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View Full Version : Motor parity brushed vs brushless?


cowboysir
2017.07.13, 04:33 PM
I'm looking for a consensus on a comparative brushed motor to the Blue 'VE brushless motor from kyosho.

mleemor60
2017.07.13, 05:01 PM
Just off the cuff I would say the PN 70T with CS brushes. The VE has more overall speed but lacks braking control while the 70T gives up a bit of top end but has much more overall control. Check with arch2b as he has been involved with a great deal of comparative testing.

TeeSquared
2017.07.13, 05:37 PM
The PN world cup pairs the 70T class with 3500 kV brushless motors while the 50T "Pro-stock" class allows 5500 kV brushless motors. Rules are here: http://pnracing.us/pnwc2016/pnwc-2016-rules.htm

I find the blue Kyosho motor to be a bit slower than the brushed X-Speed (which is actually a 49 turn motor) but it's more consistent. The brushed car gets slower after an 8-10 minute race while the blue brushless runs very consistent for most of the battery. With an 8-9 tooth pinion which really doesn't heat up the blue motor that much, it's way faster than a Kyosho stock motor, which is apparently 80 turns.

Summary:

PN 70T - Never run one, can't say.
Kyosho Stock - Slower than the blue VE
Kyosho brushed Xspeed - Slightly faster than the blue VE on the top end, but runs hotter and drains batteries faster
Kyosho Blue VE - more torque, less top end than the brushed Xspeed. Much more efficient. Much longer run time

arch2b
2017.07.14, 08:01 AM
There is no brushless equivalent to a Kyosho stock motor. From 3500Kv an up, all are faster than the stock brushed motor right out of the box/package. This is a general statement made on extensive testing. we all know there is variation in motor manufacturing in which some are faster/slower. So, yes, it is possible to have a brushed stock motor run as fast as a 3500Kv however after much testing, this is not proven to be a realistic equivalent as there is too much variation in stock brushed motors. some are dogs, some are just OK, some are as fast as 70t.

i agree with the 5-5500Kv motors equivalent with PN 50t. on our tracks, both need to be dialed down to really use effectively on a 2-3 wide L layout vs. taking full advantage of 3500Kv or Kyosho blue nearly all the time.

to the original question, a PN 70t is the closest match to the Kyosho blue/3500Kv. to get even closer on parity you would need to specify gear ratio and address batteries used. changes to either make a big difference. it's been challenging to say the least to run a mix of brushless and brushed motors in same class. HFAY has been doing this for some time now and you do not see many brushless being used, HFAY is geared toward smaller tracks however.

cowboysir
2017.07.14, 09:37 AM
Some good info gents....

Does anyone have a ratio that creates the best parity between brushed setup vs the kyosho eco-blue? I've found the best balance on the ve running on 44-8 (48pitch) which is a 5.50 ratio.... that would be a bit low on a 70T but might be a closer comparison with a 50T.

Thoughts?

tommy_greeneyes
2017.08.03, 08:15 PM
the past two years i have played with the PN 3500k pretty fast for stock, this year i built two cars the same,one with 70 turn and one 3500k with the same gearing. i find the brushless was more consistent and torture and the 70 turn was smooth with highend speed. but you know in stock classes its alway about your batteries. my lap times was the same for both cars