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View Full Version : how to break the 100 lap barrier?


ukyo
2013.10.06, 07:40 AM
Thought this thread is long delayed.. I haven't been reading much on the forums for a while but our fastest guy

so what is the secret sauce guys? care to share? is a super stack of fets + motor break-in + super batteries + 64p...etc..
i noticed all you guys run MR03's.. our fastest guy is in an AWD, a switched to an MR03 and still can't keep up (mostly cos he is simply a better driver :) )

do you guys like practice in the basement for 3 weeks before you do the actual race? i know we usually just spend an hour or two before we race.

i assume nobody uses gyro right?

i know most of you run 3 cars in the main, and probably do a perfect run without a single bump.. but there has to be something i reckon we are missing... or our skills just aren't up to scratch. :p

arch2b
2013.10.06, 10:30 AM
consistency. :) we have a couple guys who can get 100+ laps and it really just boils down to skill and setup. they take a clean and consistent line for 8 minutes. their setup isn't necessarily about making it the fastest car off the line, but the best handling for their driving style. being the fastest car on the track (straight line speed) does not equal win unless you have the skill to put it down. i know people that are able to get 100+ with a bone stock car.

i've only been able to break the 100 lap barrier i think twice since HFAY began.

briankstan
2013.10.06, 08:59 PM
Good question. We have verying levels of skill in our club. Some of use are fasters than others and even with the same exact setup the differences in lap count could be 20 or more.

It comes down to consistent fast laps, taking a good line and carrying as much speed as you can through the corners. A good setup help as well but I can beat most of our guys with a completely stock car with some good tires.

As for the car, fets and motor. I'm runnung the stock 03 board with stock fets. I run the PN70 turn notor and I don't even break them in. I used to do that but just don't have the time to do that anymore.

Work on the lines and consistency the laps will come.

Send me an email and I'll send you my setup.

danjoyy25
2013.10.07, 12:14 AM
Brian's setup help me alot with getting to close to 100 laps last season. Goods news is Western Zydney will be back as I somehow ended with the rcptracks again so just getting some racers back.

briankstan
2013.10.07, 07:50 AM
Brian's setup help me alot with getting to close to 100 laps last season. Goods news is Western Zydney will be back as I somehow ended with the rcptracks again so just getting some racers back.

that's great, we'll be glad to have you guys back. :cool:

briankstan
2013.10.07, 08:06 AM
Thought this thread is long delayed.. I haven't been reading much on the forums for a while but our fastest guy

so what is the secret sauce guys? care to share? is a super stack of fets + motor break-in + super batteries + 64p...etc..
i noticed all you guys run MR03's.. our fastest guy is in an AWD, a switched to an MR03 and still can't keep up (mostly cos he is simply a better driver :) )

do you guys like practice in the basement for 3 weeks before you do the actual race? i know we usually just spend an hour or two before we race.

i assume nobody uses gyro right?

i know most of you run 3 cars in the main, and probably do a perfect run without a single bump.. but there has to be something i reckon we are missing... or our skills just aren't up to scratch. :p

I get pretty much no practice anymore my schedule doesn't really give me the time I'd like to run my cars, we run all our races both clockwise and counter on the same night and typically back to back. I only get to run my Z's 2 nights a month on our HFAY night and our club race night.

we try to keep the races to the minimum 3 cars but occasionally we will run 4 but never more than 4, the tracks are too small for that.

Gyro's are not allowed...

I've had much faster runs on the tracks by 2 or 3 laps but they were after or before our official race. I wouldn't say I have had one HFAY Race this season that has been error free, I've left 1 lap or more on the table with mistakes I've made in the races with either bad lines, hitting corners or other cars. :eek: Yes we all still do that occasionally. My best clockwise run on the track we just finished was 114 laps and was run in one of our practice races. we typically run 1 or 2 races before our officially timed race to get familiar with the track. We are usually pushing to get through every race so we don't typically do that when we change direction we just run a few warmup laps and let her rip...

I sent you an email with my setup and how I do my setup prep. Apparently I had you email already.

ukyo
2013.10.07, 08:12 AM
thanks for the tips guys!

definitely agree its not always the fastest car on the day and consistency means alot...

doing the math...
100 laps is a 4.8 sec average lap time
110 laps is a 4.3636 sec average lap time!

looking back through our race stats, our fastest guy's fastest lap can be under 4secs, so it is humanly possible and he does get say half a dozen or so around or under 4.3secs.. but to hit that kind of consistency will mean lots more hard work :)

i guess the aim is to hit 4.3 consisently to be a front runner.. so you guys must be constantly getting 4.1 and 4.2 to get a 4.36 average! hats off to you guys!

i just race miniZ.. so i have heaps to improve on my lines and consistency... and alot to learn about tuning cos can't read the cars handling and issues like alot of the other racers can.

arch2b
2013.10.07, 08:19 AM
Your routine sounds a lot
Like mine, race twice a month and HFAY is done in one day. Practice before clockwise and just jump right in to counterclockwise. We get about two hours of practice clockwise though before starting qualifying.

