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pinwc4
2008.04.09, 01:50 PM
Warning, long post with large pictures.....

I just thought I would let people know we are nearing our first release of a new lap counting software package. This software will be compatible with the Core lap counter and the TI S6350 for the first release. The TI S6350 is not a end user product, it needs a computer interface and antenna to be complete.

The software is being programmed using Realbasic. This has allowed us to make a cross platform lap counting software package. It is being developed on a Mac but will also run on Windows and 32 bit Linux (have not tested binaries on 64 bit Linux).

Using this software with the Core lap counter will give you the ability to use generic TI ISO15963 tags like this one from Digikey:
http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail?name=481-1066-1-ND

Eventually we will also add the ability to use it with slot car tracks, laser lap counters, and pine wood derby by using this USB digital I/O board:
http://www.dlpdesign.com/usb/io8.shtml

And we will add the ability to have start stop lights, a horn, or other external devices using a relay board:
http://www.dlpdesign.com/dlp-ior4v11.pdf

Both of these can be purchased from www.mouser.com

The current estimated release date for the Alpha version is May 18th. I am hoping people will test this version out and give us feedback. As it is an Alpha it will have bugs, maybe big ones. It will be a free download for Mac, Windows and Linux for anyone to try out. I expect a Beta release about a month after that and hopefully version 1 another month after that. Version 1 will be free.

When the Alpha is released I will open up a ticketing system so people can submit problem tickets.

Minimum requirements at this point are not known. You do need a screen capable of at least 1024x768.

Anway about the software. It is a lap counting software package. It does not manage point series just individual races. Some of the features I am excited about are:

Use generic RFID tags
Live graph (graph updates during race)
Add racers during race (great for just practices)
HFAY results export (export a race in the HFAY file format)
XML results export
Cross platform, Windows, Mac and Linux

Here are some screenshots of the program in action. Remember that this is pre Alpha so many things still need to be done. Right now I am using graphics from Brian's HFAY theme so some stuff does not line up right. Drinian is working on a new theme for this software. You can change the background image to whatever you want.

Here is the race settings screen. You can do either a lap based race or a timed race.
http://www.flipsidehobbies.com/stuff/screenshots/racesettings.png

The select racers screen. This screen has a popup for selecting multiple racers at once. You do not need to scan them in. The usage of slots will help when the program is extended to slot cars and laser lap counters. The text color is configurable. Clicking the text results in a popup to change the color. This color is used on the race screen and the graph.
http://www.flipsidehobbies.com/stuff/screenshots/selectracers.png

The select users popup. This allows multi selection.
http://www.flipsidehobbies.com/stuff/screenshots/selectracerspopup.png

Edit racers screen. Edit existing racers or create new ones. The drop downs for parameters like scale, motor, chassis etc. are controlled by an XML file. You can add new ones by editing the file.
http://www.flipsidehobbies.com/stuff/screenshots/editracers.png

Race screen. This is the main screen during a race. When a race is running you can still add racers or look at the graph.
http://www.flipsidehobbies.com/stuff/screenshots/racescreen.png

Graph screen. From here you can see a live updated graph or bring up results from a previous race. Results are stored in a SQLite database if you want to do your own queries. A lag graph type is also available.
http://www.flipsidehobbies.com/stuff/screenshots/livegraph.png

That is what I have so far. It still needs work before it is released but I welcome feedback.

briankstan
2008.04.09, 02:32 PM
I'll get you the .psd files for the HFAY theme so you can size it to fit...

the lights were done by Dusty Weasle. :cool:

sign me up for a test copy...

imxlr8ed
2008.04.09, 03:23 PM
Incredible work... I look forward to the release!

briankstan
2008.04.09, 03:30 PM
I emailed you links to the artwork.... sorry for the delay.:o

pinwc4
2008.04.09, 03:40 PM
I emailed you links to the artwork.... sorry for the delay.:o

Thanks, I have downloaded them.

Also thanks for pointing out Dusty Weasle did that work. I will need to contact him to make sure it is OK to use the graphics.

And thanks for the encouragement.

leonen
2008.04.10, 10:22 AM
Brilliant job.

May I add one suggestion? RACE FORMAT. Being such a complete soft, adding a configurable Race Format, with qualy and finals, would make it just perfect.

It wouldn't matter to have tournament management or point series, cause I guess that could be a plug in implemented later on. Or anybody can make that on his own, being the results saved in an SQL DB....

But having the ability to make different Race Formats is cool. One lap qualifiers, individual timed qualifiers, grouped timed qualifiers... Direct pass Finals and catch up heats. I don't know but there are many formats, and if you could just add this.... welll ...

Another thing I noticed watching at your screenshots, is something CORE soft has, and it's the possibility to make races end by laps or time, which ever comes first, and not only by one of those as you have.

Excellent and keep up that good work. We can offer to alpha/beta test in our club. just prvt msg me and send me details.

pinwc4
2008.04.10, 07:45 PM
May I add one suggestion? RACE FORMAT. Being such a complete soft, adding a configurable Race Format, with qualy and finals, would make it just perfect.


So, if I understand you correctly, this would be a series of predefined race settings. Maybe have a drop down just below the Event name where you can select a race format, which would modify all the other values? This should be easy, the settings are already in an XML document so I just need a new element and move the already defined ones as a sub element.

This may not make it in the Alpha but it is a good idea that I think we will do.


It wouldn't matter to have tournament management or point series, cause I guess that could be a plug in implemented later on. Or anybody can make that on his own, being the results saved in an SQL DB....


Just get an SQLite driver so you can communicate with the DB. There are a lot of utilities and libraries already available to use SQLite.


Another thing I noticed watching at your screenshots, is something CORE soft has, and it's the possibility to make races end by laps or time, which ever comes first, and not only by one of those as you have.


Dusty Weasle pointed this out to me also. I did not realize that people race in that way. Just like your above suggestion I will make a ticket so it is not forgotten but it may not make the Alpha.

Thanks for the feedback. This will help use improve the program.

cdog4w
2008.04.10, 08:38 PM
Looks great so far, and kudos for releasing it as freeware!

I have one feature request, be able to take serial input for lap timers! I'm currently building my own IR based laptimer as a self-teaching project and it would be great to be able to plug into your software. I've been trying to emulate the amb system 20 serial protocol, but can't quite get it working with laps free. My current hack - while I continue work on the hardware/software of the timer itself - is a little serial listener that sends keystrokes to the software that is setup in manual count mode (ie. press 0-9 on keyboard to count a lap).

If some form of serial protocol doesn't make it into the alpha, will there be a manual count method so I could test it out?

pinwc4
2008.04.10, 09:15 PM
I have one feature request, be able to take serial input for lap timers! I'm currently building my own IR based laptimer as a self-teaching project and it would be great to be able to plug into your software. I've been trying to emulate the amb system 20 serial protocol, but can't quite get it working with laps free.


Serial protocols are usually unique for each type of hardware. If you have info about a specific protocol I would like to take a look at it. You can send me an email through the forum to move the discussion off this thread as it will bore most people.

But for an IR based lap timer you should be able to use the USB Digital I/O board I mentioned above once we add support for it. But that will not be part of these early releases unless we get way ahead of schedule.


My current hack - while I continue work on the hardware/software of the timer itself - is a little serial listener that sends keystrokes to the software that is setup in manual count mode (ie. press 0-9 on keyboard to count a lap).

If some form of serial protocol doesn't make it into the alpha, will there be a manual count method so I could test it out?

Interesting that you ask for this. In fact for debugging we already have it so that if you define the UID of a racer to a single number you can use that keyboard key during the race to increment their laps. This was just to help us for testing and we just planned on disabling it for the release. We can just leave it enabled instead.

cdog4w
2008.04.10, 09:54 PM
Thanks, email sent!

leonen
2008.04.12, 10:00 AM
So, if I understand you correctly, this would be a series of predefined race settings. Maybe have a drop down just below the Event name where you can select a race format, which would modify all the other values? This should be easy, the settings are already in an XML document so I just need a new element and move the already defined ones as a sub element.


I can't get you quite right. But what I mean by configurable race format is:

Once all drivers are selected, separate them into races of a certain number of drivers at a time. Then according to their results, to have the possibility to re-sort them again, so that the fastest guys race again but with the other fastest guys, and slower drivers, with the other slowest guys. and so on in any amout of series.

This would be qualification time. But it's not the only way to have a qualy. F1 Style is another: 3 series of limited time and only the fastest guys advance to the next. Or old style F1, where 1 lap per driver setted his position on the grid.

This are too many options. A software can have them all. If you want I'd like to give you a hand on this. Just msg me or find me with msn messenger.

Then after qualy, you have the finals. Easier task. But you can have some special catch ups in the middle between Q and F. For example, we do two series of Q. The 4 fastest go directly to the Final. But the rest have an extra chance to enter the Final and fight for a win. They have what we call a Catch up. A piramidal series of very short races where first and second in each race advance to the next round. Starting with the 6 or 4 slowest guys in the field. This way someone that had any kind of trouble in the qualis, can make it into the Final.

But as I said before, Race Formats are various and there are so many as you can imagine. Anyway, they can be resumed into a few and packed into a software. CORE did it nicely. Check out CORE if you haven't.

Let me know if you need any help. I'l be glad to help you out.

russp
2008.04.21, 03:24 PM
I'll be willing to try it out. I thought about this myself sometime back but I've been too lazy to do anything about it. :) I started something in Visual C and got partway there for single car tracking for HFAY purposes. In any case, where do you recommend to buy the reader? My initial search turned up no good sources for it.

leonen
2008.04.21, 03:28 PM
Hi PinWc.... any updates on this ?

We'd be glad to help you beta or alpha test.

Let us know....

arch2b
2008.04.21, 03:29 PM
i sent you a pm about wanting to beta test this as well:)

Programmers
2008.04.21, 06:48 PM
That's looks awesome! We're interested in BETA testing too! PM Sent.

Z_408
2008.04.22, 04:49 PM
The software looks great and very promising. I would love a beta version to test. Please let me know what I can do.

thanks.

pinwc4
2008.04.22, 09:14 PM
The software looks great and very promising. I would love a beta version to test. Please let me know what I can do.

thanks.

Sorry that I have vanished for a bit here. I had vacation and now am at training followed by my sisters wedding next week so I am not online much right now. The software is progressing though, but my crazy schedule is part of why I am predicting that it will be mid-May before it will be available for download. When it is I will post a link here for anyone to use.

The software will end up here when available:
http://www.flipsideracing.org/projects/fslapcounter

Right now the site does not have much but soon it will. Plus I will open up the ticketing system when it is release so you can submit tickets.

pinwc4
2008.04.22, 09:20 PM
I can't get you quite right. But what I mean by configurable race format is:

Once all drivers are selected, separate them into races of a certain number of drivers at a time. Then according to their results, to have the possibility to re-sort them again, so that the fastest guys race again but with the other fastest guys, and slower drivers, with the other slowest guys. and so on in any amout of series.

This would be qualification time. But it's not the only way to have a qualy. F1 Style is another: 3 series of limited time and only the fastest guys advance to the next. Or old style F1, where 1 lap per driver setted his position on the grid.

This are too many options. A software can have them all. If you want I'd like to give you a hand on this. Just msg me or find me with msn messenger.

Then after qualy, you have the finals. Easier task. But you can have some special catch ups in the middle between Q and F. For example, we do two series of Q. The 4 fastest go directly to the Final. But the rest have an extra chance to enter the Final and fight for a win. They have what we call a Catch up. A piramidal series of very short races where first and second in each race advance to the next round. Starting with the 6 or 4 slowest guys in the field. This way someone that had any kind of trouble in the qualis, can make it into the Final.

But as I said before, Race Formats are various and there are so many as you can imagine. Anyway, they can be resumed into a few and packed into a software. CORE did it nicely. Check out CORE if you haven't.

Let me know if you need any help. I'l be glad to help you out.

I completely misunderstood what you are saying. What you said above makes more sense. What you are proposing is the majority of the logic needed for doing point series etc. Right now that is too much work to get done any time soon.

Now if you or someone else wants to take a crack at it msg me.

I do have the Core software and what we are developing does not have all those features yet. But it is a start, and getting started is sometimes the hardest part.

pinwc4
2008.04.22, 09:35 PM
I'll be willing to try it out. I thought about this myself sometime back but I've been too lazy to do anything about it. :) I started something in Visual C and got partway there for single car tracking for HFAY purposes. In any case, where do you recommend to buy the reader? My initial search turned up no good sources for it.

I wish I had a good answer for this but I do not have one yet. So far the Core reader is the only complete solution.

For the DIYish route the biggest problem is I can not find a good supplier for an antenna. Specifically you need a 13.56 Mhz antenna at 50 ohm. I have experimented with building one with mixed results. So far no matter a skilled professional would have to tune the antenna.

If I can come up with a good antenna design that is cheap and easy to tune linking it to this reader seems the easiest way to go.

http://www.dlpdesign.com/rf/rfid1.shtml

It has a built in antenna which is good for testing, but the built in one can be easily bypassed. I have not used it yet but plan on buying one soon to try it out.

I plan on spending more time with hardware after some of the software is worked out.

pinwc4
2008.05.19, 10:31 PM
Short update on the status of this. I had hoped to have the alpha released yesterday but we are not quite there yet. We are very close but the driver for the Core reader is not done yet. We also have a nasty crash bug on Linux to resolve. Hopefully in the next two weeks we will have this out the door.

But one person on the forums did get an advanced copy to try out. Maybe he will post a little bit of his experience... :o

While we are a bit behind schedule we did get to a couple of the simpler suggestions that people on the forum provided. For example an additional race type of lap and timed was created.

Also we got some nice new graphics from DansDecals, here is an updated screen shot from part of the program.

http://www.flipsidehobbies.com/stuff/screenshots/fssoftwarepic519.jpg

herman
2008.05.19, 11:44 PM
cool... :D

cdog4w
2008.05.20, 02:35 AM
But one person on the forums did get an advanced copy to try out. Maybe he will post a little bit of his experience... :o

I'm the lucky guy who got the advance copy, and while I haven't tried all the other software out there, I think everyone will be really happy with this.

I've tried Lap Timer 2000 and Laps Free previously, but not core or giroz's software. Lap Timer 2000 started as a slot timer, but can be used with laser setups so it was pretty simple/straightforward. Laps Free has a lot more to it, but was quite unwieldy and difficult to just pick up and use. This is where pinwc4's work shines, I was able to start it up, look at driver info and get into a practice race within a minute. Everything was intuitive. Even cooler are the graphs (viewable during racing or after) that give you more info to dig into about your race.

I haven't spent an exhaustive amount of time playing with the various race settings because I'm primarily testing out my own IR based lap timer hardware (the reason pinwc4 was gracious enough to give me an advance copy). I was more interested in making sure all my laps were counted than trying out the lap + time race cutoff :P

So my conclusion is that its easy to use and looks great doing it!

leonen
2008.07.25, 12:00 PM
Any updates on this?

briankstan
2008.07.25, 01:17 PM
I'm anxiously awaiting for this as well. ;)

pinwc4
2008.07.26, 09:35 AM
As am I....

I apologize for the lack of updates. Progress has been made, just much slower than I had intended. Some bugs have been squashed and new graphics from Dan "Drinian" at dansdecals.com. Also I finally figured out the nasty crash bug in Linux. Now I just need to tweak the layout some and it should be usable. And I begun working on allowing external programs to feed lap times. Plus some other changes that I do not immediately recall.

Unfortunately one of the previous programmers who I had working on communication with the Core hardware had too many scheduling conflicts so I had a to hire a new programmer. I shipped off my prototype hardware to him this week. He has done good work for me in the past so I am confident he will be able to finish this.

So I hope in less than 2 months he will deliver that piece and we will be ready.

briankstan
2008.09.29, 11:14 AM
Just checking in for an update. I'm excited to see what the product will be like?

did you get your core driver working yet? I'd be interested in testing for you. ;)

pinwc4
2008.09.29, 10:24 PM
Just checking in for an update. I'm excited to see what the product will be like?

did you get your core driver working yet? I'd be interested in testing for you. ;)

I have a Alpha version working with the Core hardware but we have two major bugs to work out before release though. And I have only experimented with it either by myself on a track or with multiple tags on the bench, it has not been race tested.

After adding the Core driver we have a memory leak. An 8 minute race adds somewhere around 128MB of extra RAM usage. I know generally where in the software it is happening and it should not be hard to track down and fix.

The other is more theoretical, I think that when multiple people are in the loop at the same time that I could miss a lap. Just need to add some collision logic. I may send out a release without adding this just to see if people encounter this problem in real life.

Other than these I have a couple minor things that may or may not get cleaned up before I let people try it out.

We are really close and I am on vacation for the next two weeks so I hope I can finish this early release up.

briankstan
2008.09.30, 11:37 AM
sounds good, I can test it with multiply cars if/when the time comes. I typically can set up a track at any time and have the family run to test. let me know if you need the help.

leonen
2008.10.09, 12:46 PM
PinWc4,

Do you have an alpha package already? We have developed in our club something we call Vision-Z. It's an Online Race Replay system, that uses information extracted directly from files generated by CORE to create this (http://foros.ath.cx/tyc/VisionZ.aspx?Torneo=F1%20Clausura%20Nocturno%20%20 08&Fecha=Fecha4&Carrera=A%20Main&TipoCarrera=F#), or this (http://foros.ath.cx/tyc/VisionZ.aspx?Torneo=F1%20Clausura%20Nocturno%20%20 08&Fecha=Fecha1&Carrera=A%20Main&TipoCarrera=F#).

