View Full Version : F1 Shakedown/Endurance Race...impressions!

2010.06.20, 12:09 PM
Wel l folks, I had my first shakedown run with my new F1 SP2 Carbon Limited this weekend, and the first ever 1 hour endurance race at our local carpet track (Okinawa, Japan).

Rules were simple – Kyosho brand tires only, and Kyosho X-Speed motor only.

My initial thoughts on the SP2 – The only thing I was disappointed with from the get go was the plastic knuckles. Left side binded real bad. Got myself a set of the new Route 246 knuckles, removed the brakes disks, and installed with a little Kyosho Florentine oil. Absolutely perfect! Smooth as silk. The bonus is that the threaded portion of the axle stops right before the bearing in the wheel. So with my QteQ wheel nuts, I can tighten them down all the way and not press against the bearing at all. That little space means there is a small amount of play, and creates super free rolling wheels. Sure it’ll be harder on the bearings if you take a good hit against the wall enough times, but it’s well worth the tradeoff for me.

Other than the stock knuckles binding, I had no issues whatsoever.

My build – So besides the Route 246 front knuckle upgrade, I decided I was going the build a differential for the F1. Got the QteQ diff, Kyosho Ti diff shaft, Reflex Racing ceramic diff balls, and QteQ left hub and wheelnut w/built in spacer.

The stock Kyosho diff half, the one on the right side, has a built in spacer in it, so you can only use the left QteQ diff half, as it’s the same as the Kyosho. My diff plate would barely fit over the QteQ diff half, and I had to actually force-press it on, as the diff ring hole was slightly smaller than the QteQ part. Once together, I had to sand down the QteQ diff so it sits flush with the diff ring (I actually put it together before I did this and the plate wouldn’t even contact the diff balls). With the QteQ diff sanded flush with the diff ring, it fit together perfect. I had a difficult time adjusting it to my liking though. Seems like there is a very limited range of what actually works, but once I found it, it works extremely well.

I’m actually using this set up with the stock Kyosho shaft, as the Kyosho Ti shaft was not even close to being true from the factory. Wobbly as all get out. I’m waiting for an Atomic Ti shaft to come in – hopefully that’ll fair better. The Kysoho Ti shaft was so bad, I just threw it out.

I ended up taking the disk damper apart and sanding it down with 800 grit like I always do, then put it back together and use a little damping oil on it. Again, smooth as silk.

None of my Mantis worx parts arrived in time, so my set up ended up being Kyosho Red springs front and rear, no top shock, and carbon side plates. Drives very similar to my MR-02/03. Back end is tamed, and turning is the same left to right. I am very, very pleased (tires were Kyosho 40deg front/20deg rear, which is what everyone uses at this track).

Ok, race time. Tonight was the first F1 race they had, and it was a 1 hour endurance race, with at least 1 mandatory tire change. I TQ’d, and was leading for almost the whole race, when I broke a tie rod – ARRGH! I broke the stock one in practice, and used the Kyosho Optional Red ones for the race. I used the #2, and set my fastest time with it…awesome! Well, during a shunt in the actual race, I broke that one too, so I changed it to the next one up, the #4. It was ok, but I liked the #2 much better.

There were only 4 of us who entered the race, and everyone who had a plastic tie rod broke one. There was only 1 guy who didn’t break, and he had an aluminum one.

So the question now is, which aluminum tie rod to buy:

Atomic – read that these have some binding issues
Eagle – the 1 guy who had aluminum had this brand, and said it binds badly
GPM – read that these have binding issues too
PN Racing – haven’t read anything on them, positive or negative

I wish someone would make these in Delrin (ahem, Reflex Racing, are you listening? HA HA) but for now, it looks like these are the only brands I could find. Route 246 makes the aluminum holder, but not the actual tie rod, otherwise I’d get that brand, because I’m very happy with their knuckles.

So, who has which brand, and which should I go with?

I threw the instructions away for the Kyosho Optional Red set, so can anyone tell me what is equivalent to the Kyosho #2? I don’t believe it was actually 2 degrees…was it 1 degree toe in?

Anyhoo, any help you can provide would be greatly appreciated…I need to order one before the next race :)

I took video also, so when I have enough film I’m going to put together a little video…I think you guys will like it…

Let me know on those Aluminum tie rod bars…

- Paulie

2010.06.20, 01:11 PM
i too have looked hard and long for a breakdown on all the f1 aluminum tie rod options.
i thought it was also posted that one manuf. has the numbers reversed.

