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Penser
2012.10.11, 03:42 PM
Hi all,
I'm interested in wirelessly controlling a very small battery-powered motor. I was thinking that a good place to start was adapting it from cars like these.

All I need at the moment is to be able to remotely start it, but would like to eventually be able to control the output of the motor.

Does anyone have any suggestions on specifically what kind of remote transmitters/receivers I could use to accomplish this?

Thanks!

imxlr8ed
2012.10.11, 03:50 PM
Would help but I don't think I can really give specifics if I don't know what is required...

Motor size?

Brushless or Brushed?

Power source?

Output of said power source?

Wireless? (AM?... FM?... 2.4ghz?)

Lot's of people here willing to help, but I'm sure they will feel the same as I do.

Penser
2012.10.11, 05:14 PM
Thanks for the reply!

This project is in its beginning stages, so none of those variables are decided yet. I'm sure my group is willing to make a design that supports the wireless system's needs as long as our requirements are met.

This motor needs to be very close to the dimensions, power output etc. of the vibrating component in cell phones, and needs to be able to be continuously run for 8 hours. All we need the motor for is to provide vibration.

We'll be deciding on specifics soon, but if it wouldn't be too much trouble for you to suggest a good powering option to go along with the wireless set-up that you think is good, I'd appreciate it.

Hope this helps!

Penser
2012.10.11, 05:17 PM
Also, i'd like to point out that my experience in this area is almost non-existent. So any teaching points would be much appreciated as well!

mleemor60
2012.10.11, 05:28 PM
Dnano comes to mind. They use the pager motor are radio controlled via 2.4ghz and with the right low voltage power supply could run virtually indefinitely.

Kyosho manufacturers a 1/43 scale radio controlled vehicle from which you should be able to get everything you need. Power is provided by a 3.7V lipo battery.

Penser
2012.10.11, 06:05 PM
I'm checking it out now and it looks pretty good, thanks for the idea!

imxlr8ed
2012.10.12, 01:09 AM
Dub post... damn touch screens!

imxlr8ed
2012.10.12, 01:15 AM
8 hours on a coreless pager motor would be a bit much IMO. You would have to keep it pretty cool and even then I would think it would still wear out. Now I'm talking about the smaller D-nano sized here as well. In my experiences with them in small scale helicopters, after running two lipos through my MSR and my MCXs, they would always start to slow a bit and the yaws would have to be adjusted. I had to replace the tail rotor in my MSR twice because I just flew it too much, back to back. And that is just using a smooth balanced prop. (the curmudgeon could be correct here, I've never owned a DNano)

Not sure, it might work, but I think you should be looking into something with more of a commercial application as opposed to an RC application... RC cars are mostly designed around 15 minutes of performance tops (excluding the Z here), I think the newer speed controllers are great but I'd be real scared to load one for such a length of time with no cooling system.

Longevity is the key here and when it comes to a shake system, I know it doesn't sound like much, but the stress on the bearing or bushings would really add up.

Now if you drive the shaker via a geared system, then you could sort through all kinds of motors and have room to install tougher bearings on the shaker.

imxlr8ed
2012.10.12, 01:22 AM
Oh, and please tell us that you're not micro refining plutonium and your group is not AlQueada! It would really bum me out if I find out I helped terrorists! :o

Penser
2012.10.13, 06:59 PM
Haha, definitely not. Just a senior design project for school. It's just supposed to be a really small massager designed to massage a specific nerve in the body that gets affected by a certain disease, i'm just trying to figure out what components I can use to make that happen. I know i'm being vague, but we had to sign some weird legal documents that I didn't understand completely, but i'm not supposed to be giving specifics. haha.

Anyway, you guys may have answered it and I missed it, but any ideas on how to remotely start it? I know most cars just have a switch, but i'm guessing that there are some that you can start remotely.

Penser
2012.10.13, 07:04 PM
Keeping in mind that it's designed to massage just one specific nerve, the amount of vibration that is needed I feel is much less than you're probably thinking -- but i'm not sure.

Let me know what you think!

And thanks again for taking the time to help

color01
2012.10.13, 07:51 PM
BioE graduate here, if you're just trying to massage a nerve you probably shouldn't be looking to RC for the motor component. On DealExtreme you can find a bunch of small motors that would be more appropriately sized and priced for microbio-scale work, as well as controller options. While the Mini-Z radio system is really good and somewhat reasonably priced, if you're within the physical range of 2.4GHz I would suggest going Bluetooth using transceiver parts (http://www.instructables.com/id/Cheap-2-Way-Bluetooth-Connection-Between-Arduino-a/) for a more targeted approach.

