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View Full Version : Contemplating getting 2.4ghz


Jace1283
2008.11.16, 02:17 PM
hi

im running stock radio with my mr02 and ive been pretty competitive but im wondering if the 2.4 will make my car and ability to control it better. Has anyone got the 2.4 and not seen an improvement or is it pretty much a given that 2.4 will be faster. what differences did you notice when you upgraded

thanks

byebye
2008.11.16, 09:01 PM
You'll definately notice a difference going from AM to 2.4ghz. The car has no twitch and responds much quicker. The only gripe most people have but get over is the reverse. It takes some getting used to but once you learn it's pretty easy and I hardly notice the difference.

When I go back and forth I realize just how quick the response is with 2.4ghz. And no antenna!

Kris

herman
2008.11.16, 11:12 PM
hi jace1283

i suggest that you try one out... to feel the difference for yourself...
i wrote a review a while back... hope this helps

http://mini-zracer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=27597&highlight=2.4ghz+asf+review

http://shop.tinyrc.com/product.php?productid=19022

Jace1283
2008.11.23, 12:23 PM
thanks for responses. i ended up getting it and racing it this weekend. its great exept for the reverse driving me absolutely crazy. i read the whole thread, i guess i just have to get used to it. i think its retarded though, when i put it in reverse, go in reverse! why did they mess with that, im not gonna brake! love the no big antenna thing on the car and controller. the power supply post work great now too so i can plug the transponder into it. that lets me ditch the batteries taped in my roof :)

Jace1283
2009.01.04, 02:11 PM
so i've had 2.4 (kyosho controller) for a while now and i hate it. the reverse just sucks, you loose so much time. it's just not easy enough or consistent enough to be any good. also i cant put drag brake in because then it won't go in revers at all! also idk if its nimh im using or what but the controller dies on me after 5-6 races even with charged batteries. its like no product testing was done with this junk, use your freaking brain and some common sense. junk. some times i drive forward to bounce off a wall after a crash because thats faster than reverse but still slow. i get in far more crashed and of more severity because i dont know when it will go in reverse. one time another guy running it couldn't get it to go into reverse fast enough on the straight and he got whacked hard. his body fell off and lost the race. had he been running am he would have had plenty of time to reverse and get out of there. trash

briankstan
2009.01.04, 02:17 PM
Jace, what controller are you using? If you have the EX-10 helios with 2.4 module I can help you set it up so the reverse won't bother you again.

I to had the same issue when moving to 2.4ghz so I know were you are coming from.

Jace1283
2009.01.04, 02:19 PM
no its the kyosho junk, i might get the helios sometime because this controller makes racing unpleasant

briankstan
2009.01.04, 02:22 PM
no its the kyosho junk, i might get the helios sometime because this controller makes racing unpleasant

I felt the same way. I didn't like the KT-18, and the reverse would make is so I'd rather drive my AM car. Now that I have everything setup and working with my helios, I've actually converted all my cars, Racer, F1, Overland and my Pan Car to 2.4 now and I love it.

Jace1283
2009.01.04, 02:28 PM
I felt the same way. I didn't like the KT-18, and the reverse would make is so I'd rather drive my AM car. Now that I have everything setup and working with my helios, I've actually converted all my cars, Racer, F1, Overland and my Pan Car to 2.4 now and I love it.

thanks for the input, im usually stingy with spending money on mini-zs but i think i might order a helios tomorrow($280!), thats how frustrated i am, lol

can the helios do drag brake? my car rolls far to easily with kt18

briankstan
2009.01.04, 02:53 PM
you can setup the drag brake, Look for a used helios with module, check ebay you'll be able to find one cheaper.

I've picked up a used one for $100, then you just need the 2.4 module.

Skv012a
2009.01.04, 04:21 PM
Honestly, you lose .5-1 second to the AM when using reverse. As far as I know, Helios won't help that either since thats how the car boards are designed. As far as battery life, I've used mine for probably 6 hours and it still works fine. Contact Kyosho and see if they might replace it for you or try higher cap batteries. Maybe hybrids due to their low idle discharge rate.

soulstice
2009.01.04, 04:28 PM
Jace, what controller are you using? If you have the EX-10 helios with 2.4 module I can help you set it up so the reverse won't bother you again.

I to had the same issue when moving to 2.4ghz so I know were you are coming from.