We also created a web page that allows web users to navigate CORE Result files, click here (http://foros.ath.cx/tyc/)

It would be fantastic to embed something like this into your application and have it all in the same package. If you can send us a copy to test it and see how could we do this integration, perhaps we can work together.

Let me know...

pinwc4
2008.10.10, 12:44 AM
PinWc4,

Do you have an alpha package already? We have developed in our club something we call Vision-Z. It's an Online Race Replay system, that uses information extracted directly from files generated by CORE to create this (http://foros.ath.cx/tyc/VisionZ.aspx?Torneo=F1%20Clausura%20Nocturno%20%20 08&Fecha=Fecha4&Carrera=A%20Main&TipoCarrera=F#), or this (http://foros.ath.cx/tyc/VisionZ.aspx?Torneo=F1%20Clausura%20Nocturno%20%20 08&Fecha=Fecha1&Carrera=A%20Main&TipoCarrera=F#).

We also created a web page that allows web users to navigate CORE Result files, click here (http://foros.ath.cx/tyc/)

It would be fantastic to embed something like this into your application and have it all in the same package. If you can send us a copy to test it and see how could we do this integration, perhaps we can work together.

Let me know...

I know this has been slower going that I expected but we are really close. In fact this weekend we plan on using it to run our race night. This will be the first time it has been used for real racing instead of just playing with it on a workbench. If it works well enough for us I will upload it next week for others to try out. But again it is an Alpha so it will have bugs and missing features....

In regards to your replay system that is very interesting work. Do you already have a version that runs on a local PC? My main concern would be if it were Windows only, we used a language called Realbasic to develop the software as this gives us better cross platform capabilities. You are welcome to email me to chat about this further as maybe we can bundle it Windows only.

I have attached an example report that our software generates. It is a little different than the Core software as we chose to use XML as the primary format for the export hoping if people wanted to analyze in other software that it would be easier than working with HTML. But we also generate a plain HTML for those that want that.

Additionally all the information is in a local SQLite database so you could reach in directly that way also.

pinwc4
2008.10.20, 08:09 PM
For the sake of getting something out there I am releasing an Alpha version of the software now. It is still incomplete, needs polish and has bugs but it will run races. We used it a week ago to run our local races.

Windows Download
http://www.flipsideracing.org/downloads/fsraceWin.zip

Mac Universal Binary
http://www.flipsideracing.org/downloads/fsraceOSX.zip

Linux Download
http://www.flipsideracing.org/downloads/fsraceLinux.zip

This has only been tested on Windows XP and Mac OSX 10.5 so far. The Linux version ran for me but I have not had time to test actually using the Core lap counter with it.

Please submit bugs you find to the following website:
http://www.flipsideracing.org/projects/fslapcounter/

Before posting a new bug please check to see if someone has already reported it. For example one big bug that is known is when exporting the report there is a rounding error that causes the times to look like this, 5.0699999999999999, instead of 5.07.

I will also hopefully start working on the documentation soon. Most the important stuff is hopefully obvious other than what you need to get started.


Configure the Core lap counter

Before you can use the Core lap counter you must configure the serial device. This is done by going to the Config. page of the software. Toward the bottom of this page you need to select which COM device that the Core lap counter is on and click the save connection button.

Windows Specific: Most likely in Windows the COM device will be the last in the list.

Mac Specific: Most likely the device will start with usbserial- followed by a series of numbers

Add new racers

After you have configured your hardware you are now ready to add new racers. When the racer is in the middle of the antenna you can click the create new racer button to create a new blank racer. Then click the scan button to read the RFID tag. After you have set the name and other settings to what you want click the save button. You are now ready to add another racer.

Selecting racers for a race

If you line up all the racers for a race within the antenna and click the scan button they will be automatically added. Or if you click the add button next to the slots. A window will pop up allow you to select which racers you want to participate in the race. This window allows multi-selection. Up to 8 racers can be added to a race at any time. Racers can only be removed if a race has not started.

briankstan
2008.10.20, 09:27 PM
I'm downloading now. I'll test is some tomorrow.

pinwc4
2008.10.21, 12:38 AM
I'm downloading now. I'll test is some tomorrow.

Thanks,

I will try to post a new .exe tomorrow night to fix the exported report bugs. The rounding problem was introduced in the last minutes because I upgraded to the latest software environment. Just need to roll back and recompile for that one.

briankstan
2008.10.21, 12:46 AM
I ran a few quick test laps with it, It was working fine, then all the sudden it started missing a few laps. My laptop decided to do the automatic update so I think that was the issue.

Does the software write information to the transponder? I used the scan feature and it seems that the only information that was read was the unique ID. so my assumption is that it strickly goes off of the UID, and not any of the information that is stored on the transponder from Core.

pinwc4
2008.10.21, 09:01 AM
I ran a few quick test laps with it, It was working fine, then all the sudden it started missing a few laps. My laptop decided to do the automatic update so I think that was the issue.

Does the software write information to the transponder? I used the scan feature and it seems that the only information that was read was the unique ID. so my assumption is that it strickly goes off of the UID, and not any of the information that is stored on the transponder from Core.

Hopefully it was just Automatic Updates getting in the way, they can bog down a machine when they are running.

Currently I do not write any data to the transponder. Everything is in the database and based off the UID. In the future I do want to at least import the data from the Core tags but other tasks are a higher priority.

Oh and just to mention again as this was way back on the first page, with this software you can use generic RFID tags like these:
http://search.digikey.com/scripts/DkSearch/dksus.dll?Detail?name=481-1066-1-ND

briankstan
2008.10.21, 10:40 AM
I do remember and I'll have some generic transponders to test with soon, they should arrive tomorrow according to Fedex tracking. ;)

this is one of the great highlights of your software, along with being able to export the results to the HFAY format for submitting the results. this should potentially save me alot of time. :)

briankstan
2008.10.21, 01:00 PM
I noticed that it keeps track of the time in seconds, so a if the time is 4:22.06 it displays it as 262.06 Is your plan to keep it like this?

So far this morning I've ran a few Time Trial test and everything has worked great. The problem last night must have been my auto update bogging down my laptop.

pinwc4
2008.10.21, 07:09 PM
I have posted a new build. Go to http://www.flipsideracing.org/projects/fslapcounter/ to download the latest version.

If you are upgrading just download the exe and overwrite it. This way you keep any old reports and racers that you have entered.

In regards to errors, some of the report problems have been corrected. Windows will not display duplicate lap entries in the report. The rounding error has been eliminated (although old races will still have the wrong value in the database it will be displayed correctly). And a problem displaying the report logo in IE has been corrected.

2 know report bugs remain. In both Linux and Mac OSX the report will not launch correctly. The report is correctly generated in the report directory so you can navigate to it I just still need to come up with a universal way to launch the XML file in a web browser.

pinwc4
2008.10.21, 07:12 PM
I noticed that it keeps track of the time in seconds, so a if the time is 4:22.06 it displays it as 262.06 Is your plan to keep it like this?

So far this morning I've ran a few Time Trial test and everything has worked great. The problem last night must have been my auto update bogging down my laptop.

Good to hear that it worked better. I may need to come up with a way to make the application run as a higher priority so that other apps are less likely to interfere.

In regards to time it can be changed. What way do you rather it be? Should we go with HH:MM:SS.SS as the format? And should it have leading 0's? For example can we go like this:

00:04:22.06

or should it just be shortened to just 4:22.06?

For the HFAY export it should already be in the format MM:SS.SS but as you noted on the main interface it is just seconds.

Z_408
2008.10.21, 09:09 PM
I downloaded the software today and it works well. Can the program do heats and mains? I do not see where it can sort mains. Also on the html, can you have it round to the hundredths?

great job.

briankstan
2008.10.21, 09:11 PM
Good to hear that it worked better. I may need to come up with a way to make the application run as a higher priority so that other apps are less likely to interfere.

In regards to time it can be changed. What way do you rather it be? Should we go with HH:MM:SS.SS as the format? And should it have leading 0's? For example can we go like this:

00:04:22.06

or should it just be shortened to just 4:22.06?

For the HFAY export it should already be in the format MM:SS.SS but as you noted on the main interface it is just seconds.

it probably should be HH:MM:SS.SS for the main interface. The HFAY report looked perfect from my testing.

I ran about 500 laps with the software today and it worked flawlessly. We are racing this thursday and I'll put it though some testing there with more than just me on the track.

so far the functionality of the software is nice, it's easy to understand and to use.

pinwc4
2008.10.21, 09:26 PM
I downloaded the software today and it works well. Can the program do heats and mains? I do not see where it can sort mains. Also on the html, can you have it round to the hundredths?

great job.

Thanks for checking it out.

Right now this is just for doing individual races, it does not do race day or point series management. I want this part feature complete and reliable before tackling that.

If you downloaded the software yesterday what you are seeing is the rounding bug I mentioned. It is taken care of in todays build and will only show the times at 1/100ths resolution. Just download the exe for your platform and overwrite it so you can retain your existing racers and results.

pinwc4
2008.10.21, 09:31 PM
it probably should be HH:MM:SS.SS for the main interface. The HFAY report looked perfect from my testing.

I ran about 500 laps with the software today and it worked flawlessly. We are racing this thursday and I'll put it though some testing there with more than just me on the track.

so far the functionality of the software is nice, it's easy to understand and to use.

Thanks for the compliments.

Glad to hear the HFAY report looked right. We plan on running our HFAY races this weekend using this software.

With the HH:MM:SS.SS format do you think I should leave the leading 0's for consistency or take them out for simplicity? Basically for smaller times should it show 00:07:55.23 or just 7:55.23?

briankstan
2008.10.21, 09:41 PM
Thanks for the compliments.

Glad to hear the HFAY report looked right. We plan on running our HFAY races this weekend using this software.

With the HH:MM:SS.SS format do you think I should leave the leading 0's for consistency or take them out for simplicity? Basically for smaller times should it show 00:07:55.23 or just 7:55.23?

I personally like the look without the leading 0's, but really either would be acceptable.

We do have F1 in HFAY now so I added that as a Chassis, it was simple enough to do. ;)

pinwc4
2008.10.21, 09:51 PM
I personally like the look without the leading 0's, but really either would be acceptable.

We do have F1 in HFAY now so I added that as a Chassis, it was simple enough to do. ;)

Sounds good, I will try to work on it tomorrow.

Is F1 the only thing you added to the chassis list? Looking at the HFAY site it looks like you just call it F1, there are no other F1 chassis to consider?

pinwc4
2008.10.22, 01:26 PM
A new build is available. Go to http://www.flipsideracing.org/projects/fslapcounter/ to download the full version or upgrades for your platform.

This version changes the time display to DD:HH:MM:SS.SS excluding leading 00's, it fixes the bug preventing the Linux version from opening the generated report in a web browser, and F1 has been added as a chassis type.

For those of you who downloaded the prior releases to add a chassis to the popup menu just edit the raceparts.xml file using a text editor. Or download the file from the above website.

pinwc4
2008.10.24, 07:06 PM
Thank you for those that have given feedback. But I am surprised by how few of you have I have heard from.

Please if you have tried out the software let me know your experience, I need your feedback to help improve it.

Has anyone had a chance to try the software on Vista, or Linux or OSX?

rc_speed
2008.10.25, 10:34 PM
Hello,
I just took a look at the software and I did not see that it would allow me to run several classes during the race day. We run mr-o2, Monster trucks, F1, and Pan cars. We round all the heat 1 qualifers, then we run heat2 for all classes and so forth, to all the mains. If we have more than 10 racers in a class, then the software should be able to divide the mains based on how the racers did in the qualifers.
One other thing is that sometimes we would allow bump-ups from the lower mains. This would mean that if you got 1st or 2nd in the b-main, you would be bumped up to the A-main.

Is the software capable of this and I just didn't see it?

thanks,
tim

pinwc4
2008.10.25, 11:55 PM
Hello,
I just took a look at the software and I did not see that it would allow me to run several classes during the race day. We run mr-o2, Monster trucks, F1, and Pan cars. We round all the heat 1 qualifers, then we run heat2 for all classes and so forth, to all the mains. If we have more than 10 racers in a class, then the software should be able to divide the mains based on how the racers did in the qualifers.
One other thing is that sometimes we would allow bump-ups from the lower mains. This would mean that if you got 1st or 2nd in the b-main, you would be bumped up to the A-main.

Is the software capable of this and I just didn't see it?

thanks,
tim

Thank you for checking out. No, at this time the software does not have race day and point series management. It handles individual races only. Eventually that capability will be added but it is a significant amount of effort to provide the flexibility needed as many clubs handle this in a variety of ways.

I have only worked a bit on the design side of things and no actual coding but I hope to make a separate program for this. That way it can run on the same computer or not and will be able to support multiple race computers.

But this is a long ways off as this project is just a side venture for me.

briankstan
2008.10.26, 11:23 AM
I did have a chance to install the software on my Vista computer. I loads fine and also operates the Core Loop and lap tracking. I'll have to see if I have a USB cable long enough to reach my track from my office so I can test it at race speeds, but it did count and track as I passed the transponder over the loop.

I received my generic transponders and tested them as well. They worked perfectly. ! :D

arch2b
2008.10.26, 01:16 PM
i plan on testing this software as well when we have the opportunity. right now we just don't want to take the chance of trying something new on hfay racing days. stick with what works...

i have to say, i'm very interested in the direct hfay reporting option. is there a way i can open the software and use this option from core generated results?

our club runs multiple classes in hfay and uses bump ups when we can. i'd also love to be able to resort heats after the 1st set. if this can be done with core, please let me know how.

email me about the tags...

hilldebrandt
2008.10.26, 02:05 PM
This software sounds cool and all, and I would love to test it, but since I don't have a CORE system to begin with....you get the picture...lol.

It would be nice to have a different reading system available, since I don't know where to get any CORE's, and, it seems that the CORE website has bit the dust as well....sheeesh ! :eek:

pinwc4
2008.10.26, 05:28 PM
I did have a chance to install the software on my Vista computer. I loads fine and also operates the Core Loop and lap tracking. I'll have to see if I have a USB cable long enough to reach my track from my office so I can test it at race speeds, but it did count and track as I passed the transponder over the loop.

I received my generic transponders and tested them as well. They worked perfectly. ! :D

Thanks for the update. I had ran the software in a virtual Vista machine but never a real computer running Vista with the hardware attached.

The TI RFID tags do work great, I bought a roll of 50 and we have been using them for quite some time.

It looks like Digi-key went up in price though as when I bought mine they were < 1$ each. I would recommend getting them here now:
http://www.mouser.com/Search/Refine.aspx?Keyword=RI-I02-112A-03&Ns=P_SField

I use both Mouser and Digi-Key for electronics parts. I like Mouser more as they do not have the extra charge for orders less than 25$ and the web site is easier to use. Either they did not stock them last time I looked or I just did not search correctly as I would have posted this Mouser link before suggesting Digi-Key, sorry.

At some point I will experiment with other tags but in general TI 13.56 Mhz tags should work. Other brands that support the ISO15963 protocol at 13.56Mhz should also work.

pinwc4
2008.10.26, 05:34 PM
i plan on testing this software as well when we have the opportunity. right now we just don't want to take the chance of trying something new on hfay racing days. stick with what works...

i have to say, i'm very interested in the direct hfay reporting option. is there a way i can open the software and use this option from core generated results?

our club runs multiple classes in hfay and uses bump ups when we can. i'd also love to be able to resort heats after the 1st set. if this can be done with core, please let me know how.

email me about the tags...

I can understand not wanting to mess up a racing day. This software is an Alpha release, very peliminary. It may kick your dog, kill your cat and crash your computer. No warranty is given or implied...... But I have used it for 2 of our race nights with success so far. It does needs some enhancements but it has been stable.

The HFAY export would not be able to convert Core files. It just takes the data out of the database we created for our software and exports it in a format that is needed for HFAY.

I am surprised you are using bump ups in your HFAY races. We actually do the opposite and do bump downs. I do this as I thought the rules required you to submit the results of the first HFAY race that a person runs. So if you bump up a person from the B main to the A main, their B main race results are what count for HFAY. But maybe I misunderstood the rules again...

pinwc4
2008.10.26, 05:37 PM
This software sounds cool and all, and I would love to test it, but since I don't have a CORE system to begin with....you get the picture...lol.

It would be nice to have a different reading system available, since I don't know where to get any CORE's, and, it seems that the CORE website has bit the dust as well....sheeesh ! :eek:

In addition to doing the software work I am also working on hardware. I have an old out of date thread about it here:
http://www.minizracer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=24265

While it has progressed further than that thread it is still incomplete. Now that I have software that I can use with it I am going to start working more on the hardware side again. But if I do ever release any hardware it will be in kit form (but be a relatively easy kit to do).

arch2b
2008.10.26, 06:13 PM
thanks for the link. that will come in handy shortly.

hilldebrandt
2008.10.26, 07:55 PM
Thanks for the link as well. The system looks good so far !

briankstan
2008.11.02, 04:58 PM
A few more little things I've noticed.

When a race completes it seems 2 audio files play at the same time, making it hard to understand either. I noticed this on both Vista and XP.

Also when opening the reports it opens IE, rather then my default browser, Firefox.

so far in testing on both Vista and XP I haven't noticed any difference, it works well on both.

Any plans on having it write the driver and car information to the transponders, I know this is only good when traveling to and from different tracks, however it it is a nice feature.

pinwc4
2008.11.02, 07:34 PM
Thanks for the feedback, it is appreciated.


A few more little things I've noticed.