We've begun using the alternating club dates to run next months HFAY track. Both as incentivize making club dates to improve HFAY numbers and get newbies comfortable with HFAY tracks and get time trials done.

briankstan
2013.10.07, 08:33 AM
for comparison my best lap on that track was 3.80, and I also had 5 laps that were over 6 seconds due to my mistakes. see attached for this race.

briankstan
2013.10.07, 08:36 AM
Ray, we also use our club race to run the next months HFAY track. Great minds think alike. :)

briankstan
2013.10.07, 09:13 AM
I did some looking and here is a video I have of one of our races from August's HFAY track.

Salt Lake Mini-Z Race Video from 8-17-2013 (http://www.saltlakemini-z.com/Brian/Videos/SLMZ_Race_8-17-13.mp4)

imxlr8ed
2013.10.07, 10:37 AM
Looking at this thread makes me want to get our club back onto an HFAY schedule. We are all getting more refined lately with the current layout in the basement and everyone is driving much harder than earlier in the year.

Setup is everything... until a driver takes a bone stock MR02 out of a box, puts different tires on it (no bearings, no oil... nothing but tires), and then proceeds to run 100+ lap races around you in your Mains. :confused:

Had it happen here many moons ago, wouldn't believe it if I didn't see it myself.

arch2b
2013.10.07, 12:49 PM
was that mr. wong with the beetle? i recall being humbled if not humiliated by getting thoroughly trounced by mr. wong with a stock beetle. :eek:it was absolutely amazing to witness such a display of skill. that was back in the days when you guys raced at the park building.

imxlr8ed
2013.10.07, 08:39 PM
Not Willy... It was Gasman with an out of the box Enzo.

Tried for years to get the NYC crews involved but they had their own ideas. They never seemed to agree with the short track racing. When you get facilities like they had, it just made sense to use all the space you could.

I do miss the short tracks only because I think it made us concentrate on our lines more and also made us more courteous though traffic. I'll have to chat with the guys about this again.

ukyo
2013.10.09, 07:28 AM
well.. you can dare the NYC crew and say they "don't know how fast they are" until they do a HFAY :p

our fastest guy has probably clocked 100 laps once or twice in the time we have done HFAY.. and like you say.. it boils down to consistency = skill :)

imxlr8ed
2013.10.09, 09:58 AM
Repetition works too... practice, practice, practice... and when you're finally think you're getting around smoothly enough, practice some more!

That's where my club lost it's edge, we really pushed ourselves to get as many laps as possible on the layouts in the mornings before the afternoon mains. It's all based on muscle memory and a consistent setup... you learn to react proportionately to the speeds, turns and setup itself. The more laps you do, the less you'll have to think about how hard to drive the car. Now if your setup changes for some mechanical reason, right before the Mains... that all goes out the window! :eek:

The layouts are short enough to put you into an almost meditative state with the car. Some guys achieve this naturally in RC, with any car, on any track... I am not one of those guys! But when you run 3 hours straight on a tiny layout, you begin to get a sense for it.

briankstan
2013.10.09, 10:36 AM
by contrast my best races are usually the first ones of the night, as the night goes on I have a hard time to maintain the focus for the full 8 minutes. I'm sure this has something to do with the fact that I get up early (4:45am) and we race until midnight of the same day and my body and mind are just tired.

We never run hours before our races, we put in 1 races and then go for it... Once we are done we finish off the night running whatever classes the group wants to run... until we are all tired and ready to call it a night.

I've often discussed this with our club that when you push too hard you are in fact hurting your times but making more mistakes. I can't tell you how ofter I hear everyone say "I stopped trying so hard, and then started getting my best laps." So relax a bit and just do you best.

imxlr8ed
2013.10.09, 04:34 PM
Think less... exactly!

Mini-Zs run smoother on Delta waves!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delta_wave

We didn't always get to practice as much as we liked, but for the newbies it always helped them out to get as much track time as possible.

RussF
2013.10.09, 06:08 PM
Dont listen to Brian.... He Cheats!! :p

Just kidding. He's awesome with any RC car I've ever seen him race. His secret is...... wait for it..........wait for it..........