Hey Brian,

Mind sharing the setting you have for reverse on your Helios. I'd like to try it out.

briankstan
2009.01.04, 04:50 PM
Hey Brian,

Mind sharing the setting you have for reverse on your Helios. I'd like to try it out.

see my post here. http://www.saltlakemini-z.com/forum/index.php?topic=198.0

the trick is to set the ABS so you just hold the reverse on, then the ABS will wait the appropriate amount of time then kick in the reverse. it works really well and you don't have to worry about waiting and acting to fast, the waiting again.

Give it a try. :D

Skv012a
2009.01.04, 11:55 PM
So that minimizes the time it takes to reverse via TX, interesting.

briankstan
2009.01.05, 12:03 AM
So that minimizes the time it takes to reverse via TX, interesting.

it doesn't remove the delay, but you set the controller to wait for the time, this way you aren't fighting it. because if you act to fast you have to wait again, and if you wait to long, well that just more time lost too.

I've had great sucess with it. :D

EMU
2009.01.05, 12:13 AM
I never liked the KT-18. I do like my helios with the ASF module. I have switched all the cars that I race with to 2.4 now, and have no regrets. The reverse isnt too much of a problem. I hardly notice it anymore, although I see people with the KT-18s pulling their hair out everytime they try to go to reverse. Most of my cars feel like AM cars when they reverse, once the car is stopped, I can engage reverse.

You may not use the brake, but many do. I use brake on many corners, and am happy that Kyosho has made this change. I have driven a few AM cars, forgetting that they do not have this feature, and have engaged reverse when I was attempting to brake twice in a corner. Once to slow down behind traffic, and a second time before turn in.

x_zminiracer
2009.01.05, 10:59 AM
springing for a new radio a J. just don't crash and no need to worry about reversing! (jk)
mine sometimes won't hit reverse right away, have found that if you hit forward then try reverse seems to work for me, only my MA10 does this my MR02s give me no issue, depends on your trim settings with the p18.
have learned to live with the 2.4 and all my cars are or will be converted to 2.4 because i just can't deal with the am glitching.
can't help with the why the batteries go in 4 - 5 races. mine goes all night and all next week practice and have yet to have the batteries die on me. am using energizer 900 mah 'flashlight battery's' .
cant complain about my 18 but will make my life easer going to a radio with multi model memory. also the features of the computer radio can't hurt either...

benmlee
2009.01.05, 05:41 PM
see my post here. http://www.saltlakemini-z.com/forum/index.php?topic=198.0

the trick is to set the ABS so you just hold the reverse on, then the ABS will wait the appropriate amount of time then kick in the reverse. it works really well and you don't have to worry about waiting and acting to fast, the waiting again.

Give it a try. :D

Tried that last night. The subtrim on throttle is set to F30. That made the car go forward even with the throttle at neutral. Is that the way it is suppose to set up?

Skv012a
2009.01.05, 05:56 PM
Just want a small note, stop hating on KT so much guys! Aside from a few getting full throttle cut-off flaw, its a good controller for its price. Makes you learn the basics instead of just letting the TX do all the work for you.

briankstan
2009.01.05, 06:05 PM
Tried that last night. The subtrim on throttle is set to F30. That made the car go forward even with the throttle at neutral. Is that the way it is suppose to set up?

you may want to back it up a bit, your car should be just on the edge of moving forward. that is one setting that I have had to adjust slightly for my different chassis.

Jace1283
2009.01.05, 11:20 PM
Just want a small note, stop hating on KT so much guys! Aside from a few getting full throttle cut-off flaw, its a good controller for its price. Makes you learn the basics instead of just letting the TX do all the work for you.

thats what i have! full throttle cuts out! should i do something about it? idk i could try other batteries. don't even start, the car needs to do what you need it to do when you need it to do it, the kt-18 does not let you do that(car needs some blame too). kt18 will make you look like a fool on a congested race track. the kt18 works great for the kitchen floor, actually its not much good there either, a gymnasium is a good place for it, tennis court maybe. Tx that does the work for you? what does that even mean? why can't i have a car that goes in reverse when i need it to go in reverse? why can't i move my car before the mass of cars plows into me instead of my reverse deciding to work right when theyre going by and causing a crash? why can't i have a controller that i can set drag brake without making reverse not work at all?(my car rolls 10 feet like im still on full throttle, its excessive). does a real car tell you you shifted too fast into reverse and you need to start over? when youre racing tight, the kt18 just doesn't cut it. Sure it'll help you train, i guess, just don't brink it to race day.

the last race i didn't even care much about the 2wd racing(my 2.4 car), i'd pull off for issues and just not come back, after a while i just give up. it just happens too much(reverse issues), which for me is about 2 times in a 8 minute race. i'd just stop caring because i had gotten frustrated enough that i actually truly wanted to sell all my mini-z stuff right then and there, so i stoped trying to win and just whateverd.