When a race completes it seems 2 audio files play at the same time, making it hard to understand either. I noticed this on both Vista and XP.



Yes, I noticed this too. It impacts all platforms. It is playing the sound for a racer that has finished and the sound for ending a race at the same time. I should have it fixed in the next release.



Also when opening the reports it opens IE, rather then my default browser, Firefox.



The report that is opened in Windows is an XML file instead of a HTML file.

Just a guess here but I imagine that for the XML file generated by the report IE is the default application. If you go into one of the reports in the reports directory you will probably see that the race.xml results file has an IE logo or maybe a picture of a globe in <> symbols on it indicating that is the default application instead of the Firefox logo.

So what you can do is to right click that race.xml file and select the open with option, then select choose program. In the window that pops up you can select Firefox and set it to be the program that always opens that kind of file.

In Windows the race.html file in that same directory is not useful. It will open in your default browser but there will be duplicate rows for laps, say 2 racers did 5 laps, the laps table will show it like this. Laps 1,2,3,4,5,1,2,3,4,5. This is a Windows bug with the library I use for converting the XML file so my only workaround was to open the original XML file instead of the HTML.



so far in testing on both Vista and XP I haven't noticed any difference, it works well on both.



Thanks for checking out Vista, it is good to have a report that it operates the same.



Any plans on having it write the driver and car information to the transponders, I know this is only good when traveling to and from different tracks, however it it is a nice feature.



Eventually anything is possible but I do not see myself getting to it in the short term.

pinwc4
2008.11.02, 08:51 PM
Hey, if anyone has a DNano and the core lap counter could they try out this software and see if it detects the tag in the DNano? I do not have one to try but it may work.....

briankstan
2008.11.02, 09:13 PM
Hey, if anyone has a DNano and the core lap counter could they try out this software and see if it detects the tag in the DNano? I do not have one to try but it may work.....

one of the guys in our club had one, but when I mentioned to him that I wanted to try it out, he told me he was selling it and didn't have it with him last race. I also wanted to see if it worked.

arch2b
2008.11.02, 09:45 PM
if i recall correctly, the old unit won't read new tags where as the new unit will read old tags. please correct me if i'm wrong.

pinwc4
2008.11.02, 11:23 PM
if i recall correctly, the old unit won't read new tags where as the new unit will read old tags. please correct me if i'm wrong.

As far as I know that is correct but it may just be a software limitation which my software would not have.. It was only a guess I was hoping someone could easily test. If they didn't cost so much I would just buy one to experiment with myself.

pinwc4
2008.11.03, 11:20 PM
For those that are interested I have opened up the source to the application. If you have a subversion client you can download it using this address:

http://www.flipsideracing.org/svn/trunk

You will need a copy of RealBasic to modify and compile the application.

razzor
2008.11.07, 04:23 AM
What systems are available currently ???
Can fin Core online only references to it.
What would the pro's and con's be between teh I-Lap and Giro-Z systems ???
Im liking the Giro-z software but am not usre on reliability etc if these IR systems.
We looking at a affordable system to use on 1/8 offroad buggies so would like to know if it would be practical and reliable.
Feed back appreciated.

x_zminiracer
2008.11.07, 10:01 AM
if your going to go larger scale then I-lap is the way to go. Gyroz has smaller transponders good for these mini cars, but it won't work outside as will the I-Lap. I have an original ABM 20 version I-lap system and can't say enough about it. I am still able to get brand new transponders from Craig for my 'old' system and with the release of the latest version on ABM RC, IMO, this is the best all around Ir system you can get. its designed to plug into the receivers of the larger scale cars and can easily be adapted to 1/28 scale.

pinwc4
2008.11.07, 12:30 PM
What systems are available currently ???
Can fin Core online only references to it.
What would the pro's and con's be between teh I-Lap and Giro-Z systems ???
Im liking the Giro-z software but am not usre on reliability etc if these IR systems.
We looking at a affordable system to use on 1/8 offroad buggies so would like to know if it would be practical and reliable.
Feed back appreciated.

This software currently works for the Core Speedway lap counter or if you know enough about rf you can build your own with the TI S6350 module (very difficult right now though). I do not think they are sold anymore.

As for your other questions I do not know anything about the other hardware but you can search this forum for some answers. If you do not find them you can create a separate post for your questions or maybe check out some of the other forums such as hobbytalk, rcuniverse or rccaraction which have information about larger scale RC's.

pinwc4
2008.11.07, 12:51 PM
If there is anyone else that may be interested with helping write this software please contact me. We have added another person to the team but will welcome others.

The application is developed in RealBasic (which is similar to VB.NET but cross platform) and we use Subversion/Trac for managing the source.

You can email me through the forum or my address is pinwc4 at flipsidehobbies dot com

pinwc4
2009.01.05, 02:49 PM
A new release for Windows and Mac OS X is available. Go to http://www.flipsideracing.org/projects/fslapcounter/ to download the latest version.

Quite a few changes in this version but the most notable are the following:

-Text To Speech integration. This currently allows the software to announce lead changes, personal best laps, overall best laps and time remaining. In Windows XP I would recommend using the Microsoft Mary voice over the default Microsoft Sam. This feature is currently Windows and Mac OS X only.

-Memory leak fixed

-Live graphing in Windows should no longer flicker

-Added Lamborghini pictures to the included picture list. This was missed in the last release. Thanks to Dusty Weasle for all the included car pictures.

-Software license is now GPL, hoping some people will participate in the development.

I would recommend just downloading the full version instead of upgrading so that you get the updated configs and images. Just copy your flipsideDB from your old software to the new to keep any racers and race results you have.

This version of the software has only been tested on my workbench. Our next race night is in 2 weeks so I thought I would toss this out there for you guys now instead of sitting on it for a while.

Let me know what does and does not work.

briankstan
2009.01.05, 05:06 PM
Awesome ! I'll give it a try tonight if I have some time.

briankstan
2009.01.05, 09:01 PM
first race run, everything worked, How do I change the computer voice? I didn't see a setting.

pinwc4
2009.01.06, 07:08 PM
first race run, everything worked, How do I change the computer voice? I didn't see a setting.

It is using the builtin capabilities of Windows or OSX. In Windows to change things you need to go to your Control Panel and run the Speech application in there. This will let you modify some basic settings of the Text To Speech engine. In Windows XP I prefer the Microsoft Mary voice over the default Microsoft Sam. I liked it most when this voice was slown down a notch.

In OSX you need to go to your System Preferences and select Speech in there. In OSX 10.5 I found I liked the new Alex voice the best. I also sped up the voice a notch.

cosmicsoul
2009.01.06, 07:21 PM
I have really enjoyed using the older version. I have had a core system for awhile now and have never been able to use the software.

Although I could not get your software to work on the machine I wanted to dedicate for racing, your software runs flawlessly most of the time on my lap top.

I have been taping the transponders to the bottom of the chassis, as under the bodies they seem to miss laps from time to time. I wonder if any one else has encountered this.

Well I look forward to trying the latest version. I was about to sell my core off and buy a giro-z.

Thanks for all your hard work!
Jay

pinwc4
2009.01.06, 08:35 PM
I have really enjoyed using the older version. I have had a core system for awhile now and have never been able to use the software.

Although I could not get your software to work on the machine I wanted to dedicate for racing, your software runs flawlessly most of the time on my lap top.

I have been taping the transponders to the bottom of the chassis, as under the bodies they seem to miss laps from time to time. I wonder if any one else has encountered this.

Well I look forward to trying the latest version. I was about to sell my core off and buy a giro-z.

Thanks for all your hard work!
Jay

Thanks for checking it out. Too bad you sold the Core lap counter I would have liked to help you get the software running on that other computer. I am very curious as to why it would not run.

In regards to missed laps we have had that happen to us on occasion. Anytime we encountered it though fixing the Core antenna loop under the track solved the issue for us. The antenna is fairly picky about being the right width and about metal. I always use a sheet of paper for a reference now when laying it out make it about an inch wider than the paper. If you search the forums I am sure you would have found other useful suggestions.

arch2b
2009.01.06, 08:52 PM
foolproof template

cut a patter into the bottom of a finish line. simply insert the loop into the groove and tape it in.

we do this for our club and it works great. i did this once before using sillicone to seal the loop into the groove/tile (not permanent) as well however taping it in makes it more transportable.

http://mini-zracer.com/mini-zgallery/data/511/medium/IMG_4378.JPG

http://mini-zracer.com/mini-zgallery/data/511/medium/IMG_4375.JPG

http://mini-zracer.com/mini-zgallery/data/511/medium/IMG_4379.JPG

cosmicsoul
2009.01.07, 08:36 AM
Thanks Arch,

This will be my next project, I definately apprieciate the input. Just to clarify I still have my Core system. It could be that I didn't have the loop setup correctly with my old machine. Maybe I'll try it out again once I get my loop setup like Arch suggests.

Hope all is well with you guys!

Jay

leonen
2009.01.15, 10:03 AM
Yesterday I had some free time and i went of to my track to test my cars and also this new software.

So, I downloaded the soft from the official page. Installed it and had it running and ready to roll in no time. The tags were recognized immediately.

Start the race.

But the first thing I noticed is .... no voices!!! the countdown was silent and only the starting horn sounded.

Then no sounds either for fatest laps. And when the race ended I went on to check the lap times, and noticed that the times were in seconds! no milliseconds!

Did I missed something? Is there anything else to configure? I saw the countdown wav files in the directory, but.... it seems they're not read.

briankstan
2009.01.15, 10:17 AM
I didn't have anything else that needed configured. other then setting the voice to the microsoft sara.

I did have an issue with one of my tags, it would scan in but not count and it was isolated to only this one tag. all the others that I tried worked.

I did notice that it won't allow you to have multiple of the same name, even though they are in different classes.

I was trying to setup each car in the different classes with Brian as the name for each. This was a little bit of a problem because then I had to put in Brian F1, and that is what the audio was saying as well.

x_zminiracer
2009.01.15, 11:50 AM
I do not know about this software in particular, but in general you have to disable windows sounds. depending on the version of windows the procedure is a little different but pretty much the same.
on my laptop with xp go control panel ; sounds and audio devices; sounds (sound scheme) and choose no sounds or none from the list; apply; OK.
might help you out.

pinwc4
2009.01.15, 06:31 PM
Yesterday I had some free time and i went of to my track to test my cars and also this new software.

So, I downloaded the soft from the official page. Installed it and had it running and ready to roll in no time. The tags were recognized immediately.

Start the race.

But the first thing I noticed is .... no voices!!! the countdown was silent and only the starting horn sounded.

Then no sounds either for fatest laps. And when the race ended I went on to check the lap times, and noticed that the times were in seconds! no milliseconds!

Did I missed something? Is there anything else to configure? I saw the countdown wav files in the directory, but.... it seems they're not read.

Thanks for checking it out. The software is using the built in text to speech engine. Within the Flip Side software when editing a racer there is a speak button. This should say the name entered if it did not then there is something up with the text to speech.

If that does not work then you need to check your text to speech settings.

Which OS are you using, Mac, Windows or Linux?

In Windows go to your control panel and test the speech option in there. Most of the spoken words are using the built in text to speech so you can test it in there.

In Mac go to the system preferences to adjust settings.

And if you are using Linux then the text to speech does not work but it should switch to using the wav files for the count down.

You other problem is a bigger concern, lap times only in seconds? What were you looking at when you saw that, the graph page lap times table? If you do a report does it also show only seconds? What about a HFAY export? Could you send me your FlipSideDB file in the program directory so I can look closer? my email is pinwc4 flipsidehobbies.com

pinwc4
2009.01.15, 06:38 PM
I didn't have anything else that needed configured. other then setting the voice to the microsoft sara.

I did have an issue with one of my tags, it would scan in but not count and it was isolated to only this one tag. all the others that I tried worked.

I did notice that it won't allow you to have multiple of the same name, even though they are in different classes.

I was trying to setup each car in the different classes with Brian as the name for each. This was a little bit of a problem because then I had to put in Brian F1, and that is what the audio was saying as well.

Interesting about the tag, not sure what is up with that but my guess is the signal strength with it is not quite good enough for when it is in motion. During a race with that tag if you stop on the core loop and it does pick up laps but does not while moving fast then it is a signal strength issue. That is the first test I would try.

In regards to names though, yes, I am using the name as a unique entity. I could add a second field for pronouncing the name, so it does not speak the name field instead this other field if entered. I think this would be good anyways because I use the name pinwc4 but I would rather it just announce my actual name of Jeremy.

I think too much is linked into requiring unique names for me to be able to easily change it to allow multiple cars with the same name. It would lead to the laps and results getting assigned incorrectly in the database. But I will take a look at the code to see if I can change this easily

leonen
2009.01.16, 06:38 AM
You other problem is a bigger concern, lap times only in seconds? What were you looking at when you saw that, the graph page lap times table? If you do a report does it also show only seconds? What about a HFAY export? Could you send me your FlipSideDB file in the program directory so I can look closer? my email is pinwc4 flipsidehobbies.com

I saw that everywhere. In the Race Screen, in the graphs, in the reports. Did not checked the HFAY. Tomorrow I'm going to my track and i'll send you the database later.

You could use the tags uniqe ID as the unique identifier.... not the name. I think it should not be so repetitive.

pinwc4
2009.01.16, 01:58 PM
I saw that everywhere. In the Race Screen, in the graphs, in the reports. Did not checked the HFAY. Tomorrow I'm going to my track and i'll send you the database later.

You could use the tags uniqe ID as the unique identifier.... not the name. I think it should not be so repetitive.

What OS and version of the OS are you running? For example Windows XP, Mac OSX 10.5, Ubuntu 8.04 etc.?

For the unique ID the problem is the code has the expectation in some areas of only getting one match to a name. Right now if I just allowed multiple of the same name some of the records would get mixed up. It could be changed to use the UID of the RFID but it looks like it is more than just a quick change. Plus right now with the way it is set up you can actually share RFID's and create different names, but with them being so cheap I do not think that is a big plus.

I will look into it further.

pinwc4
2009.01.27, 08:47 PM
Status update on the software. I have done a little more work on the software but it is still incomplete so now new builds yet.

It is set now so that you can put in multiple racers with the same name. This requires a database change so when I release this version you will want to make a copy of the database just in case the upgrade goes wrong.

I am also adding a pronunciation field so you can have the software say a different name than the nick name you put for the car but have not finished the software logic quite yet.

I have fixed a bug that caused it so that sometimes the scan of tags before a race would never end so when you start a race it will not detect tags. I am not sure if other people encountered this or not.

The software will no longer announce the time remaining at the beginning of a race if the race is 1,2,5,10,15 or 30 minutes long.

I am still working a little on the software but plan on releasing a new build by next weekend.


In regards to my hardware I have done some work on that side also. I have a new unit that I am going to be testing at our next race night next weekend. Hopefully I know have a fully functional unit. It works in my workshop but until I get it to the track I will not know if it works well enough. I will update people on this after the race night.

I have went through quite a few revisions of this and it feels like it is very close....

pinwc4
2009.02.05, 09:50 PM
A new release for Windows and Mac OS X is available. Go to http://www.flipsideracing.org/projects/fslapcounter/ to download the latest version.

The following changes of interest were made since the last release:

- Database modified to use the UID as the unique key for a racer. This allows you to have multiple racers with the same name as long as the RFID tag used is different

- Fixed a bug found by leonen that prevented people who had the , set as a decimal separator from seeing hundredths of a second. Thanks for working with me on this leonen

- Fixed a bug where you could have a person in a race that could not be removed if you overwrote the slot they were in with another racer without first removing them from the slot

- raceparts.xml updated to include more chassis (can be easily modified though with a text editor)

You can always see the full changelog here:
http://www.flipsideracing.org/projects/fslapcounter/log/trunk

As usual backup your software first before using the upgrade zips. I have only done a few test runs at my desk. I will test it more thoroughly this weekend at our races.

pinwc4
2009.02.10, 10:21 PM
We used the software for last weekends races without any problems. We used the latest version for our hour long races on a large track

If anyone runs into any bugs let me know. For those of you who have taken the time to give feedback, Thank you. It helps improve the software for everyone.

One person reported a significant bug, the live graphing is not working for them. Has anyone else ran into this?

Oh, and I am excited about the next release. 2 major features are finished that will be in it along with other minor tweaks and bug fixes. One is the ability to have more than 8 racers in a race. The limit is moving up to 24 racers if you have a large enough screen (1920x1280). You can also change the spacing between the rows on the race screen to help fit more people on it.

The second major feature added is the automatic adding of racers to a race when they cross the antenna loop. You can actually start a race with no one added and as they cross the loop the first time the software will automatically add them to the race.

arch2b
2009.02.10, 10:31 PM
the 2nd feature sounds awsome! perfect for a rolling start.

arch2b
2009.02.10, 11:02 PM
could you provide a tutorial on modifying the theme?

for example, how do you remove the flipsideracing logo's from the page views?

pinwc4
2009.02.11, 05:32 PM
could you provide a tutorial on modifying the theme?

for example, how do you remove the flipsideracing logo's from the page views?

No spiffy tutorials yet but I do have a small How Do I section on the website that answers a few of your questions.

You can find it here:
http://www.flipsideracing.org/projects/fslapcounter/wiki/HowDoI

It describes where to change the background, the logo on the main and race config screens and how to change the logo that is used for reports.