2010.06.20, 02:29 PM
I have 5 F1 cars. 4 of them have alloy tie rods... Atomic, GPM x2, 3Racing... The best bang for the buck is the 3Racing tie rods.

The tie rod mounts in front of the kingpin, rather than behind like the racers. Atomic mis-labeled their tie rod due to this confusion.

2010.06.20, 02:30 PM
So to get toe IN with the Atomic pieces you order negative numbers?

2010.06.20, 02:31 PM
I will check what number I have, I know it is toe in, but dont remember if it was +1 or -1 labeled.

2010.06.20, 04:36 PM

Out of the ones you have, which would you say (regardless of price), has the least "stiction"?

- Paulie

2010.06.20, 05:05 PM
I dont really notice much stiction on any of them. I use Kyosho knuckles exclusively, and you can put some graphite powder on the joint... I prefer the 3Racing regardless of price. I just dont like the color.

2010.06.21, 03:15 AM
I dont really notice much stiction on any of them. I use Kyosho knuckles exclusively, and you can put some graphite powder on the joint... I prefer the 3Racing regardless of price. I just dont like the color.

Since price is not a factor, and stiction isn't an issue, what would make you prefer the 3 Racing since you don't like the color?

- Paulie

2010.06.21, 03:38 AM
Being able to tell the toe by color makes it a little easier when looking through a pitbox if you have a few tie rods with different lengths... It may not be a nice color, but at least you can tell them apart (especially if you have a few different backup/parts cars).

2010.06.21, 03:56 AM
Being able to tell the toe by color makes it a little easier when looking through a pitbox if you have a few tie rods with different lengths... It may not be a nice color, but at least you can tell them apart (especially if you have a few different backup/parts cars).

Ahh, makes sense. Seems like none of the online stores I normally order from carry them though, and the ones from RC Kenon were actually GPM brand, not PN Racing brand.

I think Machine Cut Delrin would be a great material application here...Reflex? Mantisworx?

I'll probably end up wiht Atomic, as I will be using their Ti diff shaft also, since the Kysoho one was garbage.

I wish Route 246 made the toe bar. I'm very impressed with their knuckles...

So much so, I just picked up a set of the 1 degree today to test with :)

- Paulie

2010.06.21, 04:55 PM
Well fellas, I went a little crazy on the Aluminum tie rod bars...

Since these parts are so cheap (compared to my other hobbies and 1/8th scale r/c stuff) I decided to order what I could.

I ended up with Atomic, GPM, and 3 Racing.

From all the pictures I looked at, it seems like the 3 Racing have the smoothest texture to the aluminim. Looks like the Atomic and GPM brands have a rough finish to them. Either way, I'll see when they arrive, but I'm thinking a smoother finish will minimize binding.

I wasn't happy with the color choice either, so I bought two of each. When I settle on the one I like the best, I may spray it with Easy Off oven cleaner and remove the anodizing then I can polish the bare Aluminum for a mirror finish, not to mention it'll be smoother as well. If it doesn't work, I'll have a backup (that's why I ordered 2 of each).


- Paulie

2010.06.21, 05:37 PM
i'm eagerly awaiting the results.

2010.06.29, 07:31 AM
i'm eagerly awaiting the results.

Well, I received the GPM parts today. The aluminum was sorta pitted on one of them (like the picture on the website), and the other was fairly smooth.

I ordered them in Orange, and they match the QteQ Gold diff parts very nicely! Too bad the finish isn't so smooth. I'll post again when the others arrive (3 Racing and Atomic) and Iv'e had a chance to test them

Just wanted to keep you in the loop...


- Paulie

2010.07.05, 01:16 AM
Quick update on the tie rod bars fellas...

I received the 3Racing ones, still waiting on the Atomic.

I decided to take my spare R246 knuckles and see how all the tie rod bars fit through the pin on the knuckle.

Well, just as I thought, the GPM tie rod bars are garbage. One of the ends won't even allow the pin on the knuckle to slide through because of such poor machine work. I ended up just throwing it out. The other one is doable, but it's not that smooth. One side of the bar is smoother than the other one. Not sure if it'll bind or not once installed, but off the car, not smooth.

The 3Racing on the other hand are awesome! Every one had a very nice smooth texture to them, and were all just as smooth as the factory plastic version when slid over the pin on the knuckle, on both sides of the bar. I ended up installing one on my car, and it's smooth as silk.

I'll most likely keep the 3Racing version on the car, unless the Atomic is smoother (I doubt it'll be). I'll keep you posted.


- Paulie