BUT, i did beat three, yes, three MA-010s(2 w/2.4) in the 10 minute Final with my xmod in the AWD open class that we also run. BTW stock controller, no glitches at all and instant reverse, i mean no brake, instant, the way i like it(ok, maybe not on 2wd, awd ok). I should say that this xmod has about $230 worth of just upgrades including a mr015 2x2 fet board.

im most likely going to get a helios, just figuring out whether to go new or used

x_zminiracer
2009.01.06, 03:15 PM
BUT, i did beat three, yes, three MA-01s (2 w/2.4) in the 10 minute Final with my xmod in the AWD open class that we also run.
excuse me...but if the camaro had not plowed T's MA10 2.4 knocking the body off you would not have lucked into (were handed) the win :p I was in 3RD with my MA10 2.4 that not only had to be pulled from the race because of a broken rear toe pin on the plastic knuckles (aluminum ones should be here tomorrow :D) but the drivers side bottom front knuckle holder was completely cracked through the chassis bottom to top, so much so that it just fell off when i went to clean the car and had to change over to racing chassis from my old MA10...and you have a Zmod not an Xmod that was one lap behind the leading MA10;) so what ya think about me being right behind you with a busted up car even :cool:

not sure why the cut out thing happens full throttle on you car, doesn't happen on any of my 3 2.4 gig cars.

I do know that trying to run drag bake on the P18 is causing your reverse issue.

I know this is hard for you J but the trigger goes both ways! forward and Brakes :p

Skv012a
2009.01.06, 04:42 PM
Jace1283, Let me see what Kyosho tells me regarding that problem and IF they will fix it for free, then I'd say send your 18 to them and let them fix/replace/whatever to eliminate the problem. I read something about cleaning the potentionmeter pot(right?), but I wouldn't tinker with it myself if warranty repair is free (aside from at least your shipping, but IMO worth it in the long run).

What I heard from Tallgeese is that supposedly early models would get finnicky with throttle when batteries were running low way before the light went on. Then supposedly Kyosho replaced those units with newer ones for free. IF the cut-off problem is rooted here as well, then I'd let them take care of it for free. We'll see.

As far as xmods, has anyone tried using same wheels, tires, and motor to test which actually performs better? I have a hard time believing that Xmods can honestly compete with Zs since quite a few switched and stayed with the more expensive Zs over the years. I do know that stock Xmods basicly have 20-30 tires on wide 11 rims and thus have better grip than narrow 8.5 stock Zs with 40 tires, but thats hardly a good performance comparison, now is it?

Jace1283
2009.01.06, 06:44 PM
^ on this particular track we run there is a long straight and a snake back to it(meaning you carry speedy). the xmod is heavier than a Z which gives it a different feel, more solid, less twitchy, faster? mmm no. consistent? yes. firmly planted? yes. It also transitions quickly and the weight helps the tires really grip. also when it gets hit by a ma010, the ma010 is more likely to get the short stick. also my zmod is only 90mm but is stable and tracks straight, like i said, $230 in upgrades. 2 weeks in a row at this track ive won. I have no doubt T will beat me eventually with his ma010

haha, D, but T beats me anyway, even when im driving a Z. the camaro didn't flinch while the poor ma010 layed on the straight in pieces, lol. hey i did pretty good to only be one lap down after 9 minutes though, huh?

x_zminiracer
2009.01.06, 07:01 PM
you drive that Zmod pretty good J have to give you that and its set up nice. you can see though with the over 200$ in upgrades and the mini-z electronics, why I hesitate to let you call it an 'Xmod'. Know you would love nothing better than to beat our mini-z's with an Xmod but that ain't going happen ;).
the weight defiantly helps when cars tangle, some times. Did you notice though on the video the MA10s really pull on it down that long straight. considering how busted up my MA10 was at the end of the night it was a wonder I managed to hold on to 3rd till i had to pull it, was wondering why it was turning in the wall on me, knew i could drive better than that!

Skv012a
2009.01.08, 03:19 PM
Sorry for the off-topic, but I find this sidetrack pretty interesting. Jace, so you tanked over 200$ worth of upgrades into your Xmod AND installed a Z board/radio? Imagine $200 worth on a Z to begin with. What I meant was a stock xmod vs stock Z- only in this scenario can they 2 really be compared since even a turd can drive well after extensive upgrades(not directed at anyone, just a figure of speech).