There are not a lot of theming options yet.....

soyverde
2009.02.11, 05:32 PM
Arch: You can edit the 'theme.xml' file to use an image of your choice (including a blank image), that has been added to the 'themes' folder. Just change the data within the 'mainlogo' XML tag. If you don't want a blank image you will need a mask as well (selected via the 'mainlogomask' tag). I'll be happy to create one for the DC GTG logo once I can find a copy (haven't done anything with that in years). A quick route to no image is a file with one black pixel for both the logo and mask (note that the empty.jpg file is not a blank image).

pinwc4: Neat piece of software. I do wish you'd chosen a more accessible language, but opening the source on lap counting software for the community is an incredibly cool act on your part. :cool:

Edit: :) What he said ^

briankstan
2009.02.11, 07:22 PM
I thought you made a change that allowed you to have a Name and then also put in a Name to get the the text to speech to pronounce the name correctly. I guess that was changed when you are using the UID as the name now. Is that correct?

Oh, is there a way to make the time call outs at a certain time, say when running an endurance race it would be nice to call out the time remaining every 10 minutes or so.

Looking forward to the next release.

arch2b
2009.02.11, 07:33 PM
Arch: You can edit the 'theme.xml' file to use an image of your choice (including a blank image), that has been added to the 'themes' folder. Just change the data within the 'mainlogo' XML tag. If you don't want a blank image you will need a mask as well (selected via the 'mainlogomask' tag). I'll be happy to create one for the DC GTG logo once I can find a copy (haven't done anything with that in years). A quick route to no image is a file with one black pixel for both the logo and mask (note that the empty.jpg file is not a blank image).

pinwc4: Neat piece of software. I do wish you'd chosen a more accessible language, but opening the source on lap counting software for the community is an incredibly cool act on your part. :cool:

Edit: :) What he said ^
i tried modifying it with my basic skills and understanding. i was able to get our club background in but it's litterally half the full background image size yet shows perfectly in the default window size when the software opens. i don't have a clue how that works... yes, i was trying to simply remove the logo from the various screens in general.

i'd like to try this at one of our club races. i'd even like to try it with the generic core tags i bought.

arch2b
2009.02.11, 07:34 PM
I thought you made a change that allowed you to have a Name and then also put in a Name to get the the text to speech to pronounce the name correctly. I guess that was changed when you are using the UID as the name now. Is that correct?

Oh, is there a way to make the time call outs at a certain time, say when running an endurance race it would be nice to call out the time remaining every 10 minutes or so.

Looking forward to the next release.

i could not get that feature to do anything on my laptop. not sure how it is supossed to work?

briankstan
2009.02.11, 07:48 PM
I have the audio working fine, I just have to put in "Bryan" to get my name to sound right, but I would like to still be able to put in my name spelled correctly. oh and to get it to say "Cygen" I have to put in Sy Jin and this would prefer a feild for the name and a field for the text to speech.

arch2b
2009.02.11, 09:07 PM
ok, figured out what i was doing wrong:rolleyes:

very quick test and the generic transponders work perfectly.

the export to hfay results is simply AWSOME! god that is soo easy to do with this software.

pinwc4
2009.02.11, 10:15 PM
pinwc4: Neat piece of software. I do wish you'd chosen a more accessible language, but opening the source on lap counting software for the community is an incredibly cool act on your part. :cool:

Edit: :) What he said ^

Thanks. The choice of which language to go with was difficult to make but I would not be anywhere near as far along with this project if I had went Java, C++ or some other more standard language. I looked at quite a few languages and even did small test apps in many of them before settling on RealBasic. It has its advantages and disadvantages just as any language does.

If you know VB you will be able to pick up RealBasic easily. And you can download the IDE for free. The IDE works in Mac, Windows or Linux so most people could give it a try.

The catch is when you compile the app it will only run for 10 minutes unless you buy a license. I have purchased a license though so I can compile things for people. If you have a custom tweak you want to do just send me a link to the code and I will compile it for you. Or if you want to contribute to the project let me know, I would be happy to get more help.

pinwc4
2009.02.11, 10:18 PM
I thought you made a change that allowed you to have a Name and then also put in a Name to get the the text to speech to pronounce the name correctly. I guess that was changed when you are using the UID as the name now. Is that correct?

Oh, is there a way to make the time call outs at a certain time, say when running an endurance race it would be nice to call out the time remaining every 10 minutes or so.

Looking forward to the next release.

In the last release I switched it to allowing you to have multiple racers with the same name as long as the UID is unique. I do not have the code done yet for having a separate pronunciation field yet but still plan on doing it.

The time call outs are hard coded at the moment but I will eventually allow them to be configured. This is also needed so it can support multiple languages as right now the text to speech is all in English.

pinwc4
2009.02.11, 10:22 PM
i tried modifying it with my basic skills and understanding. i was able to get our club background in but it's litterally half the full background image size yet shows perfectly in the default window size when the software opens. i don't have a clue how that works... yes, i was trying to simply remove the logo from the various screens in general.

i'd like to try this at one of our club races. i'd even like to try it with the generic core tags i bought.

You are bring up a good point that I forgot about.

When the background image is applied it does not scale to the window size. For my default image I made a background that was 1920x1200 with a repeating pattern so if people resized it you would still see the pattern. The application applies the background starting at the upper left corner. If you use a really large image it will only show the portion equal to the window size.

Does that make sense?

arch2b
2009.02.11, 11:03 PM
yes, i believe so.

any custom background should be 1920x1200 and placed in the upper left corner, correct.

pinwc4
2009.02.11, 11:07 PM
i could not get that feature to do anything on my laptop. not sure how it is supossed to work?

Are you referring to the audio callouts during the race? If you are not hearing any of them, race starting countdown, best laps, race ending, time remaining etc. then the text to speech is not working.

To check the text to speech in Windows go to your control panel. In there should be a icon for Speech. You can configure the options in there. I would recommend the Microsoft Mary voice. If you do not have that option you can get a couple of additional voices by downloading Microsofts SAPI SDK here:
http://download.microsoft.com/download/speechSDK/SDK/5.1/WXP/EN-US/SpeechSDK51.exe

pinwc4
2009.02.11, 11:12 PM
yes, i believe so.

any custom background should be 1920x1200 and placed in the upper left corner, correct.



Correct but it does not have to be that large, I just made the default background included that large since very few people have a monitor with a larger resolution than that. As long as you make the background image resolution at least the same as your monitor resolution you will be fine.

soyverde
2009.02.12, 09:37 AM
Thanks. The choice of which language to go with was difficult to make but I would not be anywhere near as far along with this project if I had went Java, C++ or some other more standard language. I looked at quite a few languages and even did small test apps in many of them before settling on RealBasic. It has its advantages and disadvantages just as any language does.

If you know VB you will be able to pick up RealBasic easily. And you can download the IDE for free. The IDE works in Mac, Windows or Linux so most people could give it a try.

The catch is when you compile the app it will only run for 10 minutes unless you buy a license. I have purchased a license though so I can compile things for people. If you have a custom tweak you want to do just send me a link to the code and I will compile it for you. Or if you want to contribute to the project let me know, I would be happy to get more help.

Actually, the proprietary/paid compiler issue was the only reason I made the comment (I know next to nothing about RealBasic from a practical standpoint). I haven't worked with VB for many years, and I doubt I'd be of any use in that respect (currently spoiled by Ruby). I'll be happy to help wherever I can, though, and based on Arch's reaction it looks like we'll be running the software at GTGs soon...the GUI is nice, but I don't have a core loop handy to do any real testing.

pinwc4
2009.02.13, 10:57 PM
A new version is available. You can download the latest build of the software here:
http://www.flipsideracing.org/

Make a backup copy before using the latest version. I have not tested this thoroughly yet and will not get to until next weekends races.

A lot of significant code changes were done for this build. Some of the changes of interest are:

- You can now add up to 24 racers to a race. To change the max number of racers go to the Config screen. How many racers you can see depends on how big your screen is. You can tweak the space between rows to fit more people on the screen. The row spacing setting is also in the Config screen.

- Racers are automatically added to a race when they cross the antenna loop as long as they have a racer defined ahead of time.

- You can start a race with no racers in it

- You can set the race to delete all the previous racers when starting a new race. This in combination with automatically adding racers to the race when they first cross the loop is a very handy. You must enable this setting in the Config screen, it is off by default.

- Time per lap graph can be viewed live now.

- A pronounced name field has been added to the racers fields. This is usefull if the text to speech does not say the name right, or you want to use a real name in the speech but a nickname for the results.

- Time remaining will be announced at 10 minute intervals. At less than 10 minutes it will announce at 5 minutes, 2 minutes, 1 minute and 30 seconds

- Added button to select racer screen that will remove all racers from the slots

Bug fixes

- Removed lap 0 from live graph

- Fixed bug that would cause live graph not to update if the first racer added to a race did not have any laps

- Race results no longer store racers that did not complete any laps

- Event results will not be stored if no racers completed any laps

- Time remaining will be announced when you are on the graph screen

- Best lap is properly detected now when a racer is added during a race

Known new bugs

- When changing row spacing in Windows it will create some artifacts. Switching screens clears them.

- There is a second one that I now do not remember......

briankstan
2009.02.14, 03:39 PM
I'm having a problem connectingn to the Core Unit, I select the correct com port but it still isn't reading the tags. any insight to this?

pinwc4
2009.02.14, 05:54 PM
I'm having a problem connectingn to the Core Unit, I select the correct com port but it still isn't reading the tags. any insight to this?

Not off hand no, and a previous version worked fine for you correct?

Are you just trying the scan button on the Select Racers screen? If so see if it will read the tags on the Edit Racer Screen or even start a race and see if it picks up the tag.

Are these new tags or were they already entered into the system?

If you did an upgrade you might try a clean version of the software instead and see if it has the same problem.

Are the tags in a car when you are trying this or are holding them to test them make sure you do not touch the metal of the antenna, it will make it hard to read the generic tags since the antenna is exposed? I had that trouble earlier when I was testing.

pinwc4
2009.02.14, 06:16 PM
Not sure if this is what you are running into but I played around some and was able to cause a similar problem for myself.

If I set it to the wrong COM port and try to scan a tag, then switch it to the correct COM port and try to scan it will not work until the software is closed and reopened (a bug somewhere that I need to find.)

If you download a new copy of the software and try to scan at first without changing the COM port this will happen because the default COM port is wrong.

Maybe that is what you ran into?

briankstan
2009.02.14, 06:52 PM
quite possible, I did get it to work though. I really like the feature of starting a race without adding the racers before hand. it's a nice touch, especially for practice races when I switch from one car to another.

pinwc4
2009.02.14, 10:20 PM
I did a minor update. It fixes the bug I mentioned above about switching COM ports. If you downloaded version .11 and have it configured and working you do not need to download this version, .12.

briankstan
2009.02.15, 07:47 PM
A few things I've noticed.

1. when you generate the report based on the race, it counts the laps in 0:00.00, but the overall race time per racer is in 000.00 format which is hard to calculate time when just looking at it. Me personally I prefer everything in the 0:00.00 format, it might just be me but I think it's easier to understand and read.

2. Would it be possible to select multiply races and then generate the HFAY Report? is would come in hand to select both mains of Race 1 and generate the report with both results, they can be combined easy enough, it would just be a nice bonus. (saves a little cut and paste).;)

3. The automatic scanning of cars is Feaking Awesome ! I love it. :D

4. The call outs for overall fastest lap and individual racers fastest laps it a great add in. I keeps things interactive with the timing system and the racers during the race, especially if you don't have someone sitting at the computer. Another great feature. :cool:

5. The call outs at 10 minute intervels will sure be welcome in long endurance races.

I'd have to say this is a great update, I think we'll use it live for the first time at our HFAY Race this thursday. :D

briankstan
2009.02.16, 08:43 PM
One other thing I'd like to see added is the finish place call outs after the race is complete.

in First place...Name
in Second place....Name
etc..

but I'm really liking this software more and more as I use it.

pinwc4
2009.02.17, 10:06 PM
Those are all great suggestions Brian. So far I have the 2 easy suggestions already done.

The next release will announce the final ranking at the end of the race and the summary table on the statistics screen and generated report will show the time in the DD:HH:MM:SS.ss format like the race screen shows.

I will have to give the ability to select multiple races for a HFAY export some thought before implementing it. The statistics screen logic was built around the assumption of one race being displayed at a time so there is a bit of extra work for this. Maybe I will have the HFAY button pop up a separate window that lets you select 1 or more races defaulting to the currently selected race. It would also be good for this to have logic to filter out duplicate racer entries (although maybe not since people do share cars.)

leonen
2009.02.18, 11:40 AM
One thing i forgot to ask about the soft, If we want it to speak in Spanish, not in English, will it really talk in Spanish? or will it use the Spanish voice configured in the speech system to say English phrases ?

I guess the phrases to speak aloud are hard coded into the program, right? Perhaps using an XML file would make this user-configurable and solve the problem if it exists.

briankstan
2009.02.18, 12:27 PM
I will have to give the ability to select multiple races for a HFAY export some thought before implementing it. The statistics screen logic was built around the assumption of one race being displayed at a time so there is a bit of extra work for this. Maybe I will have the HFAY button pop up a separate window that lets you select 1 or more races defaulting to the currently selected race. It would also be good for this to have logic to filter out duplicate racer entries (although maybe not since people do share cars.)

When you take the times from multiple races and generate the HFAY report, or the standard HTML report, if you add a sort from top to bottom as a rank for fastest to slowest. This could be used to create a report that you can use to break down the mains if you were to use the software for a big event. it wouldn't add the racers in, but with the "auto add" feature you really only need a list of who is in the race.

pinwc4
2009.02.18, 06:45 PM
One thing i forgot to ask about the soft, If we want it to speak in Spanish, not in English, will it really talk in Spanish? or will it use the Spanish voice configured in the speech system to say English phrases ?

I guess the phrases to speak aloud are hard coded into the program, right? Perhaps using an XML file would make this user-configurable and solve the problem if it exists.

It would be a mix at the moment. Many of the phrases would be English in a Spanish voice while the numbers would be Spanish. At least I think.

Anyway I am part way done with this. You can see the english XML file checked into the source code here:
http://www.flipsideracing.org/svn/trunk/translations/americanenglish.xml

For now the software will load a language file out of the root application directory called language.xml. So use the above example file and put in the Spanish text instead.

The problem with this approach is in some translations the sentence structure will not be identical. For example in english I would format a sentence such as "In 1st place, " + name, or number + "hours and" + number + "minutes remaining" or "fastest lap by" + name + laptime. The translation file will let you change what is between the quotes but if the sentence structure between languages is not the same then it may sound a little odd still.

I will probably have the code complete this week or next.

briankstan
2009.02.19, 12:17 PM
Those are all great suggestions Brian. So far I have the 2 easy suggestions already done.

The next release will announce the final ranking at the end of the race and the summary table on the statistics screen and generated report will show the time in the DD:HH:MM:SS.ss format like the race screen shows.

any chance you can post an update with the features you have done? We are racing tonight and I'd love to have these in there.

thanks.

leonen
2009.02.19, 04:44 PM
It would be a mix at the moment. Many of the phrases would be English in a Spanish voice while the numbers would be Spanish. At least I think.

Anyway I am part way done with this. You can see the english XML file checked into the source code here:
http://www.flipsideracing.org/svn/trunk/translations/americanenglish.xml

For now the software will load a language file out of the root application directory called language.xml. So use the above example file and put in the Spanish text instead.

The problem with this approach is in some translations the sentence structure will not be identical. For example in english I would format a sentence such as "In 1st place, " + name, or number + "hours and" + number + "minutes remaining" or "fastest lap by" + name + laptime. The translation file will let you change what is between the quotes but if the sentence structure between languages is not the same then it may sound a little odd still.

I will probably have the code complete this week or next.

Sincerely fantastic!!!! I think we can work it out about the spanish translations. Ping us when you have the new code ready.

We're still fighting with our dumb machine to have the speech soft working.:mad:

pinwc4
2009.02.19, 04:58 PM
any chance you can post an update with the features you have done? We are racing tonight and I'd love to have these in there.

thanks.

link removed download latest from web site.

There you go. Now a warning. This version has not even been bench tested by me. I went ahead and posted it because I will not be able to test it tonight but it sounds like you can.......

I have not updated the links on the website, made the upgrade version or even built the software for other platforms. That link is to a Windows build of the current source. The differences to the last build is as follows:

- Statistics screen and report show time in DD:HH:MM:SS.ss format

- Final rank is announced at the end of the race

- language.xml file added so you can do translations of the speech in the program

- bug fixed in the lap race format that caused race to immediatly end if no racers were defined initially

- if a racer has 0 laps at the end of a race they are removed instead of the program waiting for them to complete a lap

- And it now has the ability to use flip on and off a set of physical lights for the starting and stopping of a race. This means you could have a giant stop light tied to the computer. The light would change from Red to Yellow to Green for the start of the race and the opposite at the end. I am using the DLP Designs 4 port relay board for this. DLPIO4R is the part number. Just tie the lights to this relayboard and select the com port in the program.

briankstan
2009.02.19, 05:04 PM
thanks, I'll download it when I get home and test it some before everyone arrives.

I'll let you know how it goes.

pinwc4
2009.02.20, 09:49 AM
In case anyone is curious here is the link to the relay board you would use to be able to control start/stop lights for a race.

http://www.dlpdesign.com/usb/ior4.shtml

I would recommend buying the part from Mouser.

The control scheme is hard coded so far. The relays will switch between port A and B on terminals 1 through 4.