"Never drive the car faster than you can without hitting stuff."

I usually race with Brian and another fast guy at our track and for the most part I'm the biggest obstacle to them getting more laps than they already do.

Can you say "moving hazard" LOL!!

Brians car is awesome and I have the exact same setup but for some reason just cant seem to get the same laps. Maybe because I make at least 5-10 or more mistakes each race and he doesnt. I'm working on it though.

arch2b
2013.10.09, 06:30 PM
never simply duplicate a setup though. setup's are like shoes, they come in standard sizes but fit everyone differently. Bill's car is astoundingly smooth and fast but it's just not a good fit for my driving style and likewise, mine is not the best for others. it takes a good deal of trial and error to figure out what works with and improves your driving style. that may be alleviated somewhat by trying others cars to see what something does (love to do this myself) before making changes yourself. if you have the type of club or group where that is possible, i highly recommend taking others cars for a test drive. :p

HammondCheese
2013.10.09, 10:27 PM
Just what I need to see. People helping my competition get faster!!!:eek:

Seriously the worst problem we have is not racing enough. A few hours once a month isn't enough to get any of our driving to whatever level each of us is capable of.

My recently developed habit of popping body clips every single freaking race and then providing everyone else a new chicane can't be good for anyone either :).

imxlr8ed
2013.10.09, 10:47 PM
Tape the body to the chassis! It was pretty much mandatory for our races. If you don't like body tape, I know of a little online shop you can order some body clips that have some real tight tolerances! ;)

Another thing I tell my newbies... Drive for the center of the track, once they get that I tell them to try to keep a cars width away from the insides of the corners. Unless you can apex tighter consistently, there is no point in trying to do it all the time.

Mike Keely
2013.10.10, 01:12 PM
To help with the body coming off. Something else to try is to use the putty that you can get to hold up posters. It is sticky and you can pick it up at a craft store. I will try to get some pictures of it so you can see how I use it. Much better then tape because it will not hang up on the track if it gets pulled half way off.

TheRinger
2013.10.10, 09:04 PM
To help with the body coming off. Something else to try is to use the putty that you can get to hold up posters. It is sticky and you can pick it up at a craft store. I will try to get some pictures of it so you can see how I use it. Much better then tape because it will not hang up on the track if it gets pulled half way off.

Thanks for posting that Mike. I completely forgot about that. :o

HammondCheese
2013.10.14, 07:04 AM
To help with the body coming off. Something else to try is to use the putty that you can get to hold up posters. It is sticky and you can pick it up at a craft store. I will try to get some pictures of it so you can see how I use it. Much better then tape because it will not hang up on the track if it gets pulled half way off.

Any luck with the pics Mike? :)

briankstan
2013.10.14, 09:23 AM
Any luck with the pics Mike? :)

I'm pretty sure Mike is talking about this kind of putty.

http://www.amazon.com/Duck-Removable-Mounting-Poster-1436912/dp/B000BQMFEC/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1381760533&sr=8-1&keywords=poster+putty

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41Ifo7eeHHL._SY450_.jpg

Mike Keely
2013.10.15, 06:06 PM
That is the stuff Brian. Sorry to take so long guys. Been helping out a buddy with his stock car. Here is a pic. of one of my bodies. You roll up a small piece half the size of a pea. It will squash out after a few uses but it will last up to two race days if it does not get to dirty. You will feel when it stops holding on to the body. It lasts a long time and very cheap so it could easily be changed each race day.

lfisminiz
2013.10.15, 06:41 PM
Arch told me about a brand called BLUE TAK. I can say it really works well. Got it from Amazon.:)

Mike Keely
2013.10.15, 06:46 PM
The stuff that I am using now is blue also. Not sure if it matters or not. Not sure who made it.

arch2b
2013.10.15, 08:17 PM
i haven't taped a body in ages. :p mike hooked me up one day and never went back.

HammondCheese
2013.10.16, 10:19 PM
That is the stuff Brian. Sorry to take so long guys. Been helping out a buddy with his stock car. Here is a pic. of one of my bodies. You roll up a small piece half the size of a pea. It will squash out after a few uses but it will last up to two race days if it does not get to dirty. You will feel when it stops holding on to the body. It lasts a long time and very cheap so it could easily be changed each race day.

Ahhh you're putting it THERE. I guess that makes sense. Will give it a shot next race day (sadly weeks away :(). I've got tons of Blue Tak (sp?) at home. The other half uses it for a bunch of things. I find it useful to hold stuff when spraying a new shell.

Thanks heaps for taking the time to post the pic!