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View Full Version : Arch2b's Kyosho Stock Class Car


arch2b
2011.07.23, 12:19 PM
those in are area know we have been talking about stock class racing for some time. talk of novice classes goes back even further. with Kyosho's sponsoring an event at their facility, they've been kind enough to develop a good set of stock class rules that our club has adopted for use in our o0wn series and hopefully other local clubs as well.

as i do not have any cars that even remotely resemble stock setups, i sold my mod car and bought a new chassis set. i'm a sucker for limited editions so i picked up the No. 32751 Red Limited Edition set as a starting point as it already has the top shock, lm damper kits and ball bearings. basically, all the allowable hop ups under the rules (damper kit limited to LM configuration).

http://mini-zracer.com/mini-zgallery/data/1381/medium/IMG_0406_1_.JPG

i've now got to remove some of the upgrades like lock nuts, ball diff and front sway bar but it's far easier to simply take parts off than replace entire chassis. i also have to switch out the motor pod for the red mm motor pod i orderd off ebay. at least now i also have the red version of MM, LM and RM motor pods as well. what always worried me however are the stock motor pod covers as the loops tend to crack and break rather easily.

http://mini-zracer.com/mini-zgallery/data/1381/medium/IMG_0411_1_.JPG

http://mini-zracer.com/mini-zgallery/data/1381/medium/IMG_0412_1_.JPG

arch2b
2011.07.23, 12:36 PM
ah, grabbed the atomic multi tool (love these) as the screw driver fits stock screws better than the PN tool. quickly brought me back to the fearful days of stripping stock screws:rolleyes: how in the hell did the assembly of these allow for such torqued installation of these screws without stripping them? i cringed every time i try to get a screw out of the motor pod, h plate and motor leads. god i love the hex head screws...

arch2b
2011.07.23, 12:42 PM
this season i will also attempt to travel with less gear. i love my ex-10 but it's bulky to carry so i also picked up the No. 82012R Kyosho Perfex EX-5UR ASF Transmitter for Mini-Z and dNaNo (2.4GHz ASF) - Limited Edition Red. you either love the garish red or hate it. i happen to like red to it fits me fine. i'll never loose it either on a table.

http://mini-zracer.com/mini-zgallery/data/1394/medium/IMG_0392_1_.JPG

the color is a very close match to the chassis color except for the lack of the gloss finish to the plastic. the tx is a flat finish.

http://mini-zracer.com/mini-zgallery/data/1394/medium/IMG_0398_1_.JPG

arch2b
2011.07.23, 12:54 PM
noticed the motor pod has ball bearings as well, need to pull those out and replace with bushings.

http://mini-zracer.com/mini-zgallery/data/1381/medium/IMG_0414_1_.JPG

now i need to find my stash of stock differentials:rolleyes: i know i had at least half a dozen a couple weeks ago before i cleaned up my travel box.

arch2b
2011.07.23, 01:21 PM
nice, the kit comes with the stock upper arm screw pins. simple swap out.

drat, kit does not come with MM motor cover damper posts. unbelievably, the red MM motor pod kit doesn't come with them either. looks like i'll have to go with a black plastic part for this.

oh, be aware, the red MM motor pod kit comes with an mr-02 h plate.

reaper
2011.07.23, 05:15 PM
ah, grabbed the atomic multi tool (love these) as the screw driver fits stock screws better than the PN tool. quickly brought me back to the fearful days of stripping stock screws:rolleyes: how in the hell did the assembly of these allow for such torqued installation of these screws without stripping them? i cringed every time i try to get a screw out of the motor pod, h plate and motor leads. god i love the hex head screws...

just an fyi
i always ponderd how the get the screw so tight then a friend who works in a toy company informed me that the parts are assembled before the plastic is fully cured and as such when it does harden its binds to the screws ,
this isnt intentional its just for speed of asembly on mass produced parts

arch2b
2011.07.23, 06:13 PM
explains why you need to crack them loose sometimes. you can actually hear the sound when the screw breaks contact and begins turning freely.

