PDA

View Full Version : For those who drift.


ocean rodeo
2011.01.25, 05:02 PM
For those who are using the DWS rear for drifting, how does it compare to the stock rear. Is there a noticeable difference in performance?

ocean rodeo
2011.01.30, 08:54 PM
Lol... To answer my own queston no there is no difference. So I guess I now have a race car:D

iruninsoga
2011.01.31, 09:14 PM
I upgraded my drift car with the DWS pretty soon after getting it so I couldn't tell if it was the DWS or my improving skill (I still suck).

The next time I set up a drift car I'll know that the DWS isn't necessary.

ocean rodeo
2011.01.31, 09:37 PM
Yeah i even went through a bunch of camber and toe adjustments side by side with the standard rear car and they were identical in handling. This is on a smooth surface. Next week I am going to buy some carpet, I'm building a table track and I will be able to see if there is a difference with a little traction but I highly doubt it. Kyosho had the racer in mind when designing this part. The kit looks great on the car but if you want to drift save the 100 bucks for a ball diff and front one way.

Skv012a
2011.01.31, 09:52 PM
I'd even argue camber not making much of a difference since we're using plastic tires. Rather, narrows are make with a slight curve and given hard compound, it probably doesn't make a difference. Wides are flat, but then again, it may not matter as opposed to when using rubber to race.

So all in all, bone stock car/upgraded to some cheap ball diffs and maybe alloy driveshafts + plastic tires = all you ever need to drift these.

ocean rodeo
2011.02.01, 03:49 AM
I would say camber on carpet or any surface with a little grip should make a difference due to less of a contact patch with the surface, easier to step out, but overall I just think it makes the car look better. I did try both narrow and wide rears and they both react the same.

iruninsoga
2011.02.01, 05:21 AM
I know that it depends on driving style but there's a huge range of setup in 1/10 carpet. Some guys run like 10 degrees camber front/rear, some 10 front 5 rear, some vice versa. They all seem to get around the track alright.

Out of the box with the Kyosho ABS drift tires seemed okay when I first bought an AWD. I could drift around a bit with just that. The next session (couple days later) I had ball diffs, knuckles and tie rods in. Seemed a bit better, but I was still a novice. Next session put in the DWS, max camber and toe and honestly I didn't know what was different. Oh well I thought, it's probably just me.

Eventually had a drift guy try my car and he just said that it wasn't set up for drifting. I told him that it was my dedicated drift car, and he said there's no way it's gonna drift being so light. He said I had to add more ballast. I was like oh, I need ballast? I had never thought of making the car heavier.

Anyway, other than the ABS tires with the shoulders shaved to 45 degrees (this is the most popular shape), ballast made the most difference.

So maybe a basic drift kit would be: tires, tie rods, knuckles, one locked diff and a bunch of ballast? Maybe the rods and knuckles aren't even needed?

Bodom
2011.02.01, 08:05 AM
@iruninsoga:
Hi,
Can you tell me where you add ballast to the chassis?
Also what do you use for ballast?

color01
2011.02.01, 01:49 PM
Mini-Z's are so light, adhesive steel weights or lead tape would easily do the trick.

Adding weight to the front makes the front more stable, gives you more front end traction accelerating out of a corner, but also makes the car push on turn-in (so you have to swing the rear out more, no problem!).

Adding weight to the back makes the rear more stable, gives you more rear end traction accelerating out of a corner, and makes the car oversteer on turn-in (so you have to be careful of your steering inputs).

For drifting, I'm a fan right now of adding lots of weight to the front. Lets the entire car rotate a little more around the front wheels, which shows off the tail angle better, and especially if you're going to try RWD Mini-Z drift, the more stable a front end you can achieve the better!

Deca
2011.02.01, 02:45 PM
Finally picked up my drift rig at our race last saturday, it's a lot of fun :)

I'm running 4.5 degrees of camber in the front (honestly pretty much just for looks) and none in the back. Locked up the rear diff by jamming some putty into it. My friend cut a disk of gauze and stuck that into his and it locks even better and will be easier to remove if he decides he wants to. Once I get around to mounting this stuff on the body my RX7 should also have a bit of a pink glow to it as well ;)

Don't really see any reason to upgrade my diffs...rear is locked and I don't really see what advantage a ball diff would give me in the front. Might lower it, it'll depend on what I do with the rims. I want to throw more parts on it but I'm wondering what will really have a noticeable effect on something this small and light. I was thinking of running tighter springs but I'm not sure it'll make much of a difference drifting..was happy to see the 010 comes stock with some rear toe-in, wondering if adding more will stabilize the rear while drifting but don't know since there's so little traction with the ABS tires.

