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View Full Version : July 12, 2014 - HFAY S18 Race 1-2


arch2b
2013.12.15, 10:26 AM
This will be held at Hobby Works in Fairfax, Virginia

we will be running HFAY # .

https://www.howfastareyou.com/hfayprod/static/uploads/tracks.printablepicture.b9234bde04570f3c.484641592 d747261636b2d325f7072696e74696e672e6a7067.jpg

arch2b
2014.07.03, 01:05 PM
couple weeks away but wanted to refresh over the holiday weekend to prepare.

i already put in my pre-order for the new Toyota LM autoscale. not sure i'll make the jump back to LM for stock yet, will have to wait and see how i like the new autoscale.

i had already preordered michael the new red lamborghini before he received notice of his 2nd suspension due to conduct unbecoming :rolleyes: at least he wasn't biting competitors :p

arch2b
2014.07.13, 10:28 AM
thank you to everyone that could make it out this saturday! it was a good crowd and lots of fun racing.

it was a pleasure having K and Austin out for HFAY. Bill and Ian were very much missed. Hope you guys are doing well.

Clockwise was some very challenging racing with most positions only separated by a few laps. Counter clockwise was a bit more challenging and everyone's counts dropped a bit.

I can't post the results before HFAY has released them but we all did well.

we are also looking to work brushless system into our program in a fashion that suits the club best. we want to incorporate the forward march of mini-z development however do so in a manner that doesn't foster the typical arms race that comes with 'new' and 'faster'. speed isn't the key to having fun and racing good. good driving will take you farther than a motor and parts. :cool:

byebye
2014.07.13, 02:54 PM
Yeah another great day of racing. I was happy to see K and Austin on a HFAY day.

There was some tight racing in clockwise with B-main trading 1st place over a number of laps.

I was really impressed with how fast everyone was. Lots of competition.

I would like for us as a club to discuss further a VE Class. Right now mine is stripped down waiting for the next move. I was very impressed with the torque. After disassembly I found that my motor is the team Orion x-speed.

arch2b
2014.07.13, 04:02 PM
crap, blue shell and labeled an x-speed? hate it when there is a lack of consistency in a brand. so, goes back to needing to do the same testing with the eco brushless motor. i'll see if i can find one before July stock day.

b main, counterclockwise was crazy with andy and myself trading places back and forth throughout the race. i hit a corner seconds before the end of the race with andy staking 1st, well earned.

not sure what the interference issues andy had but hope they can be resolved.

arch2b
2014.07.13, 05:12 PM
this is supposed to be the 5600KV ECO tuned brushless motor.

AndyD
2014.07.13, 05:49 PM
Thanks again to Ray for running this series. Racing was a lot of fun, as usual. I believe that my intermittent loss of control was actually being caused by a stripped servo gear (...pretty sure I always had throttle, just the steering would randomly stop working...). I still need to open things up to confirm, but the front wheels now freely deflect left and right if I move them manually, as though they are no longer connected to anything. I think I recall hearing from Dwight that the stock servo gears are essentially guaranteed to break after some amount of use...sound right? Maybe I should stop running into things...

Otherwise, I am very interested in a brushless class. Kris' VE car looked solid. Given my preference for running things "out-of-the-box," hopefully a good HFAY rules equivalency can be found. And, maybe I can get my own nickname. Since "Mr. Excitement" is apparently taken, maybe "Mr. OEM" is available? Just a thought. Hope to make it out for the next one.

-Andy




crap, blue shell and labeled an x-speed? hate it when there is a lack of consistency in a brand. so, goes back to needing to do the same testing with the eco brushless motor. i'll see if i can find one before July stock day.

b main, counterclockwise was crazy with andy and myself trading places back and forth throughout the race. i hit a corner seconds before the end of the race with andy staking 1st, well earned.

not sure what the interference issues andy had but hope they can be resolved.

KWT
2014.07.14, 07:09 PM
The motor's official name is the Orion X-speed VE ECO. So nothing wrong there.


Yeah another great day of racing. I was happy to see K and Austin on a HFAY day.

There was some tight racing in clockwise with B-main trading 1st place over a number of laps.

I was really impressed with how fast everyone was. Lots of competition.

I would like for us as a club to discuss further a VE Class. Right now mine is stripped down waiting for the next move. I was very impressed with the torque. After disassembly I found that my motor is the team Orion x-speed.

KWT
2014.07.14, 07:10 PM
Most likely it's the 4th servo gear if it's stripped. Just replace with a metal one.

Thanks again to Ray for running this series. Racing was a lot of fun, as usual. I believe that my intermittent loss of control was actually being caused by a stripped servo gear (...pretty sure I always had throttle, just the steering would randomly stop working...). I still need to open things up to confirm, but the front wheels now freely deflect left and right if I move them manually, as though they are no longer connected to anything. I think I recall hearing from Dwight that the stock servo gears are essentially guaranteed to break after some amount of use...sound right? Maybe I should stop running into things...

Otherwise, I am very interested in a brushless class. Kris' VE car looked solid. Given my preference for running things "out-of-the-box," hopefully a good HFAY rules equivalency can be found. And, maybe I can get my own nickname. Since "Mr. Excitement" is apparently taken, maybe "Mr. OEM" is available? Just a thought. Hope to make it out for the next one.

-Andy

KWT
2014.07.14, 07:16 PM
We had lots of fun. Enjoyed meeting new people and getting tips from them.