mini-z
2011.07.24, 11:34 AM
Looking good R - one thing about stock class is there's perhaps not as much chance for personal expression given the limited parts choice - the Limited Edition Red MR-03 is a great solution! :) [plug: we actually have them on sale right now!] I started converting mine from LM to MM last night, opting for a red 599XX to continue the red theme. I'm sticking w/ my EX-10, but maybe I should pick up the red grip set for it!? :D:cool:

arch2b
2011.07.24, 01:06 PM
i like that there are more colors available now for grips. i'm also holding out hope that i can find the clear red enzo for my toy display chassis. ;) trying to get the whole red package for that one. or maybe a clear LM so the red chassis can be seen.

back to stock class, your right. i like individual expression :) i've even gone so far as to paint the stock chassis. if it came down to it, i'd do this again if needed.
http://mini-zracer.com/mini-zgallery/data/968/medium/IMG_10841.JPG

arch2b
2011.07.24, 01:44 PM
in looking over the car more closely, i had to remove the red shock as it's an oil shock and replace with a stock rear shock. also had to remove the front suspension spacers (red, blue, gold aluminum spacers) and replace with the stock plastic spacers.

i drove the car around today and while it's not what i'm used to, it does handle decently. certainly not enough to place high on the charts in hfay but with the right tires, it's not all that bad. body choice will play a big role due to overhangs, weight, wings, bits that snag rails, etc. the front splitters on the gt-r will stop you dead in your tracks.

arch2b
2011.08.21, 01:55 PM
well, tried the HSV and it bounced around all over our very bumpy track. i got spanked by a pair of 102mm LM cars so i'm going to give the R390 a try.

http://mini-zracer.com/mini-zgallery/data/1403/medium/IMG_4617.JPG

mleemor60
2011.08.21, 03:15 PM
Looks pretty nice. Did you get the care package?

arch2b
2011.08.21, 05:31 PM
sorry, you can't see the wheels on there but got them :) the fronts are way out there but they work. it'll be more incentive to stay off the walls;)

mleemor60
2011.08.21, 05:58 PM
Find a pair of Mazda 787B fronts. More steering as well from those which should help the dump truck tendancies. Just go ahead and paint the Sauber. You will be really pleased with that.

EMU
2011.08.21, 07:57 PM
You can also try a pair of Ferrari 250GTO wheels, which are classis, 0mm offset and are the same diameter as the LM wheels... The R390 is much more aggressive than the Sauber is. Sauber is my favorite LM body, it is stable and fast, as well as very durable. With the alternate rear wing, you can change the handling characteristics a good deal as well. It has a little more mass, more downforce... so the rear swings a little bit into the corner, and plants the rear out. It is VERY minor, but I notice it... I use the high downforce wing, and I removed the lead weight that I had between the chassis and motormount :)

herman
2011.08.21, 10:12 PM
hi arch... can you post a pic of your rims with the r390? wondering what rims are actually allowed for the stock class... lm rims or 02/03 rims?

is the front of the r390 fragile? like how does it hold up to front end collisions?
in line with this, will front bumpers (i.e. made for the 962 / mazda787 / sauber c9, dunno if there is one made for the r390) be allowed for the stock class?

last question... will lowering shims be allowed for stock class?

herman
2011.08.21, 10:13 PM
Did you get the care package?
pardon my ignorance... what's the care package?

mleemor60
2011.08.22, 06:03 AM
CARE was an old World assistance program.

arch2b
2011.08.22, 07:34 AM
hi arch... can you post a pic of your rims with the r390? wondering what rims are actually allowed for the stock class... lm rims or 02/03 rims?

is the front of the r390 fragile? like how does it hold up to front end collisions?
in line with this, will front bumpers (i.e. made for the 962 / mazda787 / sauber c9, dunno if there is one made for the r390) be allowed for the stock class?

last question... will lowering shims be allowed for stock class?

pictures of the sauber wheels attached.

i've read the front is fragile but i have not raced it yet. i cannot use bumpers or the like as this is for our stock class, only what came on the body is allowed. no additional parts. i did have to file back the pointy wheel opening so the tires would actually turn. otherwise, they get hung up on the bottom point. i'll have to check to see if i can glue in plastic bits to reinforce the corners but that's additive so questionable.
we also mandate that LM wheels must be used with LM bodies, i'm not certain is kyosho stock does. per kyosho stock wheel rule, wheel types must match but with LM, it's vague at best given they don't match to begin with.

for our stock class, no additional parts are allowed. the kits come with 2 shims per front axel, this is what we have to work with. basically, whatever you can pick from the contents of your stock kit appropriate to your motor mount type, track width and wheelbase.

mleemor60
2011.08.22, 07:43 AM
It is splitting hairs but technically the R390 was a GT car which competed against the Porsche GT-1 and the AMG Mercedes for a couple of years between the old Group "C" cars and the cars they currently run. French involvement with Nissan got the car homologated with ony two ever produced of which only one was ever accounted for. It's in a museum.