Interesting idea regarding the ballast, might have to try that. Reminds me of taping a quarter to the front of a Q-Steer to "drift" it lol

It's a bit of a handful on RCP and very difficult to get any sort of nice angle going, but on carpet it drifts like a dream.

YoYo-Pete
2011.02.01, 03:00 PM
For ballast weight, I'm going to use the ground lighting's ballast. How do you like that. :D

Skv012a
2011.02.01, 03:16 PM
Ballast, tape some coins to it. I'd argue adding weight to counter the heavy battery side, but to each their own. Diffs, if you use say, kyosho ball diffs, they're great ballasts themselves.

Also as far as weight goes- I think mildly-aluminated MA is plenty heavy in comparison to any MRs, so I personally don't see a point in making it heavier than it already is.

ocean rodeo
2011.02.01, 05:12 PM
Finally picked up my drift rig at our race last saturday, it's a lot of fun :)

I'm running 4.5 degrees of camber in the front (honestly pretty much just for looks) and none in the back. Locked up the rear diff by jamming some putty into it. My friend cut a disk of gauze and stuck that into his and it locks even better and will be easier to remove if he decides he wants to. Once I get around to mounting this stuff on the body my RX7 should also have a bit of a pink glow to it as well ;)

Don't really see any reason to upgrade my diffs...rear is locked and I don't really see what advantage a ball diff would give me in the front. Might lower it, it'll depend on what I do with the rims. I want to throw more parts on it but I'm wondering what will really have a noticeable effect on something this small and light. I was thinking of running tighter springs but I'm not sure it'll make much of a difference drifting..was happy to see the 010 comes stock with some rear toe-in, wondering if adding more will stabilize the rear while drifting but don't know since there's so little traction with the ABS tires.

Interesting idea regarding the ballast, might have to try that. Reminds me of taping a quarter to the front of a Q-Steer to "drift" it lol

It's a bit of a handful on RCP and very difficult to get any sort of nice angle going, but on carpet it drifts like a dream.

By upgrading to a ball diff in the rear allows you to tighten up to almost a spool which is what you really want for drifting in the rear,direct drive. Up front the benefit of a front one way allows you to tap the brake and and let the rear swing out. Like an e-brake. Without the one way braking only force the car to slide straight. With your suspension you should try the softest spring rate. This will help transfer the weight easier and make the car turn harder and also helps with techniques like feints, dori's, flicks and so on.

Ballasts work too but I think I am going try the aluminum front gear cover. Weights a coins just don't look good to me.

ocean rodeo
2011.02.01, 05:19 PM
I know that it depends on driving style but there's a huge range of setup in 1/10 carpet. Some guys run like 10 degrees camber front/rear, some 10 front 5 rear, some vice versa. They all seem to get around the track alright.


The reason why they run so much camber is because their steering angles are up to around 45%

I drift 1/10th scale I have a VDF and love it. Since it's so cold here in the winter I bought a few awd's to run around with in the house and now I'm hooked. Next is to build a nice little carpet spot in my garage.

Deca
2011.02.01, 06:22 PM
I see no real reason to invest in a ball diff, my rear is completely locked as it is :) There's a tiny bit of play but not enough that I'm going to feel a big difference going to a locked ball diff. On real cars some people weld their stock diffs to lock them, that's basically what I've done.

I don't know why the drift readysets don't come with a locked rear end, with it open the snap oversteer is horrific x.x

I was thinking about doing the one way up front for the e-brake effect. Do you get any issues with snap oversteer running the softer springs?

ocean rodeo
2011.02.01, 07:30 PM
I see no real reason to invest in a ball diff, my rear is completely locked as it is :) There's a tiny bit of play but not enough that I'm going to feel a big difference going to a locked ball diff. On real cars some people weld their stock diffs to lock them, that's basically what I've done.

I don't know why the drift readysets don't come with a locked rear end, with it open the snap oversteer is horrific x.x

I was thinking about doing the one way up front for the e-brake effect. Do you get any issues with snap oversteer running the softer springs?

Whichever way it takes to lock the rear is all you need. I just like the options the ball diff offers.
I've never snapped out of control with my car, but right now the surface i'm running on is like glass, very controlled. Carpet might be a different story because of the imperfections on the tires( Mine have these faded spots on them on both sets I bought, It might be from the molding) that might dig in when they get warm, but I doubt it.

color01
2011.02.01, 09:34 PM
One-ways up front are a real gamble on the MA-010, if you get even a slightly imperfect unit it's going to make turning left and turning right very different. The E-brake effect is very cool and realistic though, you can hit the brakes to get the car sliding 100% of the time.

If you do the one-way, I suggest you undergear it as well, such that you have a mild overdrive in the rear (CS drifting). One-ways pull the front end fairly hard in the direction you're steered in, so if you want the drifting to look and feel realistic you have to force a little more oversteer than you would be used to.