The exact tutorial you could use to get this done is already online if I'm interpreting your problem correctly: http://www.instructables.com/id/Arduino-controls-cheap-RC-car-transmitter/

It'll be some more work than stuffing a $100 Mini-Z board into your patient, but because it's Arduino-based you will have the necessary control to do more than just drive a motor.

Penser
2012.10.14, 07:56 PM
Thanks! This is all good advice.

The only problem is that bluetooth transceiver is designed to be used on a PC, and i'm hoping to have it on some small controller with an on/off switch so the patient can turn it on or off.

Do you know how I could take it in that direction?

imxlr8ed
2012.10.14, 07:58 PM
Couldn't you do some kind of electrical stimulation? Not sure what the purpose is here once again, but it would seem to me that some micro-pulse electricity would better serve the purpose of keeping a nerve stimulated. If you are trying to get the nerve to heal via tiny injuries caused by micro-motion... that kind of makes sense then.

Sorry, kind of off on tangents here but I do agree that anything bigger than a nickel would pose serious risks for the patient. You don't want micro... you want to go Nano. (and no... not Dnano).

color01
2012.10.14, 08:14 PM
Thanks! This is all good advice.

The only problem is that bluetooth transceiver is designed to be used on a PC, and i'm hoping to have it on some small controller with an on/off switch so the patient can turn it on or off.

Do you know how I could take it in that direction?
Yep, I'm pretty sure the same transceiver can mate to an Arduino, which should be compact enough to carry with your patient. Maybe not "athlete/military" caliber of portability, but at least you can fit the thing in your pocket easily.

Penser
2012.10.14, 08:22 PM
Haha, this device isn't meant to be put inside the patient, it will be on the outside of them since the nerve can be stimulated from the outside with vibration. Micro is definitely what i'm looking for.

The bluetooth suggestion is exactly what I need, I just need to find out if there's a way to just have a controller (like for an RC car) that the patient can carry with them to just press a button and turn on the vibrations

color01
2012.10.15, 11:57 PM
For that I suggest wiring up a potentiometer and on/off switch yourself onto a board, coding it up, heat-shrinking it and giving it to your patient. If it has to look and feel *somewhat* like a product, there are lots of cheapo plastic cases out there in which to store an Arduino, and you can cut holes for the controls that you need to provide.

On the other hand, since it's outside the patient why not go wired? :confused: Makes the proof-of-concept build a lot easier, and you'll find out exactly what you need to carry over in the transition (in the next revision) from wired to Bluetooth wireless.

egonzalez
2012.10.17, 10:03 PM
Haha, this device isn't meant to be put inside the patient, it will be on the outside of them since the nerve can be stimulated from the outside with vibration. Micro is definitely what i'm looking for.

The bluetooth suggestion is exactly what I need, I just need to find out if there's a way to just have a controller (like for an RC car) that the patient can carry with them to just press a button and turn on the vibrations

If your patients are going to be carrying the vibration device and you achieve the Bluetooth or Wi-Fi integration, then i would suggest that you find a way to intergrade with the majority of Bluetooth/Wi-Fi capable phones and use this as your remote. Then through software (apps) the options would be endless. For example, you could have different schedules for different patients that have a set of predefined times to turn on and off the device without the patient interaction.

Draconious
2012.10.17, 11:32 PM
Kick Starter and Indiegogo always have odd devices similar to this looking for funding, for example: http://www.indiegogo.com/drblinky?c=gallery or http://www.indiegogo.com/ZBand -- this one is a remoted controlled silent alarm (using vibrator motor) in a wrist band, controleld via phone app.

I think there are some, remote... eh... adult... toys... out there that would be pretty much what you are describing as well. At least I have seen some that are supose to hook up to a playstation LOL... was in some news article, whole thing was hilarious at the time.

There is also the new MicroChargers toy cars... basically a wheel hooked upto a pager motor which is in turn hooked up to a capacitor, nothing complicated at all, there is no circuit. A seperate hand held charger that charges it up for a few seconds or minutes. Unless you really need it to be remote for some reason, this may be all you need, just have the patient, keep "charging" the device, to turn it on or something...