The program when starting up will set terminals 1-3 to port B and terminal 4 to port A. During the countdown at 2 seconds it will switch terminal 4 to port B and terminal 3 to port A, at 1 second it will switch terminal 3 to port B and terminal 2 to port A, and finally at the race start it will switch terminal 2 to port B and terminal 1 to port A. After a race has hit the time limit it will then switch terminal 1 to port b and terminal 2 to port A. When the race is complete it will revert back to the original state by switching terminal 2 to port B and terminal 4 to port A.

What this means is if you had 4 lights you would tie them each to port A on the relay board. You would tie a red light to terminal 4 port a, a green light to terminal 1 port a, and yellow lights to port a on terminals 2 and 3. So light 4 would be lit until 2 seconds in the countdown which then would switch to light 3, then at 1 second it would switch to light 2, then while the race is going it would switch to light 1. When the time limit is reached it will then switch to light 2, and when the race is complete it will switch to light 4.

Or if you want to just use 3 lights instead of 4 all you have to do is tie port A of terminals 3 and 4 to the same light.

I hope this makes sense to someone other than me. Anyway I am really excited about this. I do not have my stop light wired yet but we do have a real yellow stop light we are going to use.

briankstan
2009.02.20, 10:06 AM
We ran the races successfully with the Flipside racing software last night. I don’t have any major things to report just a small thing or two.

1. The software is using the “Name” field when lead changes occur, instead of the “Pronunciation” field. I was using naming like “Brian F1” to the cars would be easily recognized, and I noticed that it was calling out that field. Might just want to check the audio callouts, as I’m sure this was just missed when adding the “Pronunciation” field.

2. I noticed a flicker at the time as it was counting down. I never noticed this before because you can’t watch the screen and the race at the same time. While watching the races I wasn’t in I noticed. It. (didn’t affect anything)

3. Once in a while it will pull a car from the previous race and display it on the race screen; this happened a few times and shows no laps and a time of 99.999 or something like that. It didn’t affect anything as that car wasn’t in the race.

4. When I expand the to full screen I get a black bar running down the middle of the display (actually it’s at the edge of where the standard size window was).

Everyone thought that the “auto add” was great; it made getting the race ready to go, and changing racers in a race a breeze.

pinwc4
2009.02.20, 11:20 AM
We ran the races successfully with the Flipside racing software last night. I don’t have any major things to report just a small thing or two.

1. The software is using the “Name” field when lead changes occur, instead of the “Pronunciation” field. I was using naming like “Brian F1” to the cars would be easily recognized, and I noticed that it was calling out that field. Might just want to check the audio callouts, as I’m sure this was just missed when adding the “Pronunciation” field.

2. I noticed a flicker at the time as it was counting down. I never noticed this before because you can’t watch the screen and the race at the same time. While watching the races I wasn’t in I noticed. It. (didn’t affect anything)

3. Once in a while it will pull a car from the previous race and display it on the race screen; this happened a few times and shows no laps and a time of 99.999 or something like that. It didn’t affect anything as that car wasn’t in the race.

4. When I expand the to full screen I get a black bar running down the middle of the display (actually it’s at the edge of where the standard size window was).

Everyone thought that the “auto add” was great; it made getting the race ready to go, and changing racers in a race a breeze.

You are corrected about bug 1. I missed that one. I have already fixed it in the source code. I checked through the code and that looks like it was the only spot missed but I will check again later just in case.

Bug 4 is also already fixed in the source code. Just need 1 line of code to take care of that issue.

Bug 3 is interesting. Did this happen right when a race would start or just randomly during a race? Did the racers that appeared have duplicate names? If you can send me your FlipSideDB file that may give me a little more idea of what happened. We run our races tomorrow so maybe I will see this bug also.

Bug 2, fun little bug 2. I have been trying to solve that one for quite some time. It effects Windows XP and earlier, Windows Vista does not have the problem. I can make the flicker go away in XP but then without a lot of extra work I lose the transparency with the background I am using for that text.

briankstan
2009.02.20, 11:34 AM
Bug 3 is interesting. Did this happen right when a race would start or just randomly during a race? Did the racers that appeared have duplicate names? If you can send me your FlipSideDB file that may give me a little more idea of what happened. We run our races tomorrow so maybe I will see this bug also.

I'll send you the DB later today, and note what races it was doing it in.

pinwc4
2009.02.20, 08:00 PM
A new release of the software has been made. New downloads are available on the site for Mac OSX and Windows.

http://www.flipsideracing.org/

Since that last interim build on Thursday this version has the following improvements:

- NO MORE FLICKERING FOR THE TIMER. I finally realized a trick I could do that would work to get rid of that problem while still making it look like there is transparency.

- If the window is resized a refresh is forced to get rid of any graphic glitches that can occur.

- When a lead change occurs it now uses the name pronunciation field instead of the regular name field for announcing it.

- Got rid of a crash bug that can occur if you tried to start a race before creating any racers.

While this is a short list of updates I wanted to get some tweaks done and released before we raced tomorrow.

If you have not downloaded an updated version within the past week you should. A lot of major improvements happened in the past couple of weeks.

Thanks again to everyone that has been trying this out and giving me feedback.

BrianMidnight
2009.02.20, 08:54 PM
A new release of the software has been made. New downloads are available on the site for Mac OSX and Windows.

http://www.flipsideracing.org/


Downloaded using above link openned the software and main screen indicates version 0.12!!!...... So I'm not certain I have 0.16???
can you confirm please.
ps.. a very big thank you for your time spent developing this software.

pinwc4
2009.02.20, 09:00 PM
Downloaded using above link openned the software and main screen indicates version 0.12!!!...... So I'm not certain I have 0.16???
can you confirm please.
ps.. a very big thank you for your time spent developing this software.

Very odd, I just downloaded it using the link and got version 0.16. You might try clearing out your browsers cache.

If you have version 0.16 it will say that in the bottom left hand corner of the main screen.

BrianMidnight
2009.02.20, 09:04 PM
I'll try again

BrianMidnight
2009.02.20, 09:16 PM
Cracked it... thanks again it now says 0.16. Should be using your software this Sunday for HFAY I'll report in afterwards

pinwc4
2009.02.22, 02:59 PM
3. Once in a while it will pull a car from the previous race and display it on the race screen; this happened a few times and shows no laps and a time of 99.999 or something like that. It didn’t affect anything as that car wasn’t in the race.


We ran our HFAY races this weekend using the auto add feature but were not able to duplicate this bug. Do you have more info? Did it happen any time during a race or just the beginning or end?

We did run into 1 bug to watch out for though. If the time limit has been reached but not all the racers have crossed the finish it will still auto add a new person to the race. But since the timer had already ran out they just can keep running indefinately, you have to manually end the race. This has been fixed in the source and will be in the next release.

briankstan
2009.02.22, 03:29 PM
We ran our HFAY races this weekend using the auto add feature but were not able to duplicate this bug. Do you have more info? Did it happen any time during a race or just the beginning or end?

We did run into 1 bug to watch out for though. If the time limit has been reached but not all the racers have crossed the finish it will still auto add a new person to the race. But since the timer had already ran out they just can keep running indefinately, you have to manually end the race. This has been fixed in the source and will be in the next release.

I was looking through the data to send to you , but it wasn't there, it only happened on the screen, once I looked at the data it wasn't there. it only happened at the end of the race 1 time.

I ran into the same little thing where I had to click end race one time. the times per car didn't continue once each racer was done, so I didn't remember it until you reading your post above.

pinwc4
2009.02.22, 05:27 PM
I was looking through the data to send to you , but it wasn't there, it only happened on the screen, once I looked at the data it wasn't there. it only happened at the end of the race 1 time.


If they did not get any laps they will not have results stored for that race. I wanted to look at your flipsidedb file to see if something was odd for any of the racers themselves such as a corrupt or duplicate UID or something. I am not sure what would have caused this. Did the person that got mistakingly added have the same name as another racer?

briankstan
2009.02.22, 06:06 PM
it was my son that was added, and nobody else has the same name or the same transponders.

I'll email you the db so you can look though it.

BrianMidnight
2009.02.22, 08:29 PM
Stafford Racers UK ran your software today and were "knocked out" what a fantastic race experience you have created for us. The vocal information during practice and racing for every racer, fast or slow, is awesome.
We used the program for 8 hours, never having to reboot our WINDOWS 7 desktop. What a pleasure scanning in is, compared to its predecessor, no more move the car forward..backwards..forward again.. backwards again.. turn round the other way.."try it on it roof" etc etc.
We are so "chuffed" with your development we insist on making a financial contribution in appreciation of your work so far. Please pm me a Paypal account to credit.
Once again thanks a million for taking the racing experience to another level.

briankstan
2009.02.22, 11:36 PM
Stafford Racers UK ran your software today and were "knocked out" what a fantastic race experience you have created for us. The vocal information during practice and racing for every racer, fast or slow, is awesome.
We used the program for 8 hours, never having to reboot our WINDOWS 7 desktop. What a pleasure scanning in is, compared to its predecessor, no more move the car forward..backwards..forward again.. backwards again.. turn round the other way.."try it on it roof" etc etc.
We are so "chuffed" with your development we insist on making a financial contribution in appreciation of your work so far. Please pm me a Paypal account to credit.
Once again thanks a million for taking the racing experience to another level.

I told you, you would like it. :D

BrianMidnight
2009.02.23, 04:59 AM
I told you, you would like it. :D

Yea...but "like" is an understatement::)

pinwc4
2009.02.23, 10:47 PM
I am glad to hear that other people are finding this useful.

In regards to helping out the project I can use help programming, writing documentation, creating graphics or even straight donation. I have added a donation link to the website that uses Paypal. Use the donation button so I can track the donations separately from my own personal Paypal account as I will only use those funds toward furthering the development of the software.

Thanks again for everyone's help with making this software useful.

byebye
2009.02.23, 10:56 PM
BRIANMIDNITE just hit me up tonight to give it a try. I have to say it's a must! I love the text to speech feature and I love the fact that it gives the fastest lap as well as fastest lap for each driver during the race. I won't be running the old software any more.

Kris

BrianMidnight
2009.02.24, 08:17 AM
I am glad to hear that other people are finding this useful.
I have added a donation link to the website that uses Paypal. Use the donation button so I can track the donations separately from my own personal Paypal account as I will only use those funds toward furthering the development of the software.



Donation sent:)

BrianMidnight
2009.02.24, 08:36 AM
In case anyone is curious here is the link to the relay board you would use to be able to control start/stop lights for a race.

http://www.dlpdesign.com/usb/ior4.shtml

.

Do I need to order the "test application" that appears on the same page?

pinwc4
2009.02.24, 10:22 AM
Donation sent:)

Thank you, I have received it. I will make sure to put it to good use.

briankstan
2009.02.24, 10:23 AM
It’s about time that you guys started testing out with the Flipside Timing Software. It really is a great program. The Last few releases have seen some great improvements and have really made the timing and racing experience come together as one.

For those of you that are reading this and are using core as your timing system, You really should do yourself and your club a favor and give it a try. You won’t regret it. Pinwc4 has done an excellent job with this software. I haven’t had any major issues with it and as features are added in it becomes better and better.

pinwc4
2009.02.24, 10:29 AM
Do I need to order the "test application" that appears on the same page?

No, you just need the board itself. I have written the logic into the software to control the board. You configure it just like the Core lapcounter by selecting which COM port it is on.

As a note do not use a light bulb greater than 60 watts on a relay. The way it is currently setup you can have up to 4 60watt bulbs. If you need a bulb greater than that then right now there are 2 options.

One option is to tie 2 relays together, then you can use a 120watt bulb. But then you only get to switch 2 outputs so you would only have a start/stop light. If someone wants to use larger bulbs this way let me know, I need to add a little bit of programming logic to support it.

The other option is to buy a bigger relay and use this relay board to switch those external relays which will be a bit of a wiring mess but you could get huge 300watt bulbs if you wanted.

BrianMidnight
2009.02.24, 11:03 AM
Would it be possible to include a frequency / crystal data base for inclusion in the race car registration or specific information?

mk2kompressor
2009.02.24, 12:02 PM
will this work with giro-z?
we cant get the built in microsoft voice loud enough on our flaco software:(

briankstan
2009.02.24, 12:42 PM
will this work with giro-z?
we cant get the built in microsoft voice loud enough on our flaco software:(

I run my laptop audio to a speaker box. this way I can crank up the audio so everyone can hear it.

mk2kompressor
2009.02.24, 01:24 PM
same here but the voice is a different volume to the race sounds

pinwc4
2009.02.24, 01:54 PM
Would it be possible to include a frequency / crystal data base for inclusion in the race car registration or specific information?

Yes that should be pretty easy. I will have it read from an xml file called crystals.xml to populate the popup menu like the others on the edit racer screen. I will have to have it do a database upgrade in the background though since frequency is not in the table for racer settings. But I should be able to have this done this weekend.

pinwc4
2009.02.24, 01:57 PM
will this work with giro-z?
we cant get the built in microsoft voice loud enough on our flaco software:(

Not right now it does not. I do not know enough about that hardware to know how difficult it would be. It looks like the USB hardware is using a RS232 to USB adapter so if you sniffed the RS232 data when a race starts and people get some laps I would have a better idea of how much work it would be.

Also as a note though is the Flip Side software does not do tournament management like the Flaco software does so it may not suite your needs anyways. Some day I will have that but it is still a ways off.

briankstan
2009.02.24, 02:13 PM
Yes that should be pretty easy. But I should be able to have this done this weekend.

Don't forget to have a selection for ASF or 2.4ghz..:)

pinwc4
2009.02.24, 05:32 PM
Don't forget to have a selection for ASF or 2.4ghz..:)

Here is the list so far:
http://www.flipsideracing.org/svn/trunk/crystals.xml

I have the code checked in for this. It will allow you to either select something from the list defined in the file above or just to type in whatever you want.

soyverde
2009.02.25, 01:54 PM
I forgot to chime in here after testing the software at a DC GTG last weekend. We had some minor issues under Win2k, but I think they were mainly issues with Win2k (and probably my lack of familiarity with both the software and Windows' voice options), rather than problems with your software. I will try to reproduce one of them (not scanning tags in the latest release) before I upgrade that laptop to XP, since it would be a show-stopper. I was in a hurry at the time though, and I'm not certain I tried resetting the COM port while encountering the problem (pebkac :rolleyes:).

Edit: I can't reproduce it, almost certainly user error (COM port issue) on my part.

We ran the prior release the entire day, as core was dropping every third lap in that location, and was essentially useless. Once race management functionality gets in there I don't think there's any chance we'll be using other software for our GTGs (and I'd already prefer this any time sorts aren't necessary). Thanks again for putting together a great package!

Sinister_Y
2009.02.25, 04:05 PM
Will this software support dual monitor setup at some point?

I ask since it would be helpful for operator/race administrator to have their CPU monitor and able to run race, but also a monitor (LCD Projector even) for team members/other competitors/enthusiasts to see?

Also, I had pm'd about a windows mobile version (for one car) for a smartphone? Anyone else interested?

briankstan
2009.02.25, 04:18 PM
Will this software support dual monitor setup at some point?

I ask since it would be helpful for operator/race administrator to have their CPU monitor and able to run race, but also a monitor (LCD Projector even) for team members/other competitors/enthusiasts to see?

Also, I had pm'd about a windows mobile version (for one car) for a smartphone? Anyone else interested?

you can easily run this with dual monitors, all you need to do is hook a projector to your computer if it supports it and select the appropriate settings and move it to the display you want it to work on. Pretty simple.

how would you power the timing unit from the smart phone, also I don't think that the battery in the phone would run the hardware in the timer.

Programmers
2009.02.25, 06:35 PM
pinwc4, we used your system on Sunday and we thought it was amazing. We were all very pleased by the array of cool features that is has. I would love to list them, but it would pretty much be everything anyway. The main thing for us was how simple it was to add and edit racers and add new cars. Me and Brian loved it and can see it saving us so much time in the future. It's most defiantly a valuable and essential edition to any club with a Core timing loop!

It's absolutely fantastic. Flawless, IMO. Thanks a bunch for making it so available for us clubs and for nothing!

Oh... And here's a piccy to show how strongly we feel:

http://staffordminizracers.co.uk/gallery/2009/images/02-22/27.jpg

Keep up the good work!

pinwc4
2009.02.25, 10:41 PM
Soyverde, I am glad to see you updated your post and were able to sort out your problems. I had not tested the software in Windows 2000 recently so I was worried some big bug had crept in for that OS.

Sinister_Y, yes in fact I do plan on adding dual monitor support. Mostly selfish reasons on my part, we run with a projector and I would like to have the projector display information independent of the monitor. Not sure how I am going to structure the screen yet though.

In regards to smart phones, that is just not possible with my software. New software would have to be written in a different language and as Brian mentioned it would be hard to interface the core lap counter to a phone, very few have the ability to plug USB devices into them.

pinwc4
2009.02.25, 10:45 PM
pinwc4, we used your system on Sunday and we thought it was amazing. We were all very pleased by the array of cool features that is has. I would love to list them, but it would pretty much be everything anyway. The main thing for us was how simple it was to add and edit racers and add new cars. Me and Brian loved it and can see it saving us so much time in the future. It's most defiantly a valuable and essential edition to any club with a Core timing loop!

It's absolutely fantastic. Flawless, IMO. Thanks a bunch for making it so available for us clubs and for nothing!

Keep up the good work!

Thanks for the awesome picture there. That really cheered me up. I am going to print that to hang in my workshop as a reminder.

So which one is you and BRIANMIDNITE?

Programmers
2009.02.26, 03:57 AM
Your very welcome anddd, Brian is the man in the very middle with the watch and hat.

Sinister_Y
2009.02.26, 09:21 AM
Thanks for the info fellas.