Deca
2011.02.01, 09:38 PM
Yeah if I ever decide to try racing the 010 I'll definitely grab a ball diff, but for now the plan is to keep it a dedicated drift car.

Our basement is hardwood, YoYo-Pete and I have been drifting around on it and it's a much different experience than running on carpet. Carpet seems better suited to tandems but there are some things you can't do on it, you can pull of some really sweet low speed drifts on smooth surfaces :)

We'll be running on carpet at our races, planning to set up a drift stage with some field markers and tape at the next event. Should be a lot of fun! We seem to be getting other members of our group interested as well, hopefully we'll have a nice big drifting group in the near future :D

One-ways up front are a real gamble on the MA-010, if you get even a slightly imperfect unit it's going to make turning left and turning right very different. The E-brake effect is very cool and realistic though, you can hit the brakes to get the car sliding 100% of the time.

If you do the one-way, I suggest you undergear it as well, such that you have a mild overdrive in the rear (CS drifting). One-ways pull the front end fairly hard in the direction you're steered in, so if you want the drifting to look and feel realistic you have to force a little more oversteer than you would be used to.

I've heard if you gear for CS it becomes completely impossible to grip. I do like the more realistic look to it but I'm not sure how I feel about constantly having to be linking everything, is it not as much of an issue as I'm thinking? I sorta feel like it would slightly negate the coolness of the ebrake as well, I'd like to do some big early entries through straights into corners with it :)

color01
2011.02.01, 09:50 PM
The cool thing about CS-drifting a one-way equipped car is that you don't actually have to always link drifts. Think about it -- the rear wheels are driving faster than the fronts, so when you have rear traction, the front wheels are rolling faster than the one-way would drive them. Hence the one-way will just freewheel happily, and you don't lose drivetrain efficiency or have the front and rear axles fighting each other.

In fact, you could theoretically use this setup for racing as well, if you can handle the one-way's characteristics. You'll have pure RWD until the rear tires slip, at which point the front tires will kick in and pull you through the corner. It's almost like the GT-R's version of AWD, its combination of characteristics can make the car very fast.

Deca
2011.02.01, 11:50 PM
The cool thing about CS-drifting a one-way equipped car is that you don't actually have to always link drifts. Think about it -- the rear wheels are driving faster than the fronts, so when you have rear traction, the front wheels are rolling faster than the one-way would drive them. Hence the one-way will just freewheel happily, and you don't lose drivetrain efficiency or have the front and rear axles fighting each other.

In fact, you could theoretically use this setup for racing as well, if you can handle the one-way's characteristics. You'll have pure RWD until the rear tires slip, at which point the front tires will kick in and pull you through the corner. It's almost like the GT-R's version of AWD, its combination of characteristics can make the car very fast.

Ahhhh I get it :D That's really cool actually! I'll have to see if I can get D to stock some one ways other than the 50 dollar Kyosho kit :p

What do you recommend as far as gearing?

color01
2011.02.02, 01:47 AM
Overall gearing depends on the track, obviously, but your front underdrive/rear overdrive depends on what is available. If I'm not mistaken, the stock diff has a 27t gear driven by an 8t pinion. If you get a one-way that can be underdriven (like the Atomic one-way) then stick a 28t gear on the one-way, and you'll have a very mild rear overdrive. You could then stick a ball diff with a 26t gear into the rear gearbox to give you slightly more overdrive. You really don't want to have too much, the 1/10 CS-drifting community has found that out already. Makes the car never want to go straight, period. :eek:

ocean rodeo
2011.02.02, 03:48 AM
I agree with your points, but CS is mainly used for circuit, fast, tight and or pack (tandem)drifting. I really don't think it's necessary for a smooth wide surface/layout. I'd stick with 50/50(Stock)
Having a mini-z that cannot run a straight line would be a PITA. lol... It's more tolerable in a 1/10 though.

YoYo-Pete
2011.02.02, 10:33 AM
Tandem drifting is so the goal though...

Deca
2011.02.02, 11:54 AM
So over in another thread I'm hearing go as cheap as possible on the one way, but here I'm getting the impression that the crazy expensive kyosho diff is the way to go due to weird consistency issues?

Skv012a
2011.02.02, 01:18 PM
One way is a locked diff, there are no settings to set or lose, so I wouldn't see a difference in build quality. Ball diffs are a whole different story.

Also, similar questions in 2 threads are starting to become confusing.