Arch. Find some 787 wheels.

arch2b
2011.08.22, 07:55 AM
yeah, the R390 is not your normal case as the chassis kit is shown with 360 gtc wheels however some official images show it with LM wheels. since it's 102 and similar to the other LM's, i choose to go this route. i also already bought the tires...

i'll ask the guys at the next race for spare 787 fronts.

102mm takes some getting used to, i'll say that much. i run 94mm 85% of the time, 10% 98mm and 5% 90mm so 102mm is new to me.

Pierro
2011.08.22, 08:51 AM
Hi!

Nice car Arch. Be aware that the sauber rear wheels are more fragile than the 787b. They tend to bent in case of a bad hit resulting in a sluggish rear train.
On my sauber I used some 962 wheels in black. More durable and same offset as the sauber's.

mleemor60
2011.08.22, 08:55 AM
You will likely find that you will ultimately be able to drive the living daylights out of it with out feeling any of the twitchiness of the shorter cars. It's great for an old guy like me cause I never feel like I'm chasing the car.

Re enforce the nose with a piece of cellophane tape across the outside of the body so it covers everything from wheel well to wheel well. PM me for exact details.

LED
2011.08.22, 09:44 AM
Here in belgium we ran a stock LM class last year.
Everything stock, even only LM rims and tires. Only front springs were allowed.
Most fun I ever had racing mini-z cars.
Altough 1 thing you need is a tire truer. LM tires (mainly the back ones) will not work very well if not trued down.

I only ever used 20 on the rear and 20 on the front. Worked great on every surface and you still had the front spring, H-plate and oil to play with.

1 thing you need to take care of is the diff.

arch2b
2011.08.22, 01:13 PM
it really surprises you at how well a box stock car can do when you start using it this way, with like cars. i managed to do almost as well with the 98mm stock as i did with 94mm HFAY. suspension upgrades allowed in HFAY really improve the handling on our bumpy track so there is only so much one can do with stock when springs, h plate, shock all must remain stock. your left with experimenting with various grease and or oil combinations.

once we get over the initial shock and frustration of stock + bumpy track, i think it will be a lot of fun for us as your not spending an inordinate amount of time or money on the car.

no one at the track has a truer. have to use sanding blocks or whatever will work to flatten out the LM tires.

EMU
2011.08.22, 01:23 PM
I just drive my LM tires down to size unless I am in a huge rush at an event. Usually takes a few packs to get them flat... Then they are good after that. You may need to adjust your gearing as the tires wear, so keep that in mind.

I use the LM20 rear /LM30 front setup on my LM car for RCP. For the upcoming PN regional, I may have to change to a more aggressive tire, since I dont think that the Kyosho rubber plays nice on the MHS track... it may require PN rubber.

To ghetto true the tires, chuck the wheels into a dremel, and spin them up on some very coarse sandpaper. Just aim to get them flat, dont worry too much about decreasing the diameter unless you have clearance issues with the body (if you have lowered it).

arch2b
2011.08.22, 01:42 PM
30/20 kyosho tires were a perfect fit for our RCP. i typically scuff the tires with a fine grade sanding block vs actually truing the tires. that.s done naturally with wear and tear for me. rather do ti the natural way before putting anything in a drill or dremel.

i think the biggest adjustment for us was acclimating to the speed. after so many years of 70T or faster motors, getting back into a rhythm with a stock motor took some practice. for the most part, we don't run into each other nearly as much in stock and manage to stay off the rails more often.

we had 3 cars this month. hope to have 4-6 next month. holding out hope the larger scale onroad guys will be back in the fall/winter as well. the hobby shop has already sold a couple kits but have yet to see them return for racing, it just takes time.

