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KWT
2014.06.29, 10:37 PM
Anyone noticed that their MA-20 steer doesn't center well? Mine would drift right after a right turn and left after a left turn.

herman
2014.06.30, 12:20 AM
dunno if it was just me... but now i guess the problem is a bit inherent... there are some articles about it on the forums... here's one... click to read thread awd steering not centering (http://mini-zracer.com/forums/showthread.php?t=25931&highlight=awd+straight)

KWT
2014.06.30, 10:14 PM
I just found that thread earlier. I guess I will start checking everything out.

Thanks Herman

herman
2014.07.01, 02:33 AM
your welcome... as for me i've almost given up on the awd... would have loved to drive the awd around... but because of the steering issues... i've just put on drift tires and made it a drifter... where you really don't need to drive it straight... hahaha...

i'm wondering if you swapping out the front stock kyosho gear diff to a third party one way or ball diff would do the trick? ..... anybody?

KWT
2014.07.01, 10:49 PM
It's really a steering issue. I can see the front wheels not returning to the same spot when turned in different directions. I guess I'll take the steering gears apart and look around for rough spots

herman
2014.07.01, 10:59 PM
let us know if you have resolved the issue... every bit helps...
sometimes it works... good luck

KWT
2014.07.04, 04:23 PM
I took apart the car and it's just too much play on the servo gears. Looks like the gears can tilt on the shafts. I figure if I can find some shims that will fit the gear shafts I can tighten it up and reduce the slop.

TheSteve
2014.07.04, 06:09 PM
I think it varies car to car, depending on the fit of all of the parts. I don't think the chinese made parts are molded to the same precision that they were when made in Japan. I know there is also a little more steering slop in my MA015 converted to MA020 car, there is just more play in the steering components. I can get my car to drive straight no problem but I admit it is tough to be as precise in the turns with it compared to an MR03.

KWT
2014.07.05, 02:33 AM
The way I have to drive it now is to trim it to drive straight when returning from one direction and make sure I add little opposite turn when releasing the steering from the other side so it will track straight again.

TheSteve
2014.07.05, 02:37 AM
Yikes, that is terrible and no way to have to drive a car. I have struggled in the past with the tiles joints and bumps in RCP pulling my AWD car across the track making it a real struggle to drive. The fix for everyone locally was to go to geared front diff instead of a ball diff. Your problem is much more serious though like something is binding in the servo gearbox. Hopefully you can find the tight spot in the steering and remove it, it really should return to neutral and track as straight as an mr03.(I don't like any car that wanders, it should be able to go the entire length of the straight without touching the steering)

KWT
2014.07.05, 10:53 PM
There is no binding anywhere on the steering. There is just too much slop to return to center. It seems like the holes in the gears are too large for the pins. They all tilt. I can try to take a video but I don't have a way to host it for you to see.

mleemor60
2014.07.06, 07:32 AM
Have you looked into the board programming(if 2.4ASF)? It may be that the settings for the steering are set to the weaker end of the adjustment settings.

lfisminiz
2014.07.06, 09:01 AM
Have you looked into the board programming(if 2.4ASF)? It may be that the settings for the steering are set to the weaker end of the adjustment settings.

Agreed. ...The awd steering settings are set higher/stronger than the 2wd settings.

KWT
2014.07.06, 11:04 PM
Yes I did the ICS programming. It's definitely slop in the steering servo gears. There's no binding, everything is just too loose.

mleemor60
2014.07.07, 05:46 AM
Is steering set to smooth or over? if smooth, set to over and try again. Just for sh1ts and giggles.

KWT
2014.07.07, 08:13 AM
I tried every setting, even had the steering vibrating like crazy with no change in its inability to center itself. I played with gain, punch and speed in addition to the smooth and over setting.

mleemor60
2014.07.07, 09:53 AM
Oh well. If that is the case just pick up a new set of gears and rebuild the servo.

KWT
2014.07.08, 10:56 PM
That's the current plan.

Thanks for your help

herman
2014.07.08, 11:54 PM
I tried every setting, even had the steering vibrating like crazy with no change in its inability to center itself. I played with gain, punch and speed in addition to the smooth and over setting.

ugh.... sad to hear... maybe before buying stuff, you could check the chassis, the parts holding the servo gears and chassis cover... check if it rubs against any of the moving parts, or if there is any binding (servo gears, servo saver... etc)... other things that you might want to check... servo motor, potentiometer...

good luck...

herman
2014.08.01, 05:19 AM
any update?