YoYo-Pete
2011.02.02, 02:01 PM
Agreed... I'm going to let the other thread die. :D

ocean rodeo
2011.02.02, 05:01 PM
A one way spins forward and when you apply the brakes it free wheels. It's not really a spool but I get your point. I guess you can go the cheaper route but I am usually a OEM guy because of fitment and quality. On my race cars that i've owned I used other after market parts i.e. PN,Reflex, Atomic but the drivetrain I always went with Kyosho. Their ball diffs are butter, but like with anything go within your budget.

Felix2010
2011.02.03, 04:10 AM
The thing that makes Kyosho diffs whether it be gear, ball, one-way, rigid, whatever - Is the Spur(Ring) gear Kyosho gives you on the diff. The Kyosho differentials have the sweetest and smoothest spur(ring) gears to them. So for drivetrain efficiency and for smooth drivetrain/sensitive drivetrain, I suggest Kyosho. At least you won't have to upgrade again, unlike if say the situation happens that you don't like the Atomic or 3R diffs you buy, and then want to get the Kyosho diff afterwards...:)

iruninsoga
2011.02.03, 07:47 PM
Absolutely true. It would be nice if you could put the kyosho spurs on the third party diffs. I put kyosho spurs on all the third party ball diffs I use for MR-02/03...

If you upgrade the third party ball diffs with thrust bearing then they're alright. There's still only a super small window of proper adjustment but there will be less slip at that setting than with the stock non-thrust bearing. Switching to higher grade balls (ceramic or whatnot) might help as well.

The kyosho awd ball diff is probably THE most expensive part (other than boards) that they make. It's hard to make the decision if they're worth it or not.

EDIT: Forgot about the DWS, which is more expensive than a kyosho ball diff.

ocean rodeo
2011.02.04, 08:01 AM
I guess it all depends also on how serious you are with your models. If your drifting alone at home on the kitchen floor then I would say it's not worth spending all that money. On the other hand if your competing or drifting on a circuit then yes I would spend the money. The stock drive train against a front one way and ball diff are like night and day.

Felix2010
2011.02.04, 01:28 PM
Absolutely true. It would be nice if you could put the kyosho spurs on the third party diffs. I put kyosho spurs on all the third party ball diffs I use for MR-02/03...

If you upgrade the third party ball diffs with thrust bearing then they're alright. There's still only a super small window of proper adjustment but there will be less slip at that setting than with the stock non-thrust bearing. Switching to higher grade balls (ceramic or whatnot) might help as well.

The kyosho awd ball diff is probably THE most expensive part (other than boards) that they make. It's hard to make the decision if they're worth it or not.

EDIT: Forgot about the DWS, which is more expensive than a kyosho ball diff.

IDK if you know this already, but the Atomic TAR MA010 ball diffs have the ability to use the Kyosho ball diff spur/ring gear - The TAR spur gear has the same center bearing and setup. The Atomic TAR ball diff is actually not a bad piece; The thing is, if you buy a TAR diff and then buy the Kyosho diff spur gear to go along with it, the cost gets pretty close to the cost of a new Kyosho AWD ball diff itself...

IMHO, the investment in the Kyosho ball diffs are worth the price. That's just me though, I primarily have my AWD's set up for racing, not drifting... The old Atomic black/plastic "Precision" ball diffs (I own 3:)) are OK for the price, if they're still available. They need thrust bearing upgrade, and if you want the white/Delrin spur gear upgrade for this diff is nice too.

In the end, It's all what you want to spend for $$

Deca
2011.02.04, 04:08 PM
So the question of Kyosho vs 3rd party for a one-way diff has still gone unanswered.

Someone mentioned issues with irregular left-right turning on a cheaper diff? I'd ideally like to have the most controllable drift setup possible, and I'm definitely interested in trying CS gearing.

Regarding CS gearing...is it possible with parts included with the MA010? I can't remember what gears came with it exactly...I feel like there were only replacements for the big gear on the back of the driveshaft? Would I actually need to change the gear on the diff itself?

ocean rodeo
2011.02.04, 04:28 PM
So the question of Kyosho vs 3rd party for a one-way diff has still gone unanswered.

Someone mentioned issues with irregular left-right turning on a cheaper diff? I'd ideally like to have the most controllable drift setup possible, and I'm definitely interested in trying CS gearing.

Regarding CS gearing...is it possible with parts included with the MA010? I can't remember what gears came with it exactly...I feel like there were only replacements for the big gear on the back of the driveshaft? Would I actually need to change the gear on the diff itself?

Lol... I say go for the Kyosho.

Yes you would need to change the diff gear. I would practice with the stock gearing before moving to CS, like I said before If your not competing or running on a really tight circuit( two cars wide) don't even bother, also CS really needs an insane amount of throw in order to benefit from it too. Mini-z really doesn't offer that much ackerman and I doubt you can mod it either. A counter steer set up is primarily to switch directions really tight and fast which can already be achieved with a 50/50 mini-z.

