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kyoshosan
2011.08.01, 11:53 AM
Hi Guys,

I'm looking for the Setup Clues from the guys racing at MC3 track ? I saw the setup sheet posted on MC3 Blog from Herbert but the image is small and very difficult to read, it also seems to be a MR-02 setup sheet. Can you guys help me ? I would like to know what are you guys using for camber, toe-in/out, springs, T-Bars, Tires and etc...

Thanks in advance,

pomme de terre
2011.08.01, 02:57 PM
Hey Alex, what body are you planning to run? The Enzo?

It seems that the choice in body (and the associated weight distribution and offsets) has a huge impact on the overall handling and the setup you use for the car.

Most guys run Kyosho 20 radials in the rear and 30 slicks in the front though rather than the PN tires, as the base starting point.

kyoshosan
2011.08.01, 03:48 PM
Hi Pomme de terre,

I guess I will use the enzo. I'm trying to use my last days in vacation to start adding some hopups to my car.

One thing that has been keeping me from running better is that I can't tune "brake drag" w/ the EX-5UR radio, so when I go full-throttle and back to neutral, my car keeps spinning the wheels for a long time. I can "fix" that by going negative on the Throttle Trim but then I end up having no reverse.

Joey and Shawn tried changing some ICS settings last time I was there but unfortunately it did not fix the problem.

Other than that the car seems to be running ok.

Guinness
2011.08.02, 10:26 AM
I use the reflex racing front end (which i really like) and the kyosho rear friction shock w/ oil shock. i also use k30 radial fronts and k20 radial rears. as far as i know, me and Casey are the only ones using radials in the front at the track. cant remember what t-plate/camber/toe bar im running.

if you're looking at Herbert's or Casey's car, that's a good start since they build/drive really well

btw, my car is the yellow Murcielago

kyoshosan
2011.08.02, 11:34 AM
Thanks Guiness! I hope Herbert or Casey can give me that t-plate/camber/toe bar info that I'm looking for.

See ya on Aug 13th! :-)

josyskunk
2011.08.12, 05:44 AM
hi , it 's casey. I am running K's hardest t-plate with 3 deg camber in front and 2 deg toe in. hopes this info help

josyskunk
2011.08.12, 05:56 AM
hi , kyoshosan, as with drag brake problem, i ran into the same problem a while ago. When you are saying the rear wheel spin for a long time, I guess you are saying your car is not slowing down faster enough when you release the throttle. I tried a couple of things, first i tried higher torque motor which usually has more drag brake. It helps in some degree. Then I found out that when I felt the car is not slowing down fast enough, it is actually the car do not has enough turn in. So I use a softer front. The feel is better, then I still want more turn in, so I shorten the wheel base to 94mm, now with the combination of the three, I have more than enough turn in and can carry more speed into corner and faster lap time !!!:):D

EMU
2011.08.12, 06:29 AM
Is this an MR02 or MR03 that does not slow down enough when you let off throttle? If it is an MR02, it has Virtual Inertia by default in the ICS settings, which keeps a little power to the motor after you release throttle. With an ICS adapter, you can disable this. The MR03 Virtual Inertia is off by default. If the Inertia setting is off, you can slightly adjust the drag brake with throttle trim settings by trimming up for less drag brake and trimming down for more. There is a limited range that you can trim before you lose the reverse function, so test to see that you can easily enter reverse when you make an adjustment. You can also try widening the neutral of the throttle to get a slightly larger window of trimming without hurting the reverse function.

I just read the post that shows you have covered the above ICS settings, which leads me to think that you may be using a motor that has very low drag brake... Motor choice effects drag brake as well, a motor with neo magnets will typically have more drag brake. What motor are you using, and what are your motor restrictions? If you are using a Kyosho motor or PN 50t, round ATM, they typically have very little drag brake...

Unfortunately, there is no difference between the transmitters as far as increasing drag brake, so the EX-5, EX-10, or KT-18 all have no ability to increase drag brake. This is something that I wish Kyosho would address in the ICS software.

Another option is to try to increase scrub, so that the setup will slow the car down more when you turn into the corners... I personally dont like scrub, but it may be necessary if you feel the car is not slowing down enough.

kyoshosan
2011.08.12, 07:55 AM
hi , it 's casey. I am running K's hardest t-plate with 3 deg camber in front and 2 deg toe in. hopes this info help

Hi Casey,

Thanks for the reply. Are you using the Carbon or the Fiber T-plate ?