Jace1283
2009.01.09, 04:18 PM
Sorry for the off-topic, but I find this sidetrack pretty interesting. Jace, so you tanked over 200$ worth of upgrades into your Xmod AND installed a Z board/radio? Imagine $200 worth on a Z to begin with. What I meant was a stock xmod vs stock Z- only in this scenario can they 2 really be compared since even a turd can drive well after extensive upgrades(not directed at anyone, just a figure of speech).

I totally agree that a stock board in an xmod is ng for racing, mostly because of its radio, actually the radio probly is over 80% of the problem on a xmod. You should compare xmods to Zs in dollar value, not stock vs stock.

yes, but you must consider that this xmod cost $30 dollars to me new, which means i can drop $110 dollars into it before it surpasses the cost of a Z. So my xmod, when comparing to a Z, should only be considered to have $90 dollars worth of upgrades, not bad. This xmod also only has bolt ons, no chassis mods that change the chassis, just some tape and plastic around the tie rod(free), point is, its a pretty good chassis. Xmods can put the battery tray in 3 positions front to back. They also can be AWD, like mine, but the batteries lay flat, unlike an MA010. Xmod has SAS on all four wheels essentially, without the wheelhop. Also I'm able to run 90mm with a wide race body, only one xmod body like that with low COG(yellow nsx, still has its canards after 2 nights of racing). It's also way more durable than a mini-z, you won't see it come off the track much, certainly no "fatal" problems, maybe a tire issue, but, my fault D!

I honestly don't think my xmod is better than a well setup ma010, but i was only one lap down after 9 minutes of racing to a guy that always beats me and is running a ma010(he crashed bad in the last minute and i won). I'm as surprised as anyone else, i was just running it for fun at first. My xmod is probably too heavy to be as competitive on a tighter, twisty track. There's still two mods i need to do, the awd driveshaft is about 3 times as thick as a ma010 and made of steel. Also the rear axles are from a xmod wide wheelbase kit but are too loose in the bearing, i need to fit ma010 wheels to an alloy axle to fix that.

if you wanto check out a thread on it: http://www.xmodsforum.co.uk/showthread.php?t=6541

Skv012a
2009.01.09, 05:14 PM
Well, given you replaced the board/radio, I wouldn't even call it a xmod anymore. And 90$ is basicly a Z ASF board. I've no problem with the chassis aside from Evos being horribly frail, but its the radio/electronics that are utter junk. But yea, interesting results tho I'd still want to see a same spec test between the two.

dvsstrike
2009.01.10, 09:24 AM
sky his car is very fast and consistant. i am the guy who he has beaten twice with that car. the car transitions well and is very well balanced on that particular track. on the other track that car will not turn as fast a ma010. i give it to him to set up that car. there should be no hating towards it. it is nice to see people running other than a mini z all the time. and as for dollar per dollar both cars are about the same. how do you have invested in your cars? i am pretty sure its well over 2 bones in it. just go the website on my sig to see a race.
now back on topic j the delay for the reverse will still be there if you get a new radio it will still be there but it can still be tricked using the abs delay.
just wait i will be getting the setting software

x_zminiracer
2009.01.12, 01:09 PM
On topic, yup J you going need to try that reprogramming usb thing and see if you can iron out that issue. agrees the radio isn't going to help if you still want to try drag bake, you can get a bit, but then you run into the it won't back up issue.
On the off topic. Hope it dose not sound as if i hate on J's Zmod, i am just busting his stones all in fun. I have a Zmod and its better than any of my Xmods but i just do not take that car as seriously as my z's. J and E both have some of the best tuned, fastest Xmods I have ever seen.

Skv012a
2009.01.21, 03:22 AM
Ill post my "throttle-cut-off" story here as well for Jace: resetting/repairing did NOT help, but Kyosho replaced my KT with a MIB one in 10-12 days. Call them, talk to them, get an "ok" to ship it in and you're set. I got a KT with a long silver serial sticker back, so the round holographic ones may indeed be out of the earlier batch that were flawed here and there.

Jace1283
2009.01.21, 05:36 PM
i did end up getting a helios ex10 and am still just getting used to it but its just great so far, so its not a prob to send out the kt18, it does have the round sticker. I'm freaking running my xmod off a helios, lol!

Just for the interest, here's a pic of the Zmod

http://pic70.picturetrail.com/VOL1841/8532638/21320121/351811459.jpg