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575racer
2008.09.29, 12:57 PM
right, i had an idea earlier, about the handicaping for the championship. maybe, if we race the 'qualifying' race the month before, instead of the hour before the race, we could be more efficient. for instance, say if we race the championship, then afterwards, do a short 4min qualifying race for next month, then someone can go away, look at the results and draw up a starting grid/line with positions, so we arent quite as rushed like we were before.
if thats not clear enough let me know, i just thought it may work.

kryten
2008.09.29, 01:40 PM
That sounds like a great idea Lee,would make things less rushed on the day.should mean less headaches for Tom too:)

575racer
2008.09.29, 01:53 PM
yar yar, would be cool to see the positions before the race too.

Programmers
2008.09.29, 03:46 PM
Good idea.

I think we're all in a place now where fastest people should be at the start of the grid. Staggard start was too much hassle for a little effect and reverse order causes a lot of crashes.

kryten
2008.09.29, 04:26 PM
I can see how that would make for less crashes,but putting the slower drivers(ie me!) at the back of the grid,does the opposite of what the handicap system is supposed to do! So as well as being a fair bit slower than the quick guys i now have to start after them too? How am i supposed to have any chance of actually winning a race?

575racer
2008.09.29, 04:37 PM
i agree with jayce. i think if we want other racers to get better, we need a handicap system in place that helps them get gradualy better. its very hard to win from the back of the pack. theres always going to be crashes- its hard not to sometimes. i know the first corner pile-up is annoying though, maybe a staggered start making sure that each car has passed the 1st corner before the next car has started off would help.

Programmers
2008.09.30, 11:44 AM
A handicap system doesn't make you a better drive, it just improves your chances!!!!!!

Your first corner idea is nice though. It wont be very effective though. Look at before when we had 10 second gaps between each racer... The order still came back to fastest to slowest by the end and the first corner will come up in less than 10 seconds...

However, it will be the easiest thing to do. Now that HFAY takes place first, how about this?

Reverse order HFAY results for race positions. Each race leaves the line when the car in front has completed 2 corners of the track.

How's that sound?

kryten
2008.09.30, 12:27 PM
Look at before when we had 10 second gaps between each racer... The order still came back to fastest to slowest by the end

I think that proves that the system already in place does not work.
For me the simplest way to do it is take the results from the last race,however many laps behind the leader you are then thats how many laps are added to this races results.
We use the same amount of track for each SRUK race so the track each time should be approx the same length.
If someone has car problems and drops out of a race(me again last meet)then they get the same amount of laps added as the person directly above them in the championship.Does that sound fair?

Programmers
2008.09.30, 12:31 PM
For me the simplest way to do it is take the results from the last race,however many laps behind the leader you are then thats how many laps are added to this races results.
So if I am lap ahead of you last race, I start a lap behind you this race?

If so, that's not a bad idea.

kryten
2008.09.30, 12:33 PM
Thats it exactly,tho in reality it's more like 6 laps:D
i was thinking more of adding the laps at the end,but either way works i guess

Neomax
2008.10.01, 03:11 PM
I have to say i can't believe we are going to start going back over the handicap system again, we already tried this and know it doesn't work.
Especially seeing as we are more than half way through.
If we (I) beat Joe Bloggs by 13 laps, and then start 13 laps behind him in the following race i wont be able to make back 13, as he will have had a 13 lap head start without me on the track, this clearly gives a massive advantage that can't be made up.
And if the idea is to deduct the 13 laps off me at the end, then you would need to run a lot of races at some stage for each racer in order to get an average, in order for it to be fair, otherwise if i'm having a bad round and Joe Bloggs is having a good round, i'm going to end up with an unattainable handicap, and thus the handicap will then work against me, rather than making it fair.
I appreciate that slower racers feel they are lagging behind, really i do, i used to be one!
But i dont honestly think we are going to get to a system that works efficiently and fairly. This is why racing doesn't have a handicap system, the only reason it works so well in golf is because they are constantly drawing an average from your scorecards and giving you the average below 'scratch' as a 'point head start' system. In racing there is no 'scratch' to start with to get an average to give a head start fairly. Not unless you race the same track all the time, then you could take the fastest ever lap as 'scratch' and work from there.

I think the bottom line is to be better you just need to practice, dont be thinking that me and Tom are that fast, give Rich a good running car and he kicks our asses, and Jonny and Byebye are pretty damn fast too, its only since they left and Rich has been having car troubles that he can't/isn't sorting that me and Tom seem to have shot to the front of the pack so to speak. Tony hasn't been doing it that long and already i'm checking my six to see where he is, as when he has a good run he's pretty fast and getting good consistancy, Bri is another one that since we got his car running well is posing a serious threat to my standings in races (though his modesty will have him thinking he's not that good, but i've got my eye on you too matey ;) )
Everyone has the ability to be good, fast and consistant. Honesty i'm not just saying it, i remeber when me and Tom first started with the Z's and i was struggling, then Sheila (byebye's missus) let me use her car and i flew round, i couldn't believe the differance a good car made, and i'm not talking 5 or 6 laps, i'm talking 20 to 25 laps differance, just from a car that runs well!
But that is part of being a good racer, is not just being able to drive well, but being able to fix your car and keep it running well.
My first HFAY season i came in 17th, my second season was something pants like 28th because i was struggling with my car. Surely that shows how much a differance it can make. This season i'm using my good but slow car, and i'm doing well again, because it runs well so i can drive it well, not because it's fast.

Rant over, i'll let all of you who could be bothered to read it, carry on about your daily business again!
lol.

Programmers
2008.10.01, 06:59 PM
Okay, as we're all not going to agree it's going to come to this:

Liam's idea but with a tweak or two.
- Side of track starting area where we cue.
- First person (slowest qualifier) goes on the "go".
- Second person follows after the first person achieves X amount of corners.
- Everyone else follows in the same fashion.

This isn't fool proof as crashes could occur, making their unusual gaps but it's a decent start for something to build on.

I'll work out the corners each meet depending on the track size.

I know this doesn't please everyone but what can we do if we don't reach an agreement after six months!!!

We're going around in circles because when people aren't getting their own way, they're arguing until they do - and so on.

So unfortunately and finally - this isn't negotiable any more.

We'll give this a go and see what comes of it and work from there, but for now - as I said, that's final.

Just look at F1 and HFAY - even if there are faults, they don't change everything mid season and neither will we as of next. We'll simply decide on rules and stick with them for the 11 months.

It's supposed to be a bit of fun. Stick your car on the track and go! Let's try keep it that way aye fellas?

575racer
2008.10.02, 03:43 PM
sounds good tom:)
mal- yeah, i agree on getting the cars running right. my mustang runs and sounds completly naf, im going to put some money into tuning it and getting it running right, better body, motor mount, suspension etc. so i can do better in hfay and the championship.

Programmers
2008.10.02, 05:52 PM
You don't need to spend more money - just more time! You put so much of your time into everything else!! I bet you have what you need to get it running nicely already. It's not about how much you put into a car!! I've learnt that the hard way lol.

Just make sure you have the essentials and that they're good quality and installed correctly!

575racer
2008.10.02, 05:54 PM
hmmm i can see your point lol:rolleyes: i think, at the moment the main problem is gear mesh and the body on my car. im going to get an aston and buy that mount from you, then practice like mad:D

BmwM3_Evo
2008.10.02, 06:25 PM
Try looking through some of the popular racing bodys. I know alot of people prefer running 94mm in hfay, me included so chezeck what people like to run, they wouldnt be popular if they were crap.

Programmers
2008.10.02, 06:32 PM
I run 94mm HFAY. It handles lower speeds better!