herman
2011.08.23, 12:50 AM
CARE was an old World assistance program.
from wiki... CARE (Cooperative for Assistance and Relief Everywhere) is a broad-spectrum secular relief, humanitarian, and development non-governmental organization fighting global poverty. It is non-political, non-sectarian and operates annually in more than 70 countries across the globe.

ah... now i gotcha... was wondering what was that all about and its relevance to arch's kyosho stock class car... :D

sorry to be off topic...

mleemor60
2011.08.23, 05:30 AM
Educating youngsters World wide.

herman
2011.08.24, 09:51 PM
yeah, the R390 is not your normal case as the chassis kit is shown with 360 gtc wheels however some official images show it with LM wheels. since it's 102 and similar to the other LM's, i choose to go this route. i also already bought the tires...

i'll ask the guys at the next race for spare 787 fronts.

102mm takes some getting used to, i'll say that much. i run 94mm 85% of the time, 10% 98mm and 5% 90mm so 102mm is new to me.

oh, thanks for the pics arch... i do remember seeing pics of the r390 with the 360 rims... however i haven't seen the official images r390 with lm rims... what lm rims did they specifically use?

herman
2011.08.24, 09:53 PM
Educating youngsters World wide.
:) come to think of it i vaguely remember seeing some care ads on tv....

arch2b
2011.08.25, 12:50 PM
i don't recall where i pulled this one (http://shop.tinyrc.com/d_images/KYO-R246-1133-a.jpg) from so long ago, but this one uses 787 wheels.

this kit (http://www.pcmshop.com/5006-5586-thickbox/kyosho-mini-z-mr-03w-lm-nissan-r390-gt1-n21.jpg) appears to have aluminum wheels

this one (http://www.kyosho.com/common/image.php?id=123565) has what looks like the 360 gtc wheels

and this on (http://www.rc-car-news.de/pnews_mag/org/kyosho000223_3.jpg)e again, shows aluminum wheels

kyoshosan
2011.08.28, 01:50 PM
These guys in Japan don't seem to be having issues racing w/ KT-18 Radios :-)

http://kyoshosan.blogspot.com/2011/08/dnano-df-gpx-f1-round-2-race-in-japan.html

arch2b
2011.08.28, 02:48 PM
cookies for them. some don't mind the kt-18, i happen to dislike it both for cost efficiency and reliability.

a stock class car however is a stock class car.

what i love about the images you see from the homeland is the creativity they have with these, be it a kt-18 or dnano.

kyoshosan
2011.08.28, 10:19 PM
what i love about the images you see from the homeland is the creativity they have with these, be it a kt-18 or dnano.

I totally agree with you. The F1 dnanos are awesome yet simple and the customized radios are also way cool.

I wish I had a "crazy" bunch like these guys here in my city :-)

TheRinger
2011.08.29, 08:49 PM
If U want Ray, U can use the sauber body I was going 2 use. I also have a spare set of sauber wheels if U want them.(hope I'm spelling it right:o) The sauber has a wider offset then the 787.

arch2b
2011.08.30, 12:34 PM
Mike sent me a set of the sauber wheels which i have on the car now. they work but i have to stay well clear of a rail or they grab. i need to find a pair of 787 front wheels. not having any experience with 102mm LM, the R390 isn't all that bad to me. it gets around my mini-96 well enough.

arch2b
2011.10.20, 06:44 AM
To follow up, Ian had a set of 787 wheels and the front offset is perfect. I would recommend anyone buying the autoscale version to buy a set of 787 wheels if you can find them.

arch2b
2014.04.13, 11:21 AM
i've jumped ship from LM to normal autoscales (not LM). i just happen to prefer driving these in the long run despite the differences in performance of stock class. i think it's more to do with the love of driving around die-cast like models of exciting cars that i really enjoy. lets just say i get more enjoyment out of driving around fun cars than finishing in 1st place :D don't get me wrong, i still aim to to finish as best as i can, i just prefer to have more fun doing it.

here is my latest incarnation of my stock class car.

byebye
2014.04.13, 04:01 PM
You know I meant to ask you about that car. I want to see it in person.