See you tomorrow at the Track :-)

kyoshosan
2011.08.12, 08:01 AM
Is this an MR02 or MR03 that does not slow down enough when you let off throttle? If it is an MR02, it has Virtual Inertia by default in the ICS settings, which keeps a little power to the motor after you release throttle. With an ICS adapter, you can disable this. The MR03 Virtual Inertia is off by default. If the Inertia setting is off, you can slightly adjust the drag brake with throttle trim settings by trimming up for less drag brake and trimming down for more. There is a limited range that you can trim before you lose the reverse function, so test to see that you can easily enter reverse when you make an adjustment. You can also try widening the neutral of the throttle to get a slightly larger window of trimming without hurting the reverse function.

It's a MR-03 and yes I've had the ICS checked and Virtual Inertia is off.

I just read the post that shows you have covered the above ICS settings, which leads me to think that you may be using a motor that has very low drag brake... Motor choice effects drag brake as well, a motor with neo magnets will typically have more drag brake. What motor are you using, and what are your motor restrictions? If you are using a Kyosho motor or PN 50t, round ATM, they typically have very little drag brake...


I'm using Kyosho X-Speed Motor (2.4GHz one). Which one would you recommend ? if I'm not mistaken, we are running a open class and any stock motor is allowed, please correct me if I'm wrong guys.

A little side track question, what's the difference between the Kyosho X-Speed motors, the new 2.4GHz and the old versions ? Can I still use the older ones on the new ASF cars ?


Unfortunately, there is no difference between the transmitters as far as increasing drag brake, so the EX-5, EX-10, or KT-18 all have no ability to increase drag brake. This is something that I wish Kyosho would address in the ICS software.


I'm sorry to hear that, i just bought myself an EX-10 Eurus, hoping to fix this problem...


Another option is to try to increase scrub, so that the setup will slow the car down more when you turn into the corners... I personally dont like scrub, but it may be necessary if you feel the car is not slowing down enough.

What is scrub ? sorry for my ignorance :-)

Thanks for the comments!

EMU
2011.08.12, 07:29 PM
Scrub is the front tires slowing the car down as they steer past the optimum slip angle. Some tire compounds/wider offsets will increase the scrub a bit, so you can stay on throttle more in the corners or slow the car down a little more as you enter/go through the corner. In general, I feel that when the car scrubs, I get less steering as the tire is slowing the car down instead of steering it, so I look for the least amount of scrub and try to use my motor/brake to slow the car down if needed.

I would recommend trying the Atomic Stock-BB motor. It is a noticeable increase in power out of the corner, but not a huge difference in speed if geared similarly to the X-Speed. The motor will slow down much faster due to the neo magnets though, so it may be something you should look into if you want to have more drag brake effect. Alternate motors would be the PN 43t which is similar in power curve to the ATM Stock-BB, even the PN 50t or ATM Standard BB should have a little more drag brake than the X-Speed due to slightly stronger ferrite magnets.

I dont think that there are any fundamental changes to the X-Speed motors besides capacitors, or the fuse that comes on the motor for the ASF version. I personally remove this, so it does not shut off which it occasionally does. I dont think that it will hurt the car by removing it, since I use much more powerful motors on the stock fets...

josyskunk
2011.08.13, 01:57 AM
Kyoshosan, I found the ultimate solution to your problem. You are right in getting the EX10 Eurus radio. In Eurus, there is a function called neutral brake, it lets you to set the amount of brake to apply when the trigger is at neutral postion. So your problem of the car not stopping fast enough is solved no matter what motor you will be using :) ( it solve my problem too since I just check my 4PKS 's menu and Futaba have the same function. Wished I have found this solution earlier and I should do better at the last point series race:D)

EMU
2011.08.13, 10:39 AM
The problem is that the receiver has a limited range, and if you have neutral brake set too aggressively, you will lose the ability to reverse as the receiver will receive 'reverse' signals when the throttle is in the neutral position...

Try increasing the neutral band to wide, which will give you a little more adjustability to the trim/or neutral brake. You may then need to use a little throttle punch to give an earlier throttle response when you get on the throttle so you dont have to pull the trigger 20% of its travel before it engages forward throttle response. After you set your drag brake trim rate or neutral brake. Left the car and put it near your ear, gradually pull the throttle and listen to the car to hear any noise as the car starts to power the motor, usually you can hear a slight whine. I increase punch until I hear this sound just as I get onto the throttle about 5% of the pull. This will maximize your throttle modulation as you wont lose any throttle pull by reversing trim. I think that the Eurus with its Neutral Brake sort of does this for you, but if you use the trim function instead, you will lose a little on the bottom end of the throttle pull.

I havent had much time to use the Eurus, so I am not aware of all of the changes and how they compare to the settings that the Helios has, which is why I use more old fashioned techniques to accomplish essentially the same thing.