesser car than a Kyosho. You get what you pay for, and it is less than half the price. The electronics are slower, the motor is slower, and the plastic is of lesser quality. All that being said it is a good car for the money. I tried to run mine against box stock MR02s. I was running an ATM stockR motor which is uber fast in my Zs. My car couldnt keep up with the Zs at all.

The handling is there, and these are a HUGE step up from any Xmod. The tolerances are tighter, the steering more sensetive, and over all performance blows Xmods away. They just arent quite up to par with a Kyosho. If you are going to use it for running around the house, it will be a good buy. If you plan on racing it, keep saving and get the Kyosho.

Ive owned 2 of these (1 old, and 1 new) and have 2 friends that run them (newer versions), so I have a bit of experience with them. One guy has his FET modified, with a real fast (custom wound) motor. It is comparable to my MR02 with a FET safe motor, and the older 3004 FETs. Im upgrading that car to the new 3010 FETs. Once I do that, he wont keep up, even with a superior motor and FETs. Im having a single stack of 4562s put on mine. Ill let you know how it fairs on the track after that.

bmxtrev
2008.02.01, 04:33 PM
thanks for the help guys. i am leaning more to the kyosho side now, i really want to have a competitive racer [ my xmod evo just for "running around the house" lol], and the mr-02 seems to come with better electronics and plastics, so i will probably just save up the extra $100. note: this is gonna take forever to save up for, but i already have $45, and i'm gonna cut some wood all day tomorrow. [WHATEVER IT TAKES!!!] :D

fangel
2008.02.03, 08:07 PM
hrdrv,
I would have to agree with you on some of the point, basically the NR2 is more of a budget racer that is stock to stock is not yet on par with Kyosho MR-02. However with that being said it is still a very good racer and much more superior then the similar priced X-mod.
However it is kinda strange to hear that even with stack FET NR2 still can't out perform MR-02 stock. Since it is my understanding that the speed is control by the limit of the FET and not the overall board electronics. So upgrading the FET should dramatically change the speed of the chassis.

pinwc4
2008.02.03, 09:52 PM
hrdrv,
I would have to agree with you on some of the point, basically the NR2 is more of a budget racer that is stock to stock is not yet on par with Kyosho MR-02. However with that being said it is still a very good racer and much more superior then the similar priced X-mod.
However it is kinda strange to hear that even with stack FET NR2 still can't out perform MR-02 stock. Since it is my understanding that the speed is control by the limit of the FET and not the overall board electronics. So upgrading the FET should dramatically change the speed of the chassis.

We finally tried one of the NR2 at our club. I do not like the new electronics at all. There is no pot for adjusting the centering of the steering, you have to trim it with the controller. The steering also seems weak. Especially when you put a faster motor in. I put a HFAY Spec motor (similar to an Atomic Standard motor) in two NR2's and they both experience the same problem. With the faster motor the steering was no longer able to work correctly. It had a lot of trouble centering after a turn, almost like the motor was pulling so much power that the steering wasn't getting enough. When I switch them back to stock motors the problem goes away. I took apart the servos to make sure they moved freely and they do. It is an electrical problem not a physical problem.

Our club mostly runs Firelap 2.0's and have been pleased with them. The new NR2 does appear to have better plastics but please go back to the old circuitry.

hrdrvr
2008.02.04, 07:39 AM
hrdrv,
I would have to agree with you on some of the point, basically the NR2 is more of a budget racer that is stock to stock is not yet on par with Kyosho MR-02. However with that being said it is still a very good racer and much more superior then the similar priced X-mod.

I totally agree with everything said here :D I made a point in my previous post to state "over all performance blows Xmods away".



However it is kinda strange to hear that even with stack FET NR2 still can't out perform MR-02 stock. Since it is my understanding that the speed is control by the limit of the FET and not the overall board electronics. So upgrading the FET should dramatically change the speed of the chassis.

I thought it to be strange too. Just to calrify though, it wasnt stacked FETs, just single 4562s. Ive found these to be very good FETs with a linear range. They can also handle hotter motors than the stock FETs, and make stock safe motors even faster.