I'm not trying to sway you away from it at all. Just throwing some pennies at ya.

Felix2010
2011.02.04, 04:57 PM
So the question of Kyosho vs 3rd party for a one-way diff has still gone unanswered.

Someone mentioned issues with irregular left-right turning on a cheaper diff? I'd ideally like to have the most controllable drift setup possible, and I'm definitely interested in trying CS gearing.

Regarding CS gearing...is it possible with parts included with the MA010? I can't remember what gears came with it exactly...I feel like there were only replacements for the big gear on the back of the driveshaft? Would I actually need to change the gear on the diff itself?

The Kyosho One-Way will have smoother gear mesh than other brands' One-Way. The Kyosho One-Way is going to be superior. For best control/performance, Kyosho is the WTG.

The way to CS-gear would require either a front or front and rear diff with larger/smaller spur(ring) gears, 3Racing or Atomic for example. I know that Atomic has a 26t and a 28t spur(ring) gear available for their diffs. You could have an Atomic ball diff or spool rear running 26t spur, and then a front Kyosho One-Way diff running 28t spur.

Deca
2011.02.08, 04:30 PM
What's the consensus on suspension upgrades? What would actually be a practical upgrade to improve drifting control?

I see these DWS and A-Arm kits and...they look very cool. Not sure it would make a huge difference, but I sort of hope I'm wrong so I have an excuse to put them on my chassis :P

My front suspension has already started binding somewhat (likely helped along by my 4.5 degrees of camber...) and messing up weight transfer, making the car behave oddly at times while drifting. I've been told that some kingpin grease will take care of that and give me nice smooth suspension travel. I had been thinking upgrading parts so that it was all metal on metal would help as well but...this seems like a more cost effective solution.

ocean rodeo
2011.02.08, 04:50 PM
What's the consensus on suspension upgrades? What would actually be a practical upgrade to improve drifting control?

I see these DWS and A-Arm kits and...they look very cool. Not sure it would make a huge difference, but I sort of hope I'm wrong so I have an excuse to put them on my chassis :P

My front suspension has already started binding somewhat (likely helped along by my 4.5 degrees of camber...) and messing up weight transfer, making the car behave oddly at times while drifting. I've been told that some kingpin grease will take care of that and give me nice smooth suspension travel. I had been thinking upgrading parts so that it was all metal on metal would help as well but...this seems like a more cost effective solution.

You need nothing. Some soft springs and a little lube goes a long way. PN front kit and DWS would cost you more than buying another car:eek:
Do you compete or are you part of a big drift club?

Skv012a
2011.02.08, 05:08 PM
I'm w/ Rodeo here. You honestly don't need anything beyond 1-2* knuckles and MAYBE stronger diffs/driveshafts to drift these.

Why are you guys trying to make this harder than it actually is (not to mention pricy)?

Deca
2011.02.08, 05:09 PM
No competition yet, but I'm heading up a little drift club from our local crew. I've drifted a bunch of cheap RC stuff growing up, the MA010 is my first hobby grade drift car. I'm planning to pick up a 1/10 drift car as well in the summer if I can afford it, as I've always wanted one.

Our goal is to eventually have some sort of drift competition going as well as gymkhana. I'm dying to get some nice tight tandems in, as I never had anyone to drift with in the past. I'm sure it'll be a blast :)

I'm definitely not set on spending money here, I never expected to upgrade more than the knuckles and diffs honestly...but I like modding things :P If there was any real benefit to it I'd love an excuse to have fancy shiny parts all over my car, but if it's not going to do anything I'm not going to blow the money.

Was just asking out of curiosity. I was pretty sure they wouldn't really provide any sort of noticeable difference but figured I would ask just in case.

ocean rodeo
2011.02.08, 06:22 PM
No competition yet, but I'm heading up a little drift club from our local crew. I've drifted a bunch of cheap RC stuff growing up, the MA010 is my first hobby grade drift car. I'm planning to pick up a 1/10 drift car as well in the summer if I can afford it, as I've always wanted one.

Our goal is to eventually have some sort of drift competition going as well as gymkhana. I'm dying to get some nice tight tandems in, as I never had anyone to drift with in the past. I'm sure it'll be a blast :)

I'm definitely not set on spending money here, I never expected to upgrade more than the knuckles and diffs honestly...but I like modding things :P If there was any real benefit to it I'd love an excuse to have fancy shiny parts all over my car, but if it's not going to do anything I'm not going to blow the money.

Was just asking out of curiosity. I was pretty sure they wouldn't really provide any sort of noticeable difference but figured I would ask just in case.