I haven't had much time for z's for the last little while but will get back into it pretty heavy soon. I'll definately give the software a go as it sounds awesome.

Good work.

mferrini
2009.02.27, 10:27 AM
Can you please tell us with wich linux version it works ?

pinwc4
2009.02.27, 01:30 PM
Can you please tell us with wich linux version it works ?

I have not tested the source code in Linux in a little while. The binary that I have on the site is from October. It was compiled on Ubuntu 8.04 but can run on other dists. The link to that download is:
http://www.flipsideracing.org/downloads/fsraceLinux.zip

I do not know if the latest version will compile as I have not tested in a while. I will try to test it this weekend. If it does compile it will be missing the text 2 speech component, I only have that working on OSX and Windows so far.

briankstan
2009.02.28, 04:50 PM
I've found a few other little things you might want to look at. I went to run some HFAY Time Trials and I set it up to a race by lap, set the laps to 50 and started the race, after I reached 50 laps the software didn't stop the race, it keep counting and the timer kept going as well. I though I must have set something wrong, but even by setting the time to 1 (the lowest is would accept) it still wouldn't stop at the correct lap count, I tried a couple of really short races 3, 5 laps and it did the same thing.

I then tried the lap and timed setting, the software kept ending the race the first time I crossed the loop.... :confused:

pinwc4
2009.02.28, 10:33 PM
I've found a few other little things you might want to look at. I went to run some HFAY Time Trials and I set it up to a race by lap, set the laps to 50 and started the race, after I reached 50 laps the software didn't stop the race, it keep counting and the timer kept going as well. I though I must have set something wrong, but even by setting the time to 1 (the lowest is would accept) it still wouldn't stop at the correct lap count, I tried a couple of really short races 3, 5 laps and it did the same thing.

I then tried the lap and timed setting, the software kept ending the race the first time I crossed the loop.... :confused:

I am pretty sure you are but make sure you are running version 0.16 or later. You can see the version number in the bottom left hand corner of the main screen. I know I fixed a bug just before version 0.16 about the race ending on the first lap for a lap and timed race if you were using the automatic adding to a race feature.

Unfortunately I can not duplicate this bug. I tried a few different ways, adding people to the race before it starting, letting the software add them automatically, enabling and disabling the remove racers at the start of a race feature and every time the race ended when each car hit the lap limit.

This leaves me confused also, inconsistent problems are much harder to track down. I will dig into the code some more and try testing some other scenarios to see if I can duplicate it.

briankstan
2009.03.01, 12:01 PM
yes it says version 0.16, I'll download a fresh copy and try it out today.

now another thing I've notice is, that on my laptop (14" widescreen) I can't see the bottom of the box and it is only sizable in in width. the resolution is set to the highest is will go at 1280 x 768 dpi.

briankstan
2009.03.01, 01:21 PM
one other think I noticed, in Windows Vista you need to select your web browser as the default application to open .xml files. (select either Mozilla or IE) depending on what browser you use. If you don't when you try to generate the race report you just get a text box with alot of coding in it.

I downloaded a fresh version and installed on my laptop (windows XP). It now doesn't end the "lap and Timed" races right as they start, however it doesn't end if you reach the set # of laps, but it does end when the time set is reached.

for the "Lap" Races it still doesn't end when the set # of Laps is reached. I'd have to say I'm stumped on this one.

I installed fresh version I downloaded this morning, the only thing I copied in was the flipsideDB file.

pinwc4
2009.03.01, 06:41 PM
Brian, thanks for the additional information. I changed the minimum resolution limit and set the bottom controls to move based on the location of the bottom of the window in the source so in the next build you should see the bottom of the window correctly.

In regards to opening the xml report I will have to play with that in Vista to see what I can do. Maybe what I will do is have Vista open up the html version of the report instead of the xml. I set Windows to do the xml report instead of html because in Windows 2000 my generation of the html report was getting duplicate lap entries and I am using a 3rd party library for this feature so I could not fix it myself. Maybe there is a way that I can tell Windows to open the file with a default web browser instead of the default application associated with the file type. Or I could even just give you the option of setting the program to open either the html or xml version, your choice. Either way I will figure something out.

Finally your big bug of not being able to do lap based races, I am still baffled. I looked at your db that you sent me and do not see a problem there. Just for a quick test can you try it with a new db instead of the existing. I need to rule things out as I have not been able to duplicate this.

briankstan
2009.03.01, 06:51 PM
I'll do some test with a new DB in a bit. I didn't think about that. I have been using the same DB file because it had all our racers in it.

briankstan
2009.03.01, 07:33 PM
if you set the .xml files to open with you web browser than it works fine. Vista has an option to edit the .xml file by right clicking on the file. this seems to work fine.

I downloaded a fresh copy unzipped it and ran it directly from the new folder. I only added one car and then tried a race by "laps" set it to 15 and started it up. I repeated this by using the auto add and by selecting the car from the racer list. Both times it continued to count and time past the selected # of laps.

When I selected the "lap and timed" race it again continued past the # of laps, but ended when the time limit was reached.

pinwc4
2009.03.01, 09:17 PM
if you set the .xml files to open with you web browser than it works fine. Vista has an option to edit the .xml file by right clicking on the file. this seems to work fine.

I downloaded a fresh copy unzipped it and ran it directly from the new folder. I only added one car and then tried a race by "laps" set it to 15 and started it up. I repeated this by using the auto add and by selecting the car from the racer list. Both times it continued to count and time past the selected # of laps.

When I selected the "lap and timed" race it again continued past the # of laps, but ended when the time limit was reached.

Yeah, I know you can assign a different program to open xmls but some people may have trouble figuring that out. I am trying to get this software to be as simple as possible.

Thanks for giving the completely fresh copy that a try. I wanted to rule that out as a possibility.

I was finally able to duplicate what you are running into. When I realized I had a copy of your DB I ran some races using that instead of my own racers. I ran races exactly the way you were with your database, one of your racers (though I assigned my own RFID) and lap based and it was failing exactly the way you encountered.

My mistake when trying to duplicate the bug is when I was testing earlier I was testing with multiple racers. This bug only effects lap based races with 1 person. I think this bug crept in at version .15 or .16 when I was fixing the problem with lap based races ending if no racers were in it (when using the automatic adding feature).

I will have this fixed shortly. I had planned on releasing a new version this weekend but I am going to delay it a few days to take care of this bug.

Thanks for working with me on this, I will have it fixed shortly.

pinwc4
2009.03.01, 10:31 PM
OK, since there was a critical bug I am making a new version available now. Version 0.17 can be downloaded from the website at:
http://www.flipsideracing.org/

This version does a database upgrade in the background, make sure to backup your flipsidedb file before running this.

The major things updated in this version are:

-- Bugs fixed --

- Major bug fixed that snuck in recently not allowing you to have only 1 racer in a lap based race. Thanks Brian for working with me on this.

- Fixed bug that allowed racers to be added to a race after the timer ran but not all racers had finished yet. The added racer would just run indefinately

- If you saved a COM port without selecting one the app would crash, this has been fixed.

-- Features added --

- Added a crystals option to the edit racer page. Options can be added to the cyrstal dropdown by editing the crystals.xml file. Or you can just type in the field instead of selecting a drop down.

- Added base logic needed to support hardware other than the Core lap counter. No new hardware is supported yet, this is just the framework needed.

-- Software tweaks --

- Tweaked screen resolution so maximized windows at 1024x768 would not cut off the bottom.

- Tweaked relayboard logic so that it would run faster. Also changed it to switch at 4 and 2 seconds remaining in the countdown instead of 2 and 1.

- Creating a new racer now defaults to none for the popup menus instead of the previous racer entries.

briankstan
2009.03.02, 01:19 AM
cool, I'll download it tomorrow and give it a go. :D

briankstan
2009.03.02, 03:23 PM
I was thinking, the FlipsideDB holds all the information for the cars, races, etc.

Say our club were to travel to another club that was running your software, Since none of the information is stored on the tag itself, would there be a way to extract the racers out of the data base and insert them into another database? This would be a whole lot easier than setting up our tags again on the other computer? Maybe an export racers, import racers function. This would also allow you to create back up database or start from a fresh one if you chose to and not loose all the racers data.

pinwc4
2009.03.02, 06:45 PM
I was thinking, the FlipsideDB holds all the information for the cars, races, etc.

Say our club were to travel to another club that was running your software, Since none of the information is stored on the tag itself, would there be a way to extract the racers out of the data base and insert them into another database? This would be a whole lot easier than setting up our tags again on the other computer? Maybe an export racers, import racers function. This would also allow you to create back up database or start from a fresh one if you chose to and not loose all the racers data.

This is a quick and easy one, I have already finished the code and it is in the source tree. The next build will have this feature. I put the buttons on the General Config. page for exporting and importing the race car data.

Ultimately I want to have the information online for those that would choose to. But I have to polish the lap counting software more before I attack web services.

BrianMidnight
2009.03.02, 06:50 PM
Using Wndows7 ran version 0.17 in the
"lap" mode with 1 car ....got to say no probs to report.:)

BrianMidnight
2009.03.02, 07:09 PM
RFID tags from Mouser...is there a code for the small F1 type?

briankstan
2009.03.02, 07:32 PM
I also tested out the "Lap" and "Lap and Timed" and they both work correctly with 1 car now. thanks this will be perfect for time trials now :D

RFID tags from Mouser...is there a code for the small F1 type?

I still have random luck with the small ones, it seems that if you have the loop on a fast part of the track they are more prone to missing, If they are on a slower part they tend to count every time. The faster of our guys are always the ones with laps being missed.

pinwc4
2009.03.02, 09:17 PM
Never had the F1 type but if they were about half the size of the standard rfid's we are using this would be it:

http://www.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?qs=sGAEpiMZZMsjLMBIknjmkjmlsMSF tk%2frts38wK0kRKs%3d

But like Brian mentioned the signal strength is not going to be as good with these.

In general the tag needs to be ISO 15693 compliant at 13.56mhz to work. I have only used a couple types so far from TI. You can see TI's selection here:

TI RFID's (http://focus.ti.com/paramsearch/docs/parametricsearch.tsp?&familyId=1352&uiTemplateId=RFID_PARAM_SRCH&techFamId=null&sectionId=475&tabId=2102&appId=null&viewDeviceCallingPage=null&totalCount=24&showAdditionalParameters=no&parameter=2528404391&parameter=2579504385&lc=2000969&lc=2001507&lc=2001415&lc=2001408&lc=2001416&lc=2001479&lc=2001407&lc=2001480&lc=2001466&lc=2001218&lc=2001462&lc=2001412&compare=yes&download=yes&sort=yes&customize=yes&paramResults=yes&paramCriteria=yes&familyTree=yes&military=no&baSystem=yes&paramTable=no&sortOption=PA_SUB_FAMILY_NAME&sortMode=ASC&searchPaths=1001352&pageId=1352&templateId=0&navigationId=0&family=rfid&paramTable=no&military=no&&uiTemplateId=RFID_PARAM_SRCH&techFamId=null&sectionId=475&tabId=2102&appId=null&viewDeviceCallingPage=null&resetCompare=true#sdp)

Any of those would work in theory but as they get smaller in size the cars would need to be slower to be picked up.

Programmers
2009.03.03, 11:58 AM
Great work so far! Thanks.

I have a suggestion that our club wouldn't mind as a feature, maybe, please.

Could there be a system by where the order of the race is announced every xx minutes. Then there be an option in configure race, where we can change how often it's announced via a drop down list or input box?

This would be fantastic!

briankstan
2009.03.03, 12:52 PM
Great work so far! Thanks.

I have a suggestion that our club wouldn't mind as a feature, maybe, please.

Could there be a system by where the order of the race is announced every xx minutes. Then there be an option in configure race, where we can change how often it's announced via a drop down list or input box?

This would be fantastic!


that would be a nice feature. it could say "Current running order is name with # laps", etc. (where the underlined items would be pulled from the current running order).

Have you also thought about putting in a staggered start as a race option? This is mostly used in qualifying, because it give everyone the same time based on when they first cross the finish line. This would come in handy eventually when you do get around to adding race management as well.

pinwc4
2009.03.03, 06:35 PM
that would be a nice feature. it could say "Current running order is name with # laps", etc. (where the underlined items would be pulled from the current running order).

Have you also thought about putting in a staggered start as a race option? This is mostly used in qualifying, because it give everyone the same time based on when they first cross the finish line. This would come in handy eventually when you do get around to adding race management as well.

Yeah, announcement of the current running order should not be too challenging. I have already written the code to generate the text spoken, added the settings to the config page and included the new spoken phrases in the language.xml. Now I just need to get the logic right for the race timer and it will be done.

Just out of curiosity wow often do you guys think you would set this to trigger?

In regards to staggered starts I do plan on eventually adding that feature but I doubt it will make it into version 1. Supporting having individual timers changes a lot of logic in the code.

Programmers
2009.03.03, 07:46 PM
Just out of curiosity wow often do you guys think you would set this to trigger?
Brian (SMZR Brian) was thinking about every 2 minutes for regular races and every 5-10 for the longer races, like Nascar 500's and endurances, etc.

briankstan
2009.03.03, 10:46 PM
Yeah, announcement of the current running order should not be too challenging. I have already written the code to generate the text spoken, added the settings to the config page and included the new spoken phrases in the language.xml. Now I just need to get the logic right for the race timer and it will be done.

Just out of curiosity wow often do you guys think you would set this to trigger?

In regards to staggered starts I do plan on eventually adding that feature but I doubt it will make it into version 1. Supporting having individual timers changes a lot of logic in the code.

I'd say tin the sstandard 8 minute race I would have it set to 4 minutes. in the longer racer probably every 10..

pinwc4
2009.03.03, 11:05 PM
Well, I think I have the feature done now. I will test it more first but it appears to be working correctly for all three race types now; lap, timed, lap&timed.

The software is staring to get chatty.

Dusty Weasle
2009.03.03, 11:31 PM
Just out of curiosity wow often do you guys think you would set this to trigger?

I suggest making it a user input setting, so the Race Director can set it to any number of minutes to go with whatever the club prefers for that race.

Programmers
2009.03.04, 03:16 AM
The software is staring to get chatty.
Haha, she does like to talk doesn't she! I can't wait to see the new features!

leonen
2009.03.04, 07:35 AM
I suggest making it a user input setting, so the Race Director can set it to any number of minutes to go with whatever the club prefers for that race.

Why not with an "OFF" switch and a keyboard trigger? that way It'll launch whenever the race director wants.

pinwc4
2009.03.05, 09:15 AM
Why not with an "OFF" switch and a keyboard trigger? that way It'll launch whenever the race director wants.

Done, it is bound to the r key. You can hit it at any time to announce ranks. You can also set it to announce automatically at an interval you specify between 1 and 30 minutes.

This sort of thing really needs documented. While I do not have any official documentation yet some people may have not noticed most of the controls in the software have help tags assigned to them. If you hover your mouse over a control for a few seconds a small bit of text should pop up giving a little bit of detail about it.

briankstan
2009.03.05, 11:00 AM
when will you be posting an update? I'll have another good chance to test tonight during our races.

Programmers
2009.03.05, 11:45 AM
Done, it is bound to the r key. You can hit it at any time to announce ranks. You can also set it to announce automatically at an interval you specify between 1 and 30 minutes.

This sort of thing really needs documented. While I do not have any official documentation yet some people may have not noticed most of the controls in the software have help tags assigned to them. If you hover your mouse over a control for a few seconds a small bit of text should pop up giving a little bit of detail about it.
That sounds great!

when will you be posting an update? I'll have another good chance to test tonight during our races.
As a club, we can also give the latest update a thorough test on the 15th too. :) Not hinting or anything... :rolleyes: :D

pinwc4
2009.03.05, 01:55 PM
OK, I posted a new Windows build. The main website will not be updated until I test this release so you can get the Windows version here:

link removed, this release was borked.

I have not tested this build and will not be doing testing myself until this weekends races. Use at your own risk.

The updates this includes are:

- Ability to announce rank during race. Configure option on the config. page. You can also hit r at any time during the race to announce rank

- Ability to import and export racers from the database. Option is on the config. page. If an there is an existing racer with the same UID they will not be overwritten.

briankstan
2009.03.05, 01:59 PM
the link isn't working, it says.

Forbidden

You don't have permission to access /downloads/fsraceWin-275.zip on this server.

pinwc4
2009.03.05, 02:29 PM
the link isn't working, it says.

Forbidden

You don't have permission to access /downloads/fsraceWin-275.zip on this server.

Dang, this is why I need to test things before I post......

It should work now.

briankstan
2009.03.05, 02:42 PM
got it. I'll post up after the racing tonight to report on any bugs. Thanks !

BrianMidnight
2009.03.05, 04:48 PM
Trying version 0.18 using 4 cars in timed mode, live rank annoucements enabled plus rank annoucement interval set at 1 .
Race order annoucements working like a dream all in the correct order......however the lap count is not. Cannt work out a set pattern for the fault at the moment.... example... in a race the 1st car annouces 10 laps and the 3rd car 15 laps even though the screen shows 1st car 15 laps and 3rd car 10 laps.... in another race it could 2nd & 4th car lap annoucement the wrong way round. Gonna try some other settings now.