KWT
2014.08.02, 10:08 AM
Steering was much better with the servo gear and servo saver swapped out for the Atomic one. I also shimmed the front servo plate to reduce some of the play. It still doesn't completely center but it is much better. I would like to experiment with the front toe but I'm not sure which set to buy that works for the MA-020.

herman
2014.08.03, 09:16 AM
nice to hear :D

Old Crow
2014.11.29, 08:30 PM
Had a chance to run my MA-020 this week, same issue, or same type of issue. Does not truly center due to a lot of side to side play. Don't recall that being the issue with the past models. This has something to do with the parts, not the strength of the servo motor. It is toe'd out some right out of the package.

matthen
2015.02.16, 03:20 PM
I did some upgrades and my MA-020 now centers perfectly. The upgrades were:

PN Racing front tie rod
3-Racing servo saver
PN Racing delrin servo gears

The only trouble I had with installation was that the 3-Racing servo saver didn't work with the PN racing servo gears... the fit was just too tight. Interestingly enough, both worked fine with the stock parts. Rather than moding the PN racing gear that attaches to the servo saver, I just replaces the single gear that had slop on my car... This was the one in contact with the servo motor.

In my case, I think most of my problem was in the servo saver. The 3-Racing one is not only aluminum, but it has a different design than stock. The PN racing tie rod seemed to help as well. It travels easier and more consistently than the stock plastic one. I don't think the servo gear change did much... This is because of the gearing ratios. Slop on the gear I changed out makes almost no difference in wheel position. I just swapped it out for good measure.

I do wonder about how long these mods will last. There is significantly less play in the whole system. I almost wonder if it's too tight. However, so far it centers like a dream. Anyway, everyone seems to have different experiences with his. Hopefully, my positive experience will help others.

YMMV.

200sxr
2015.07.29, 07:55 PM
Here is my experience, I have a MA020VE chassis set. Out of the box there is terrible binding with the tie rod and chassis. I had to file the tie rod to get rid of the binding. The chassis eventually cracked all over the place (which is another issue I have experienced) the new chassis worked fine with the PN AL tie rod as well as the ones that come with the optional Kyosho tie rod set.

At the same time I installed a set of Atomic servo gears and AL server saver but they do not seem to reduce much of the play. A large amount of the play comes with where the servo saver pin is located on the chassis.

I am running a Audi R8 body even with the wide setup I am using 1.5 - 2mm offset wheels at the front. One of the challenge I have is the car will track straight under small acceleration or coasting but it would steer to one side under hard acceleration, braking and reversing. No amount of toe out would help the situation. I was able to change the direction it steers by adjusting the rear suspension stopper height at either side and that leads me to think it is torque steer that produce the self steer under hard acceleration.

I put some front wheels with 0 offset at the front and all the torque steer is gone and the car tracks straight under all condition. While it looks terrible but at least it now drives very well.

Here is the setting I run at the front.

1 deg neg camber
0.8mm spacer at stock upper arm for increased caster
PN -1 tie rod
0 off set front wheels.

DMALMAD
2015.07.29, 09:18 PM
Here is my experience, I have a MA020VE chassis set. Out of the box there is terrible binding with the tie rod and chassis. I had to file the tie rod to get rid of the binding. The chassis eventually cracked all over the place (which is another issue I have experienced) the new chassis worked fine with the PN AL tie rod as well as the ones that come with the optional Kyosho tie rod set.

At the same time I installed a set of Atomic servo gears and AL server saver but they do not seem to reduce much of the play. A large amount of the play comes with where the servo saver pin is located on the chassis.

I am running a Audi R8 body even with the wide setup I am using 1.5 - 2mm offset wheels at the front. One of the challenge I have is the car will track straight under small acceleration or coasting but it would steer to one side under hard acceleration, braking and reversing. No amount of toe out would help the situation. I was able to change the direction it steers by adjusting the rear suspension stopper height at either side and that leads me to think it is torque steer that produce the self steer under hard acceleration.

I put some front wheels with 0 offset at the front and all the torque steer is gone and the car tracks straight under all condition. While it looks terrible but at least it now drives very well.

Here is the setting I run at the front.

1 deg neg camber
0.8mm spacer at stock upper arm for increased caster
PN -1 tie rod
0 off set front wheels.

Toe out will only hurt the cars ability to center. Running more toe in is what increases stability and better centering. If you had to make your rear suspension imbalanced to make the car track straight the issue may be that there is too much weight on the battery side of the car. Generally you want your suspension to be equal because it is easier to have to deal with a little steering wondering then a car that does not turn equally left and right. Now that I think about it maybe when you were running the wider off-set wheels they were rubbing? Maybe try putting the wider wheels on and raising the front of the body?

200sxr
2015.08.06, 10:33 PM
Toe out will only hurt the cars ability to center. Running more toe in is what increases stability and better centering. If you had to make your rear suspension imbalanced to make the car track straight the issue may be that there is too much weight on the battery side of the car. Generally you want your suspension to be equal because it is easier to have to deal with a little steering wondering then a car that does not turn equally left and right. Now that I think about it maybe when you were running the wider off-set wheels they were rubbing? Maybe try putting the wider wheels on and raising the front of the body?

You are possibly correct about the toe, with my 1:1 scale car experience I would never run toe-in but I guess these are not the same. Been trialing more toe-in and I cannot say if the torque steering is better or not.

There is definitely no rubbing but there is so much play in the steering, with drive to the front wheels it is definitely difficult to get it right.