It's all good. We all have the addiction to buy when we don't need to. The great thing about drifting is you really don't need much to get going and have alot of fun. Save your money and buy cheaper stuff like a couple nice sets of aluminum wheels in different offsets and maybe a light kit. Style is an important role in drifting.

new2u
2011.02.08, 06:57 PM
can i ask whats a good motor for drifting with ?

i have just been sent a set of drift tyres and have 3* knuckles on the way and see you said you dont need them, but surely they will look good and still drift well ?

also i have 1000mah batteries an there energizer ones so they should be perfect with an upgraded motor ? as mine seems a bit sorta slow, should it be ?

ocean rodeo
2011.02.08, 07:24 PM
can i ask whats a good motor for drifting with ?

i have just been sent a set of drift tyres and have 3* knuckles on the way and see you said you dont need them, but surely they will look good and still drift well ?

also i have 1000mah batteries an there energizer ones so they should be perfect with an upgraded motor ? as mine seems a bit sorta slow, should it be ?

I'm using a PN 70t and it's plenty motor. Camber has some effect if your running on a surface with a little grip like carpet or RCP.
I'm using 4.5 both front and rear with wide rears.

Deca
2011.02.08, 07:57 PM
I'm running 4.5 degrees up front and 0 degrees in the back, I wanna get higher offsets up front to flush fit it :)

I wish I could use wides to get more grip up front but since the wide drift tires aren't rounded it'd just be less...Also thinking of going up to 2 degrees of toe in in the back (assuming stock is 1)

ocean rodeo
2011.02.08, 08:08 PM
I'm running 4.5 degrees up front and 0 degrees in the back, I wanna get higher offsets up front to flush fit it :)

I wish I could use wides to get more grip up front but since the wide drift tires aren't rounded it'd just be less...Also thinking of going up to 2 degrees of toe in in the back (assuming stock is 1)

You can round the tires by dremelling the edges and buffing them out to bring back the shine. If you fish around the post pics of the MR-03 thread Dr. Kustom has a few pics of his car. He is really good at fabing things up.

Skv012a
2011.02.08, 08:49 PM
If there was any real benefit to it I'd love an excuse to have fancy shiny parts all over my car, but if it's not going to do anything I'm not going to blow the money.


Then get as much alloy as you can- more weight, more durable. Both great excuses to bling out the car :D

can i ask whats a good motor for drifting with ?

i have just been sent a set of drift tyres and have 3* knuckles on the way and see you said you dont need them, but surely they will look good and still drift well ?

also i have 1000mah batteries an there energizer ones so they should be perfect with an upgraded motor ? as mine seems a bit sorta slow, should it be ?

Motor, I'd say 70-50 turns should be plenty. You want torque and they'll give you just that. Maybe the new round can atomic motors too for a better torque curve.

ocean rodeo
2011.02.08, 10:39 PM
Who sells those Atomic motors? I'd like to check them out. :)

Deca those pics are actually in the AWD pic thread. Page 116.

Skv012a
2011.02.08, 11:17 PM
atomic itself does lol. EGRmart I believe.

new2u
2011.02.09, 05:49 AM
I'm using a PN 70t and it's plenty motor. Camber has some effect if your running on a surface with a little grip like carpet or RCP.
I'm using 4.5 both front and rear with wide rears.

can i run this on stock fets ?

ocean rodeo
2011.02.09, 07:15 AM
Yes you can run with stock fets.

ocean rodeo
2011.02.09, 07:30 AM
atomic itself does lol. EGRmart I believe.

Those look like they might hang to low in AWD's

Skv012a
2011.02.09, 09:20 AM
I'm using a PN 70t and it's plenty motor. Camber has some effect if your running on a surface with a little grip like carpet or RCP.
I'm using 4.5 both front and rear with wide rears.

You mean low grip like hardwood or cement. RCP has SO much grip that its ridiculous. Carpet is probably 2nd place. And lastly all the hard, smooth surfaces.

ocean rodeo
2011.02.09, 09:57 AM
You mean low grip like hardwood or cement. RCP has SO much grip that its ridiculous. Carpet is probably 2nd place. And lastly all the hard, smooth surfaces.

The camber settings have pretty much no effect on Zero grip surfaces such as hardwood floors, tile and yes smooth concrete. On the other hand with surfaces with a little grip i.e carpet, and yes smooth side of rcp( Don't forget we are using hard plastic tires not rubber)camber adjustments will be noticeable.

syafiq
2011.02.11, 08:37 AM
i agree on the cs gear, it really work. i used 28t in front and 26t at the rear. also dont waste your money one ball diff just buy solid axle from 3racing or Eagle racing which have include 26t gear. for one way any brand would do as long it has 28t gear.

some people say the car not will go straight with cs gear. well actually it can. the cs for miniz it wasnt that big it only has 1.02 cs compare to 1/10 which can go from 1.3 to 2.0 cs. also dont think i play my miniz on carpet, i actually play on the cement floor and the car still able to go straight normally. also when playing on the smooth floor, the car rear spring must be soften and the front is harden. i also agree on increasing the front weight it really improve the control.

for the motor it better to use a motor with a neo magnet. the reason is the neo magnet will apply a little bit break when throttle at neurtral.