I will be bringing my Brushless converted to the ECO motor with me. I think we should do a trial race and see how the times compare. I will set the motor to the lowest RPM and Torque settings.

byebye
2014.07.14, 09:05 PM
The motor's official name is the Orion X-speed VE ECO. So nothing wrong there.

https://www.kyosho.com/eng/products/rc/detail.html?product_id=109865

Unfortunately their description and the product are different.

From the beginning of the description at the top of the page
The body/chassis set comes with an optional Xspeed VE ECO Tune Brushless Motor as standard, Notice it doesn't say "by Team Orion" but does say "ECO Tune"

scroll down <KIT CONTENTS>
Factory assembled MR-03W chassis installed with Team ORION XSPEED VE brushless motor. Notice it does say "Team ORION" but it doesn't say "ECO Tune". My motor is as described here.

MZW501 is in fact the XSPEED ECO Tune(Blue Can)
MZ504 is just an XSPEED(Red can)

It doesn't say anything about "ECO Tune" on the motor itself but everything I'm finding online accept the 5600kv rating looks like my motor is this "ECO Tune".

I'm going to speculate that all the motors are XSPEED but either Red XSPEED or Blue XSPEED ECO Tune.

I believe the kind of speed produced by these motor is the same as running a 50turn or less motor and a FET upgrade. That kind of speed doesn't always equate to faster lap times but in the right hands your average could be much lower and I could see finishing with 100+ laps every race. Basically your time to recover from an error is much lower.

byebye
2014.07.14, 09:07 PM
Thanks again to Ray for running this series. Racing was a lot of fun, as usual. I believe that my intermittent loss of control was actually being caused by a stripped servo gear (...pretty sure I always had throttle, just the steering would randomly stop working...). I still need to open things up to confirm, but the front wheels now freely deflect left and right if I move them manually, as though they are no longer connected to anything. I think I recall hearing from Dwight that the stock servo gears are essentially guaranteed to break after some amount of use...sound right? Maybe I should stop running into things...

Otherwise, I am very interested in a brushless class. Kris' VE car looked solid. Given my preference for running things "out-of-the-box," hopefully a good HFAY rules equivalency can be found. And, maybe I can get my own nickname. Since "Mr. Excitement" is apparently taken, maybe "Mr. OEM" is available? Just a thought. Hope to make it out for the next one.

-Andy
How about Mr. OEM...the natural or as I usually like to say "Andy Fast".

byebye
2014.07.14, 09:08 PM
this is supposed to be the 5600KV ECO tuned brushless motor.

It's hard to see but it does say ORION above the Kyosho which is just like mine.

arch2b
2014.07.14, 09:13 PM
i happen to have the red motor that came with my chassis set, i'll bring that next time.

KWT
2014.07.15, 08:00 PM
All the Kyosho Brushless motors are made by Orion. The blue motor is the Eco Tuned one. I have both.

TheRinger
2014.07.16, 06:59 AM
Does anyone know the kv of the x speed motor? If 5600kv is what the Eco tune motor is, I think that will be too fast. Kyosho does push the Eco motor as being slower but I guess we'll all fined out. I feel that around 2200kv to 3300kv would be more "stock" then anything 5000kv and higher. From what little research I've done so far kyosho is not giving really much of any info on these motors other then worded description.
I'm not fond of this new direction. It feels like to me that kyosho feels that brushless mini z's are too big to fail like dnanos and other failed ideas that never really took off. Look at hobbyworks inventory, tons of brushless chassis but no regular mr03 chassis can be found. Tons of brushless stuff but not much of anything else. Plus it's a bit hard to swallow paying $65+ for a Eco tune x speed motor that you either got to drill the can to use with aftermarket pods or use what overpriced crap kyosho is peddling. I'm just not wanting to drop a small fortune into one chassis to "keep up" with another fad. Hopefully atomic or PN will come out with a "stock class" motor soon.
Sorry if I haven't been around. I'm recovering from a pinch nerve that I have in my neck. Plus my schedule with the better half has once again conflicting with the racing schedule. Up until now her weekends off were on the 1st and 3rd weekends of the month, now there back on the 2nd and 4th weekends. So that's going to lead back to racing once a month possibly again. Plus my father with his bad health I have to help him more with stuff he needs done. So life is a bit hectic lately. I can't speak on Ian's behalf but from talking to him things in his life got real busy. I know he probably won't be around for a couple of races. I know he's heading to the UK shortly. Hopefully I'll be at either the boxstock race or HFAY. Later.

arch2b
2014.07.16, 12:07 PM
i started a directory (http://mini-zracer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=39345) on brushless motor specs. 8500kv are far to fast for HFAY. i don't see the point in anything over 8-9000kv unless you have enormous tracks. so far the 5-5600kv seem to be the closest match for 70T, but still at the high end meaning it's like everyone getting the hot 70T motor. sadly there appears to be nothing equivalent to stock class/80T motor. i don't see VE being widely adopted for more than open class until a respectable slow motor is available.

be sure to be active in the HFAY post (http://mini-zracer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=39811) regarding brushless integration. given we only have sports and VE coming out of Kyosho, we need to do something vs. nothing. right now, no hope of integrating VE into stock classes unless you run them separately from brushed.

ultimately, we need to find a way to integrate them into the fold or were doomed to sports series which is not the direction i want to see us go. ASF brushed kits are getting increasingly harder to find domestically. i would prefer to keep ASF alive with the extensive line of compatible platforms and available transmitters. the push at the moment is finding a pathway for inclusion or new class for VE within HFAY, for us anyway. hobby works is selling them so need to create a venue to utilize them. options include add into HFAY, create a separate HFAY class and/or create new VE stock class limited to ECO tune motor as it fits within stock motor pods.