I will admit this wasnt my car. It was one of my friends that races with us. He is putting some 4562s on my NR2 now (single ones as well). I will be able to set it up similar to my cars and determine wether it could have been pure set up that wasnt putting the power down. Ill keep you guys posted :D

fangel
2008.02.04, 09:15 PM
hrdrvr,
As I said before, even with the new information that you have provided.
Anything that should out perform the stock FET should "out perform" the stock chassis.
It's basically the golden rule, high the power to weight ratio, faster it moves. (both accerleration and top speed)
I would believe it's the person or maybe the setting as you have mention it.

fangel
2008.02.04, 09:29 PM
pinwc4,
I have not personally tried the motor that you suggested, but I did tried the i-plus motor that we have in stock. The i-plus motor is a FET safe motor, and I have not experience the problem you have witness. I could not confirm the cause of the issue, but my bet is same as yours, it should be a voltage issue.
However I checked with the engineer, they have confirmed to me that the voltage output should be even higher then the previous models (However I don't know which "older" version you have.)

pinwc4
2008.02.04, 09:53 PM
pinwc4,
I have not personally tried the motor that you suggested, but I did tried the i-plus motor that we have in stock. The i-plus motor is a FET safe motor, and I have not experience the problem you have witness. I could not confirm the cause of the issue, but my bet is same as yours, it should be a voltage issue.
However I checked with the engineer, they have confirmed to me that the voltage output should be even higher then the previous models (However I don't know which "older" version you have.)

The HFAY motor is FET safe also. It has ran fine with the old Firelaps as most our club run this combination. Some of our Firelaps are over 2 years old. The new NR2's are the only ones that have had this problem. I tried 2 different RTR's and they did not work with the HFAY motor. I swapped the board with a Kyosho board with 3004 FET's and it worked fine. So I know the motor is works and the batteries were charged. The motor and batteries were broken in prior to using them in the NR2.

If I had only tried one NR2 I would have though maybe I had bad luck and got a bad one. But since I opened a second one and it had the same behavior it appears as though the new board can not handle as strong of motors as the older boards.

Which is a bummer for us as we participate in the How Fast Are You OnLine Point Series. Most everyone in our club uses Firelaps. The rules for the HFAY point series only allows you to use the stock motor or the HFAY motor. Since the stock motor in the Firelaps is weaker than the stock Kyosho motor we are at a disadvantage if we can not run the HFAY motor.

fangel
2008.02.10, 10:30 PM
hum...this is really strange.
Since I don't have the motor that you have suggested for testing, I really can't confirm about this. However I understand you issue and feel that it would be too bad if it is true.
I'll ask the engineer about this and see if this is actually true.

mailboxck
2008.02.14, 07:11 PM
Actually I have the feeling this is true because when I put in weak batteries on my firelap, the steering suffers (of course the throttle suffers too). But what I'm trying to say is that usually, in rc cars, when the batteries become weak, only the throttle suffers but not the steering. In this case, it seems the elec. board is sharing the power between the two and not equalizing the voltage.

fangel
2008.02.14, 08:06 PM
As I have said before, I believe that it might be true, but unless I use a volt meter to measure it I can't confirm it.
All I know is that when the battery runs down, the overall chassis responce will decrease and signal noise will appear. I think this has something to do with the electronic design and what the PCB consider "enough" power. I know that some electrical component will not function unless it has what "it" thinks is "enough" power.

hrdrvr
2008.02.15, 10:09 AM
Ive had the experience of low batteries giving me control (steering and throttle) ony my Firelaps and on my miniZs. Its just a product of the combuined ESC and Rx, IMO.


fangel, I went ahead and put a 4562 set (single layer) of FETs on my new version FL. It is faster than the stock miniZ with a stock Z motor. My friend must have had a really loose gear diff or a bad set of rear tires, as the power just wasnt getting to the ground. My next trial is to see how it stacks up against a Z with a single layer of 4562s and then with a slightly faster motor.

It may be a while, but Ill report back when I get a chance :D

fangel
2008.02.17, 08:41 PM
It's really down to the electronic design to control how low power situation handles.

It's good that your NR2 is back up and running, Traction is really a big component for the handling and performance. I think it will present a good competition for MR-02.