Deca
2011.02.11, 10:34 AM
How much weight in front is needed to make a noticeable difference? I'm interested to experiment with this...wondering what I should try using to add weight.

Thanks for reminding me I need to pick up springs for my ma010 tomorrow too! :)

syafiq
2011.02.11, 01:33 PM
How much weight in front is needed to make a noticeable difference? I'm interested to experiment with this...wondering what I should try using to add weight.

Thanks for reminding me I need to pick up springs for my ma010 tomorrow too! :)

the heavier the front become the better the front grip. but dont forget weight spoil speed and acceleration. so you have determine your self much weight you want to put. the quicker way is use epoxy putty to the body shell.

ocean rodeo
2011.02.13, 11:01 AM
How much weight in front is needed to make a noticeable difference? I'm interested to experiment with this...wondering what I should try using to add weight.

Thanks for reminding me I need to pick up springs for my ma010 tomorrow too! :)

I didn't want to add weighs or epoxy or anything like that. What I did was splurge a little and bought the Kyosho aluminum front cover and a Atomic aluminum toe bar. Slight difference in turn in but nothing to go crazy over. I am also thinking about aluminum front knuckles but, they don't come in higher camber degree's.

The Delrin gears seem lighter too so that could be another option. Lightening up the rear is the route I'm going to go. I think Atomic makes a Delrin open rear top plate too.

syafiq
2011.02.14, 05:18 AM
aluminium is not heavy enough

Deca
2011.02.14, 03:30 PM
I put two quarters under the front end of the hood on my RX7 and the difference is AMAZING!! Much more control, better and more consistent entries, and better handling all around.

Thank you for the suggestion, I went from struggling to get around single corners on RCP at our clubs last meet up to fully linking both of the RCP layouts we had set up this weekend :)

It probably wasn't just the ballast alone, as I made a lot of changes on my radio profile between the last race and this one, but the ballast definitely did make a very noticeable difference.

Lightening up the rear is the route I'm going to go.

That's not really going to help you. Lightening the rear won't give you better front grip, which is what makes the difference. I recommend trying what I did, tape some coins up into the front of your autoscale :)

A common misconception about drifting is that you want the car to have as little grip as possible. Truth is, you actually want the car to have as MUCH grip as possible while still being able to break traction easily. Now due to the size and weight of the Mini-Z, this doesn't hold quite as true, but the basic concept is still there. The ABS tires work just fine, but you need to mess around to work a little extra grip out of them to improve control.

I'm still kind of curious about the GPM drift tires with the tread pattern cut into them, but after adding the weight my RX7 is drifting amazingly...Don't really see any reason to change anything else. I plan to play around with spring rates a little but...I dunno I don't feel like there's much improvement to be made at this point beyond my own ability :P

ocean rodeo
2011.02.14, 05:12 PM
aluminium is not heavy enough

For me currently I'm not having any issues whatsoever with my car, drifts perfectly. I was just throwing out my two cents:D.

There was a small difference with the addition of the aluminum parts but like I said nothing to go crazy over. I put some weights under the hood to see if there was more of a change but it just seemed to slow my car down to much off throttle mid drift..(didn't like it).

What works for one doesn't always work for the other. It all comes down to throttle control and turning point in the end.

Deca glad you have found a set up thats working for you. Happy Drifting!
Lightening up the rear of the car makes it easier to break loose and quickens your flicks. Look at all the high end rc drift cars. They are all mid-ship(motor and all weight placed forward).

Deca
2011.02.14, 05:15 PM
What works for one doesn't always work for the other. It all comes down to throttle control in the end.

Very good point. In any scale (all the way up to the real thing!) drift tuning is totally about personal preferences and making it work for your own driving style :) As long as you like how your car feels and you can look good driving it, it's set up properly!

ocean rodeo
2011.02.14, 05:22 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=isujpv8RcV0&feature=related
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IAHv_ndGS8o&feature=related
My track is going to be the same layout. I'm in the process of building it up now. Minus the hockyness.

syafiq
2011.02.15, 08:59 AM
also every setting must depend on the surface you playing. the setting that i mention it was for cement floor only. i try on the carpet on the carpet it wasnt really that good. it only make mid drift like ocean rodeo mention. i havent try on rcp but i think it wont work. also i forgot to mention that if you rub the drift tyre with sandpaper it will improve the grip on cement floor (not for carpet).