BrianMidnight
2009.03.05, 05:03 PM
Also 0.18 won't generate a report from the race data I've run tonight but will from the race data prior to todays date... reports "an XML error occured, the document was not transformed correctly"

BrianMidnight
2009.03.05, 05:36 PM
Have now used the Lap mode and the lap count announcements dont tally with the screen. Also tried export hfay olps format but that shows a blank page in notepad. Again only with tonights races.
No doubt about it when these little bugs are stamped on this software is gonna be triple awesome... after all I was just expecting an announced running order not the number of laps as well!!!!! its the tops

pinwc4
2009.03.05, 05:57 PM
Yeah, this release is borked, I will fix it shortly.

I have the rank announcement corrected I think.

The report problem I have not identified. The laps are not getting assigned to the event all of a sudden. I did not touch any of that code though so I am baffled atm.

BrianMidnight
2009.03.05, 05:59 PM
Update..... running with 2 cars doesn't seem to create any incorrect lap announcements......as soon as 3rd car is included the lap announcements get mixed up.

pinwc4
2009.03.05, 07:30 PM
Ok, new build again:

http://www.flipsideracing.org/downloads/fsraceWin-277.zip

Both those major bugs taken care of. Amazing what trouble a little space in the wrong place can cause....

I think in the future I am not going to release builds until after I do some bench testing of the software first.

BrianMidnight
2009.03.06, 08:42 AM
Thats great, lap announcements all correct.........another bug crept in though.....after the announcement "race complete" no finishing order is announced.
Generate report & export HFAY both back working correctly.

briankstan
2009.03.06, 08:42 AM
Here are our experiences with version .19

We really like the callout during the race for positions. The new visuals on the general config page are nice.

We were having a few little issues

1. I used the export drivers feature on my old database, then using a new database I inserted the driver into the new database and it brought everyone in. When I went to start a race (auto detect) it said to add a driver. I tried to add a driver manually as well but when I selected the driver is wouldn’t add that way either, I went to the edit racers screen and there were all the drivers listed. So it wasn’t recognizing that there were racers in there. I added an additional tag, and it would see that tag only not the imported ones. I just used my database from .17 and it saw them and functioned correctly.

2. I wasn’t announcing the finishing order of the race when the race was complete. I think this is because I kept having to hit end race, it would stop counting for every driver after they completed their last lap. It didn’t end and announce unless I hit “End Race”. Several of our guys ran time trials and I had to click “end race” at the end on each one. Them time kept counting on the main timer, but the time on on the racer completed once they reached the 50 laps.

3. We had one instance were it stopped counting in the middle of a race, at first it was counting but really slowly so the timer beep would come a second or so after you passed the loop. This was probably caused by my computer deciding to do an “update” . We stopped the race and rebooted the laptop.

That is all I can remember right now. We ended up finishing the night using version .17

one other thing, could you add "Time Trials" to the list of pull downs on the race config page with "practice", "Main", "Qualify" etc.

pinwc4
2009.03.06, 11:15 AM
BrianMidnite, I fixed that problem in the source now. Well, I undid a change that I thought would have the opposite effect. I was trying to force it to override any other speech with the rank announcement instead of putting it in the speech queue. I guess I should have just left it alone since it was working fine.


BrianKStan,

1. This is fixed in the source now. If you would have closed and opened the software the imported drivers would have worked correctly, the drivers were getting inserted into the database but not loaded into memory for races that was only occuring at starting the software. When adding a new racer it only added that record into memory instead of rescanning the whole database.

2. Could you tell me your race settings, was it lap or lap and timed, how many laps, how many racers, auto adding or manual adding of racers etc?. I tried to test this but could not duplicate it. As I learned before I need to match as closely as possible to what you were doing.

To make sure I understand this correctly, the race was not ending even though they had the required lap count? The main timer was still going but no one could get further laps?

3. Yeah updates can do that. I still need to look into how to get the software to run at a higher priority to minimize the chance of interruption by other programs.

In regards to adding Time Trials as a type, already done in source.

This does reinforce my decision to only release software after I have done some testing. If I add or change feature I will probably wait until I race with the software first, if it is just some bug fixes I am probably fine just doing some bench testing. I just really hate having put out builds that are broken, I worry about damaging peoples opinion of the software when I do that. So there will be some delay but overall you guys will have a better experience this way.

briankstan
2009.03.06, 11:33 AM
BrianMidnite, I fixed that problem in the source now. Well, I undid a change that I thought would have the opposite effect. I was trying to force it to override any other speech with the rank announcement instead of putting it in the speech queue. I guess I should have just left it alone since it was working fine.


BrianKStan,

1. This is fixed in the source now. If you would have closed and opened the software the imported drivers would have worked correctly, the drivers were getting inserted into the database but not loaded into memory for races that was only occuring at starting the software. When adding a new racer it only added that record into memory instead of rescanning the whole database.

2. Could you tell me your race settings, was it lap or lap and timed, how many laps, how many racers, auto adding or manual adding of racers etc?. I tried to test this but could not duplicate it. As I learned before I need to match as closely as possible to what you were doing.

To make sure I understand this correctly, the race was not ending even though they had the required lap count? The main timer was still going but no one could get further laps?

setting: Lap, 50 laps, 3.5 minimum lap. Yes the main timer would keep counting, but the race was completed and stopped counting laps, actually I don't know if it stopped counting as they didn't continue becasue it said race complete.

3. Yeah updates can do that. I still need to look into how to get the software to run at a higher priority to minimize the chance of interruption by other programs. (I figured that was it.)

In regards to adding Time Trials as a type, already done in source. Thanks !


This does reinforce my decision to only release software after I have done some testing. If I add or change feature I will probably wait until I race with the software first, if it is just some bug fixes I am probably fine just doing some bench testing. I just really hate having put out builds that are broken, I worry about damaging peoples opinion of the software when I do that. So there will be some delay but overall you guys will have a better experience this way.

Replies in red above.

No worries on the release, I didn't mean to rush you I we just had a race coming up and figured we could test some of the newer features if it was ready.

leonen
2009.03.06, 02:36 PM
We also experienced issue n° 2 where even though the event is over, the race is not "finished" until we click on the "end race" button.

We reace mostly timed events. the timer halts on 0:00:00, no one gets anymore counted laps... but the race is still "on".

pinwc4
2009.03.06, 03:27 PM
We also experienced issue n° 2 where even though the event is over, the race is not "finished" until we click on the "end race" button.

We reace mostly timed events. the timer halts on 0:00:00, no one gets anymore counted laps... but the race is still "on".

Were you using the timed race format then? Or was it lap and timed? Brian was using the lap race format which counts up.

briankstan
2009.03.06, 03:46 PM
using the timed race it counted down, but didn't stop. This may have been because were were using it to time practice and some of the cars ran, but didn't cross the line when the race ended because they were practicing with several different cars.

Do you have a "timed out" features where if a car doesn't finish the race it will time out after a certain number of seconds? This may have been the issue in a race to two as well.

pinwc4
2009.03.06, 04:16 PM
using the timed race it counted down, but didn't stop. This may have been because were were using it to time practice and some of the cars ran, but didn't cross the line when the race ended because they were practicing with several different cars.

Do you have a "timed out" features where if a car doesn't finish the race it will time out after a certain number of seconds? This may have been the issue in a race to two as well.

No there is not a time out setting. If they completed at least 1 lap it would wait for them to complete the race before it could end automatically.

So far I have been unable to duplicate what you and Leonen mentioned. Leonen is it possible this is also what you are encountering?

briankstan
2009.03.06, 04:33 PM
No there is not a time out setting. If they completed at least 1 lap it would wait for them to complete the race before it could end automatically.

I would suggest adding it if it's doable. DNF or Timed out is a pretty common thing and if the race won't end without the car crossing the line, if the car got broken and is unable to finish the race. the system should end the race after a pre determined time..

leonen
2009.03.07, 08:47 AM
I would suggest adding it if it's doable. DNF or Timed out is a pretty common thing and if the race won't end without the car crossing the line, if the car got broken and is unable to finish the race. the system should end the race after a pre determined time..

Totally agree. We always use the timed format for now. When time's up.... time out at no more than 2 laps equivalent time later. Should be enough if someone had problems on the final lap....

Dusty Weasle
2009.03.09, 04:09 AM
We've had instances where a car would break at the start or middle of a long race, and if the driver had no races to run after that, he'd pack up and head home before the race was over. Without an end-race time-out the race would never end because the DNF transponder would be half way across town.

So a time-out limit would be helpful, and/or a manual 'End Race' button or command. (Important, just so it isn't overlooked, the time-out should only start countdown after the time/leader-laps have run out).

briankstan
2009.03.09, 08:40 AM
We've had instances where a car would break at the start or middle of a long race, and if the driver had no races to run after that, he'd pack up and head home before the race was over. Without an end-race time-out the race would never end because the DNF transponder would be half way across town.

So a time-out limit would be helpful, and/or a manual 'End Race' button or command. (Important, just so it isn't overlooked, the time-out should only start countdown after the time/leader-laps have run out).


there is a manual button to end a race without the time out kicking in. We typically don't have anyone sitting at the timing computer as the races run, so the call outs of the race don't happen until the race is complete, thus everyone that started has to finish.

As long as a lap is logged by a racer their data is stored in the race, even when manually ending the race.

On a side note: I would like a feature to possibly delete unwanted data, like an aborted race, in my case I have lots of data in my database from simple testing that I really wouldn't keep if I could remove it.

leonen
2009.03.09, 09:14 AM
On a side note: I would like a feature to possibly delete unwanted data, like an aborted race, in my case I have lots of data in my database from simple testing that I really wouldn't keep if I could remove it.

It's really useful that we may have the ability to delete events and also.... laps! merging them, splitting them managing laps registered by the system.

One of the great features of CORE was that you could split laps, when the system missed to count one or several laps.

I know it's not so easy..... but it's important!

pinwc4
2009.03.09, 01:19 PM
New version yet again. Version 0.23 is available on the website now.

http://www.flipsideracing.org/

Since the last unofficial build I changed the end of race rank announcements back to the old method so it should work fine again. The bug causing it so you had to close and reopen the program after importing racers has been fixed. Time trial has been added as a round type. And the live rank announcements should will no longer get cut off by time remaining announcements if they are scheduled to occur at the same time.

Dusty Weasle, you can manually end the race with a button on the screen. This will store all the results including those racers that have not finished. What needs to be added is an automatic time out. I have already begun working on this but this in combination of the auto add to the race feature results in people timing out if they start later than other racers. I am still working on it though.

briankstan, I will look into deleting an event. This should not be much work.

leonon, I am still working on merging and splitting laps. At first glance it seemed like it should not be much work but as I continue to dig into it I find more and more that I need to change. Basically if a lap is merged or split not only does that racer need its laps, average, rank and lag recalculated all racer data needs to be recalculated for each racer in that race, including rank, lag so a proper summary table can then be created using the new data. I am working on it just as I continue to do so the scope of the problem has gotten bigger.

leonen
2009.03.09, 09:36 PM
leonon, I am still working on merging and splitting laps. At first glance it seemed like it should not be much work but as I continue to dig into it I find more and more that I need to change. Basically if a lap is merged or split not only does that racer need its laps, average, rank and lag recalculated all racer data needs to be recalculated for each racer in that race, including rank, lag so a proper summary table can then be created using the new data. I am working on it just as I continue to do so the scope of the problem has gotten bigger.

I'm quite sure. It's a hell lot of work. I'll try to give you data base a look and se i we can help a little.

Dusty Weasle
2009.03.09, 11:58 PM
Dusty Weasle, you can manually end the race with a button on the screen. This will store all the results including those racers that have not finished.

Oh, excellent then. :D

I haven't gotten to use the software yet. We run AMB here, but I did recently have to get the CORE system out again. For some reason AMB has been missing huge amounts of laps and even interfering with our 2.4Ghz F1s... Only the F1s... It doesn't make any sense.

We're still getting bits of glitching while using CORE, but it appears to count the laps. (Not the old crossing-the-loop AM glitch, just general throttle surges or errant steering twitching).

We may be switching to Giro-Z soon though as the CORE tags are unwieldy for the F1s. Too bad as the AMB system gave us thousandth decimal accuracy and was quite reliable. But if we do switch I look forward to this being ported to Giro as well. I'll be putting it on my CORE system as soon as I have time to try it out and learn the functions. Thanks for all the hard work, your software is proving quite successful.

BrianMidnight
2009.03.10, 10:05 AM
New version yet again. Version 0.23 is available on the website now

Love it, Love it, Love it, orgasmic!!!!! :D...............how sad am I :o
ANOTHER DONATION SENT worth every dollar

BrianMidnight
2009.03.10, 11:17 AM
Now for the serious stuff...are the following additions achievable?

1. Race Car Specific Information....... Motor......Could there be a drop down box for typing (same as in Crystal) please.
2. Edit Racers....... Would it be possible to be able to print all the information shown on the screen? i.e (Name, Class, Chassis, Make, Model, Motor, UID, Crystal of all racers).
3. Statistics.......Export HFAY OLPS format....... is there any way to include the "Event Name" and maybe the "Date" within the readout file?

Cheers

pinwc4
2009.03.10, 01:24 PM
Now for the serious stuff...are the following additions achievable?

1. Race Car Specific Information....... Motor......Could there be a drop down box for typing (same as in Crystal) please.
2. Edit Racers....... Would it be possible to be able to print all the information shown on the screen? i.e (Name, Class, Chassis, Make, Model, Motor, UID, Crystal of all racers).
3. Statistics.......Export HFAY OLPS format....... is there any way to include the "Event Name" and maybe the "Date" within the readout file?

Cheers


Thank you for the additional donation, it is greatly appreciated. Good timing for me too as I need to renew the license for my programming environment.

In response to those questions:
1. Right now you can add motor types by editing the raceparts.xml file. I can make it so you can type anything in like the crystals but if you have some common motor types it would be better to add them to the xml file so they show up in the drop down. Also I can add them to the xml file I include so everyone has the motors by default, I just made a minimal list to start. If you look at the raceparts.xml file you will see it controls most of the drop downs for the edit racers page. Eventually I want it so you can edit the drop down list from the software but that is a ways off.

2. Are you wanting to print out all racers, an individual racer or both? Is the information on the right table what you are wanting or all the stuff on the left side of the screen? If the left side do you want it to include the picture? I will look into this more but my first though would be to generate a html report if it is the left side. If a csv of the right side of that screen is good then I would make a small modification to the racer export option.

3. I assume you mean use that info in the default name of the file? I can not put it in the contents of the file because that could mess up Brian's import. Are you wanting this for HFAY or are you using the export for something else? I can make a different export type if that is the case.

pinwc4
2009.03.10, 01:27 PM
We may be switching to Giro-Z soon though as the CORE tags are unwieldy for the F1s. Too bad as the AMB system gave us thousandth decimal accuracy and was quite reliable. But if we do switch I look forward to this being ported to Giro as well. I'll be putting it on my CORE system as soon as I have time to try it out and learn the functions. Thanks for all the hard work, your software is proving quite successful.

Someone else brought up making this software work with the Giroz. I do not know how much work it would be but would be willing to look into it. I need to have someone sniff the traffic between the Giroz hardware and software for me to know how much work it would be.

BrianMidnight
2009.03.10, 03:16 PM
1. Was able to change things around in the Core software myself but as yet cann't figure out how to do it in your system. If you can give me a clue of how to insert something.... you can forget this request.

2. Print out of all the racers please, yes a printable "export racers" file would be great.

3. I use this for HFAY only...(it was just that the "generate report" doesn't require the file to be named and I can view 3 or 4 of them at the same time without getting mixed up)....... I save each Main to desktop but have to name each one..... so say 3 mains in racer series and 3 mains in F1 it required retyping the event name.
I was just hoping that some way a file could be automatically created for each. Before submiting the HFAY results they have to be cut and pasted together as only 3 racers are in each main.

Hope this makes sense, please make allowances for someone born in the 1940's;)

pinwc4
2009.03.10, 03:40 PM
1. Was able to change things around in the Core software myself but as yet cann't figure out how to do it in your system. If you can give me a clue of how to insert something.... you can forget this request.

2. Print out of all the racers please, yes a printable "export racers" file would be great.

3. I use this for HFAY only...(it was just that the "generate report" doesn't require the file to be named and I can view 3 or 4 of them at the same time without getting mixed up)....... I save each Main to desktop but have to name each one..... so say 3 mains in racer series and 3 mains in F1 it required retyping the event name.
I was just hoping that some way a file could be automatically created for each. Before submiting the HFAY results they have to be cut and pasted together as only 3 racers are in each main.

Hope this makes sense, please make allowances for someone born in the 1940's;)

Yep, it makes sense

1. If you right click on the raceparts.xml and select open with and choose notepad. When it opens the format of the file is should make sense. The motors go in the format <motor>crazy fast motor</motor>. It is critical to have both the <motor> and </motor> tags. If you have trouble editing these you can send me a list of motors and I can include them as defaults.

2. Ok, are you wanting the info from the left side of the screen with the picture and everything or the info in the table on the right side of the screen?

3. Yeah I can do that, it makes sense. This way people will not accidently save over the existing export. I am still working on making it so you can just export multiple races at the same time but do not have that finished yet.

BrianMidnight
2009.03.10, 05:58 PM
2. Ok, are you wanting the info from the left side of the screen with the picture and everything or the info in the table on the right side of the screen?

Just the info in the table on the right side of the screen please

BrianMidnight
2009.03.10, 08:32 PM
1. If you right click on the raceparts.xml and select open with and choose notepad. When it opens the format of the file is should make sense.