anyway the basic setting for drift is drift tyre, one way and solid axle. other than that is depend on your self and surface you playing

ocean rodeo
2011.02.15, 07:40 PM
Another Goodie!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YYVaYmCOPX4&feature=fvsr

YoYo-Pete
2011.02.16, 09:02 AM
Video is sweet! Most of the mini-z stuff on the youtubes is awful.

ocean rodeo
2011.02.18, 07:34 PM
Not mini-z but if you are a fan of rc drifting in general, these boys are legit!!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NTsrNsrvVg8&playnext=1&list=PL2745C150F78ADC36

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2xBBZJM7z4U&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sl0qNJnHsrU

syafiq
2011.02.19, 07:44 AM
1/10 has much fun compare to awd miniz because there has a lot of range of modification compare to awd miniz. also the price is more expensive than miniz thus

syafiq
2011.04.28, 11:43 AM
anyone know how to increase the steering angle of the ma-010?

AsphaltScream
2011.05.13, 09:22 PM
Hi,
After a year break I started to build a small track made of fitness mats at home and I want to finish my drifting MA010.
I found the info about the one way diff very interesting and I am going to buy the Atomic one way (the cheap one), but I need to make something clear before: What does it mean "to undergear the diff"? shall I remove the gears from inside it? and than you talked about 28t spur gears, those are not included in the rtr package so I will have to buy one aswell. than wich pinion gear will go with it, the 8t? Sorry if the questions look dumb!

Bodom
2011.05.15, 08:58 AM
On the AWD with stock parts you can alter the main gear ratio only. (motor pinion and central shaft spur gear).
If you use aftermarket ball diffs, one way unit or solid axle you can change the gear ratios from the central shaft to the differentials too. And even more - you can set them separately front and rear.
For example - the 3Racing ball diff (http://www.******.com/catalog/rc-miniz-3racing-ball-diff-shaft-awd26v3-p-26196.html?cPath=595_736_1128) comes with three different spur gears - 26T, 27T and 28T.
The Atomic ball diff (http://www.egrracing.com/shop/awd-balldiff-set-p-85.html) comes with 27T spur only, but you can purchase the 26T (http://www.egrracing.com/shop/awd-ball-diff-gear-option-gear-26-t-p-97.html) and 28T (http://www.egrracing.com/shop/awd-ball-diff-gear-space-gear-28-t-p-98.html) separately.
Undergearing and overgearing the diffs means to use different from the stock 27T diff spur gear.
If you use 28T in the front and 26T on the rear - this will make the front wheels to rotate slowly than the rear wheels, which will make your car loose rear wheel traction almost constantly. I believe this technique of gearing the car is called CS setup (Counter Steer).
Now read this thread again and I hope it will be more clear to you.
:)

AsphaltScream
2011.05.16, 03:45 PM
*Introducing me to the gear ratio witchcraft*

Thank you! I did, I red again color01's post and I understood how it works!
I just placed the order for a front one way and a rear ball diff with the respective gears.
I already heard about putting a one way in the front but I did not exactly why.
When i drift sometimes, I push the brake instinctively and nothing just happens and while powering over the rear tends to pull the car on the outside of the corner. I am excited now to try the e-brake effect!

AsphaltScream
2011.10.02, 11:58 AM
So, a little update here:

I bought:
AWD Ball differential set,
AWD Front One Way Set,
AWD One Way Delrin Spare Gear (28t),
AWD Ball Diff. Delrin Spare Gear (26t).
Then I bought AWD Thrust Ball Bearing, but I did not figure how to assemble it.

So from the various ideas shown on this thread I chose to go front one way, rear ball diff.

Both counter steer and hand brake effect are true; just by going straight and tap the brake produces a funny 180 turn.
Anyway I still didn't find a use for it while drifting, it was only useful when I was going out of the track and needed to recover the car.
While drifting, tapping the brake results in a snapping movement of the car wich is very fast and not modular, so I find myself with the car stopped facing the inside of the track.

What was very funny was the countersteering part:
you DO have to counter or the back will come around.
I have to say it makes drift more difficult, but when you manage to run that imaginary line exiting without spinning is glorius!

syafiq
2011.10.03, 06:38 AM
So, a little update here:


What was very funny was the countersteering part:
you DO have to counter or the back will come around.
I have to say it makes drift more difficult, but when you manage to run that imaginary line exiting without spinning is glorius!

but you will get smoother and longer drifting. also the cs gear ratio for miniz is very small (1.08) so it wont be difficult at all compare to 1/10 which can go to 2.00.
1.08= the rear tyre is 8% faster than the front tyre
2.00= the rear tyre is twice faster than the front tyre