Cracked it..... thanks

pinwc4
2009.03.10, 11:50 PM
Just the info in the table on the right side of the screen please

Ok, that seems pretty easy. I just finished a quick try at it and generated a report. Take a look here:

http://www.flipsideracing.org/uploads/pinwc4/racerinv/racerinventory.html

Is that the sort of racer inventory report you are looking for? Those are just example records I mess with so they do not have all the info filled out for each racer but that should give you a general view of what it would look like.

briankstan
2009.03.11, 10:49 AM
that's a nice little report especially if you are trying to avoid frequency conflict, you can simply post it up. I downloaded the new version, but I was in Arizona for work, I hope to get to mess around with Version .23 tonight sometime. :cool:

I had run quite a bit with version .19 and hadn't encounter any issues with just me on the track (maybe 500+ laps). It seems like the only things we were dealing with was because of a driver not finishing a race. The "Timed Out" addition would solve that.

pinwc4
2009.03.11, 11:12 AM
that's a nice little report especially if you are trying to avoid frequency conflict, you can simply post it up. I downloaded the new version, but I was in Arizona for work, I hope to get to mess around with Version .23 tonight sometime. :cool:

I had run quite a bit with version .19 and hadn't encounter any issues with just me on the track (maybe 500+ laps). It seems like the only things we were dealing with was because of a driver not finishing a race. The "Timed Out" addition would solve that.

We ran with .23 last weekend for our hour long race on a large track layout along with a few lap based races and had no issues. It was nice having the automatic rank call outs for a long race like that.

Preliminary code for timeouts is already done just need to test more first before posting a new build.

The report I linked above has been updated slightly. I have it shading every other row now to make it easier to follow each row in the table. That report was generated by the software as it is currently in source. This feature will be in the next build.

BrianMidnight
2009.03.11, 01:43 PM
http://www.flipsideracing.org/uploads/pinwc4/racerinv/racerinventory.html

Is that the sort of racer inventory report you are looking for?

Almost exactly what is wanted......Printed it out and its readable.... but requires a double take to match name with crystal (my 2 important coloums and Briankstan's).......however if your shaded amendment:) is printable it should be first class.

briankstan
2009.03.11, 02:14 PM
We ran with .23 last weekend for our hour long race on a large track layout along with a few lap based races and had no issues. It was nice having the automatic rank call outs for a long race like that.

this was one of the main points that we really like, especially on a long race. When running core for our hour long races, you wouldn't hear anything except the fast laps and they are usually set early on, then for the next 45 minutes or so, nothing. Then the 3, 2 & 1 minute warnings.

the Flipside software will be much better, giving you feedback on who is going faster by setting personal bests, and with the position callouts and laps you be able to see where you are, how far ahead or behind you are, if you loosing time or not. All this without anyone manning the computer, because everyone will be on the track. AWESOME !! :cool:

I use it exclusively for my practice because of the lap callout and fast lap callouts. I know where I am, I know what my laps times are like all before finishing the race. it's like having a crew chief calling out my times to me.

it would be cool if you could have a setting the you could turn on when practicing that would call out each lap time as you run. this would surely help with keeping laps consisitant and testing different lines to see what is faster. it would need to be a toggle so you could turn it off during a race.

pinwc4
2009.03.11, 02:38 PM
Almost exactly what is wanted......Printed it out and its readable.... but requires a double take to match name with crystal (my 2 important coloums and Briankstan's).......however if your shaded amendment:) is printable it should be first class.

If you had just looked at the report you should have seen shading for every other row to make it easier to follow. Every other row should have had a gray background, if it didn't let me know because there must be a bug in the html output then. I checked it in Firefox and IE and it looked correct to me.

If the shading of the rows did not help I can relocate the crystal column next to the names. The format of the report is controlled by a a html template that anyone will be able to modify so they can change colors, text size, rearrange rows, remove rows etc using the template. This is also true of the race reports. In the reports directory is a race.xsl that controls the format of the reports. For someone that knows a bit about html they will be able to figure it out.

Any other suggestions?

briankstan
2009.03.11, 02:43 PM
the shaded lines show up when viewed with Firefox, but when I printed the report the lines were no longer shaded. :confused:

pinwc4
2009.03.11, 02:45 PM
it would be cool if you could have a setting the you could turn on when practicing that would call out each lap time as you run. this would surely help with keeping laps consisitant and testing different lines to see what is faster. it would need to be a toggle so you could turn it off during a race.

Maybe a better approach would be for it to call out the difference between your best lap and the current lap. If you best lap is 4.5 and you get a 5 second lap it could call out .5. I think this would be better than trying to remember what your best lap was and how close are you getting to it. It could still call out your best laps times then just the differences until you get a new best. Or do you think literal times would be better?

Also with small tracks when calling out ranking, best laps, time remaining and individual laps I could see the speech getting behind a lot. Even worse if more than 1 person were on the track. Maybe remove at least the ranking announcements.

For enabling this maybe I could make it a specific round type, like personal laps or something instead of a setting that needs to be enabled and disabled over and over.

pinwc4
2009.03.11, 02:47 PM
the shaded lines show up when viewed with Firefox, but when I printed the report the lines were no longer shaded. :confused:

Very interesting, I did not try to print it. Did you print it on a color printer or just a black/white printer. I have a black/white printer at home I will have to try this on because the color printer I have near mean shows the shading.

briankstan
2009.03.11, 03:02 PM
Maybe a better approach would be for it to call out the difference between your best lap and the current lap. If you best lap is 4.5 and you get a 5 second lap it could call out .5. I think this would be better than trying to remember what your best lap was and how close are you getting to it. It could still call out your best laps times then just the differences until you get a new best. Or do you think literal times would be better?

Also with small tracks when calling out ranking, best laps, time remaining and individual laps I could see the speech getting behind a lot. Even worse if more than 1 person were on the track. Maybe remove at least the ranking announcements.

For enabling this maybe I could make it a specific round type, like personal laps or something instead of a setting that needs to be enabled and disabled over and over.

Me personally I would prefer the lap time. just a simple 4.51, 4.63, etc.

Very interesting, I did not try to print it. Did you print it on a color printer or just a black/white printer. I have a black/white printer at home I will have to try this on because the color printer I have near mean shows the shading.

I enabled the color on my printer and it still was lacking the shading. :confused: it did print the "flipside racing" in red. :) I printed it from IE as well and it is doing the same thing. the shading doesn't show up in the print preview of for either browser.

pinwc4
2009.03.11, 03:04 PM
Arg, I figured out what is going on with printing the report. I have a setting enabled that is disabled by default. The default for both IE and Firefox is to not print background colors in tables. So it looks right on the screen but will not print right. In Firefox go to File->Page Setup and enable printing the background. In IE you can change this setting by going to Tools -> Internet Options -> Advanced tab -> Scroll down to printing and enable printing background colors and images.

I do not see a way to make it print the background of these reports without changing a browser setting. Anyone else know?

BrianMidnight
2009.03.11, 03:12 PM
If you had just looked at the report you should have seen shading for every other row to make it easier to follow. Every other row should have had a gray background
If the shading of the rows did not help I can relocate the crystal column next to the names.


No shading in the UK using colour printer.... I like the sound of relocation :D

briankstan
2009.03.11, 03:13 PM
No shading in the UK using colour printer.... I like the sound of relocation :D

see above for setting to make that work..



yep, that did it.

I have a funny story. I was reading a book to my little girl the other night. We got to the end and I saw a RFID tag in the back of the book. I decided to give it a shot and scanned the book with the timer. WOW! it read. Now I can mount a library book to the top of my car to race and count laps Sweet !!.

Just thought it was funny, I even programed the audio to say "Library Book" :p

BrianMidnight
2009.03.11, 03:32 PM
see above for setting to make that work..



yep, that did it.

Not working for me..... downloaded the file.....I've got no shaded lines on the screen to start with? Using IE.... changed the setting as described..... printed as the screen no shading??? Would Windows 7 cause a problem????

pinwc4
2009.03.11, 05:31 PM
Not working for me..... downloaded the file.....I've got no shaded lines on the screen to start with? Using IE.... changed the setting as described..... printed as the screen no shading??? Would Windows 7 cause a problem????

Possibly, Windows 7 has IE8. I will need to download that and check it out. IE8 is stricter about the format of the HTML from what I have read.

I have altered the report somewhat. Check it out again and see if it works.
http://www.flipsideracing.org/uploads/pinwc4/racerinv/racerinventory.html

I changed the style slightly and move the crystal column. Let me know if the rows still do not have shading for every other row on your screen.

pinwc4
2009.03.11, 05:32 PM
I have a funny story. I was reading a book to my little girl the other night. We got to the end and I saw a RFID tag in the back of the book. I decided to give it a shot and scanned the book with the timer. WOW! it read. Now I can mount a library book to the top of my car to race and count laps Sweet !!.

Just thought it was funny, I even programed the audio to say "Library Book" :p

That is pretty funny. I do the same thing when I see something I have with an RFID tag. I never found one I could read yet though. They have all been the wrong type.

BrianMidnight
2009.03.11, 09:48 PM
Possibly, Windows 7 has IE8. I will need to download that and check it out. IE8 is stricter about the format of the HTML from what I have read.

I have altered the report somewhat. Check it out again and see if it works.
http://www.flipsideracing.org/uploads/pinwc4/racerinv/racerinventory.html

I changed the style slightly and move the crystal column. Let me know if the rows still do not have shading for every other row on your screen.

Yes Windows 7 is the problem , I'm on dual boot with my main computer and using XP the shades show on screen and when printed. My "mini-z" computer is Windows 7 only.... but if the crystal column is staying next to name ? I'm happy without the shading :) Thanks again

pinwc4
2009.03.11, 10:44 PM
Yes Windows 7 is the problem , I'm on dual boot with my main computer and using XP the shades show on screen and when printed. My "mini-z" computer is Windows 7 only.... but if the crystal column is staying next to name ? I'm happy without the shading :) Thanks again

Thanks for the update. I will keep the default having the crystal column next to the name because I think that will be the most common thing people would want. But I will still get IE8 installed because I need to prepare for it anyways. If you do not see the shading in the racer inventory report you probably are not seeing it in the race report either.

pinwc4
2009.03.11, 10:48 PM
Me personally I would prefer the lap time. just a simple 4.51, 4.63, etc.


So thinking about this further I think I will make the mode replace the beeps that indicate a lap with announcing the time of the lap. If it is saying the time for every lap the beep is redundant.

Also this might be what you meant anyways but for the sake of speed I think it would be best if it just said the number but not say the word "seconds" like it does when announcing best laps.

Dusty Weasle
2009.03.12, 01:27 AM
Beeps-
Way back when I was making the CORE car name call-outs they initially said the car name without the beep. We found that to be disorienting as the drivers instinctively felt like a lap had been missed. The continuity of beeps helps keep focus, so I went back and put a beep at the start of all the call-outs.

Time Calls-
Our AMB software calls each lap time. We have it on for practice, and off for the race as it would be too distracting then. When call-outs occur close together (as on a short track or with many cars) it can't keep up so drops the whole number and only calls the tenths of a second. The driver just has to guess what his whole second was (though we typically have a good idea. I.e. “Point Seven” is probably 5.7sec and not 4 or 6sec).

It's less than perfect be we get by. I'd rather hear my whole time from AMB, but it can't keep up on a crowded track. Hearing my time differential is a good idea too.

Maybe a compromise between the two- Call the whole number (##.#) for normal laps and “Fast Lap ##.#” when its a new personal best? Maybe “Best Lap ##.#” when its a new overall fastest lap for the track?


It does seem like its getting chatty, but that's way better than not chatty enough. In our local series we often have every driver on track, so the PC calling the race is a great help. AMB only tells us minutes remaining (and nothing for laps) and CORE only tells us leader changes (and nothing for laps).

In a 218 lap F1 race it's important to know what lap you're on and where you are in the pack to make a proper pit decision. At the moment we usually have to wait for someone to crash out so they can read the PC.

arch2b
2009.03.12, 06:14 AM
it does seem like it's getting chatty. i'd prefer these being options.

when were running hfay, laps are every 4 secs or so, toss in 3-4 cars and it's already crowded with just the beeps. by the time your lap time was called, you would be about to cross the line again.

briankstan
2009.03.12, 08:20 AM
it does seem like it's getting chatty. i'd prefer these being options.

when were running hfay, laps are every 4 secs or so, toss in 3-4 cars and it's already crowded with just the beeps. by the time your lap time was called, you would be about to cross the line again.

I probably would prefer to have the beep in there as well, but can live with or without it for practice as long as it's calling the times so you know it counted the lap.

this is true, but if you could just toggle it off for a race than it wouldn't be bad. I was just more thinking this would be a handy practice tool. Most of the time when I'm practicing I'm on the track by myself. it would be a good tool to test different line, see if your running steady consistant lap times on the fly.

During the actual racing this is something that I would have off. I think the current setup for call outs during a race is just perfect, especially with being able to set the race order callouts at what ever you prefer.

We also don't typically have a person at the computer and love the fact that the computer can call out the race as it's being run leaving those that aren't running to prepare for their next heat.

pinwc4
2009.03.12, 10:02 AM
Sorry for not being clear but this would be an option to enable and disable. Not a replacement for beeps. I think I will add a lap indication drop down to the race config page with the options for beep, lap time and time differential. Time differential being the difference between your best lap and your current lap. What I was trying to say was that if you change the setting to announce every lap time that the beep would not be needed. But if you guys think it should beep even when announcing every lap time I can do that, it just seemed excessive to me to have both.


Dusty Weasle, thanks for the info on how other software does it. It has been a long time since I have done anything but use this software and even longer since I have been to a bigger scale track that I forget those things.

briankstan
2009.03.12, 01:06 PM
Sorry for not being clear but this would be an option to enable and disable. Not a replacement for beeps. I think I will add a lap indication drop down to the race config page with the options for beep, lap time and time differential. Time differential being the difference between your best lap and your current lap. What I was trying to say was that if you change the setting to announce every lap time that the beep would not be needed. But if you guys think it should beep even when announcing every lap time I can do that, it just seemed excessive to me to have both.

I like it. that way it's simple to change depending on what your intent for that particular race is. Off for multi car race, or on in the format you prefer for practice. In my opinion, if it's calling laps, I don't think the beeps need to be there.

pinwc4
2009.03.12, 01:14 PM
Not working for me..... downloaded the file.....I've got no shaded lines on the screen to start with? Using IE.... changed the setting as described..... printed as the screen no shading??? Would Windows 7 cause a problem????

I just installed Windows 7 and looked at the report. I see the shading of every other row. I am not sure what else to look for now. I changed the report a few times so you may want to hit F5 on the keyboard to refresh the page. You may be seeing an old copy still.

BrianMidnight
2009.03.12, 02:58 PM
I just installed Windows 7 and looked at the report. I see the shading of every other row. I am not sure what else to look for now. I changed the report a few times so you may want to hit F5 on the keyboard to refresh the page. You may be seeing an old copy still.
Don't worry about it....I can download the shades, cann't print them.... but I'm still happy. :cool: edit...its a printer driver or printer software error!

pinwc4
2009.03.15, 07:04 PM
Just a few quick notes for those of you still suffering with Windows XP and Microsoft Sam as your voice for the race call outs. You can download the free Microsoft Mary and Mike voices from here:

http://www.imptec.com/SpeechXP.exe

I find the Microsoft Mary voice to be better than the default Microsoft Sam.

Also I just test a couple of them out and the third party voices such as those from Cepstral and AT&T Natural Voices will also work. They are bit pricey at $30 for Cepstral's and $50 for AT&T's but they do sound better.

If anyone knows of a good place to get free or cheap voices please let us know.

Also I am still working on the next build. It will probably be ready for this coming weekend. Some good features are being added and bugs squished.

pinwc4
2009.03.15, 10:34 PM
In case I forgot to mention this previously I want to thank Dusty Weasle for all the car pictures. I got the pictures I distribute with the software from him. He saved me a lot of work by letting me use those.

Dusty Weasle brought a sizable bug to my attention. Events will only save properly if you have the auto naming feature enabled. If you disable this it will save the first event you run with no name and not let you run an event after that until after you reenable auto naming. The event that does run will not be viewable in the results after the race.

Until the next release is out make sure to use auto naming for all events. You can still type in an event name, autonaming just appends the race type and time to the end of the name for storing in the database.

If you ran a race that you can not retrieve the results to because of this bug and you need those results email me your flipsidedb file. I can manually fix the problem, the results actually get stored they just will not be displayed.

pinwc4
2009.03.17, 07:40 PM
A new build is available now. Version 0.25 is on the site:
http://www.flipsideracing.org/

Many changes have been made, these may be of interest:

New features

Ability to delete an event
Added timeout option for races. If the racer does not complete a lap within that time their race is ended.
Racer inventory report. This creates an html report with the common race car fields. Useful for printing a frequency chart.
Lap time call outs. A race setting has been added that will call out the lap times instead of beeping.
Race profiles. On the race configuration page you can create race profiles. The profiles are used for common race settings. Selecting a profile will change the settings to what was saved for that profile.
Laps in the lead. Races now record how many laps each person was in the lead for and reports the results after the race.
Delete a racer out of an event after it ended. Does not recalculate results yet.


Enhanced features

HFAY export includes event name in the default file name.
Application will now maximize when opened unless the background image is set to a smaller size.
If Event name is blank and autonaming is disabled autonaming will still run so that the race will have a unique name.


Bug fixes

Event names can be manually entered now if autonaming is disabled
HTML reports in certain versions of Windows will no longer have duplicate lap rows. HTML is set as the report type now instead of XML for Windows.
XML race results are now properly indented when opened in a text editor.



There are others that I do not remember at the moment. I ran a few bench test races and will be running this version at our races this weekend. Check it out and please give feedback.