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View Full Version : MA03 F front wheel drive....


herman
2017.08.31, 07:24 PM
Haven't seen any pictures yet, just read something about a front wheel drive coming out (supposedly with the MA03 F designation)... anybody know anything else about this?

herman
2017.09.02, 10:25 AM
Found an article - here's a rough google translation

"Yes, it is a front drive. There is no doubt (sweat)

According to Rukkon heaven Tokuyama's blog, it is expected to be released in Demio and Prius Body.

Although Kyosho has devised various measures so that beginners can easily enter, MINI-Z tends to escalate as a game by all means. I hope that it will be accepted into a wider group by introducing FWD new chassis."

bobbyz
2017.09.03, 12:31 AM
https://********/scripts/hljlist?Maker1=ksh&cl=1

Here's a link to HobbyLink Japan with some future Kyosho releases with the MR-03F designation. Odd that some say RWD. I'm sure some pics and description of this possible new chassis will help clarify.

xmodcanuck
2017.09.03, 03:44 AM
And that website (screenshots attached) better explains this crappy pic I found earlier.

White&aqua fwd prius, white&red fwd demio, red&blue rwd nsx, white&blue wrx sti. And an all new chassis. It's crappy and blurry but it's all there.

TheRinger
2017.09.03, 11:36 AM
Can't tell from the pics, is it just an awd with front wheel drive?

xmodcanuck
2017.09.04, 01:06 AM
Found a clearer version of 1/4 of the blurry bit.

That there is definitely a new chassis. Seems to be a hybrid of mr03 and awd. Looks like awd wheels but mr03 battery placement. Front and rear bulkheads also seem very awd. Appears to do 90,94,98mm wheelbase. Unfortunately it might start out as a sports model, appears to be fhss.

cowboysir
2017.09.04, 09:28 AM
Looks like a better mini z-xmod hybrid than the ones I tried building back in the day. I don't see how they'll be a valid racing platform with it's high c.g.....

arch2b
2017.09.05, 06:50 AM
I wish Kyosho did a better job of marketing/product information distribution. Why are we finding this on retailer websites vs. their own blog or brand website? Has anyone asked Kyosho USA if they know anything about this and could share information? given the ETA release of October, it's surprising kyosho hasn't been discussing this yet. especially with other markets where retailers could be better positioning their inventory to accommodate new products. it doesn't show up on their new release schedule on their main website.

TeeSquared
2017.09.05, 02:25 PM
I don't see how they'll be a valid racing platform with it's high c.g.....

I think the intention is to create a racing chassis that has low limits:

Although Kyosho has devised various measures so that beginners can easily enter, MINI-Z tends to escalate as a game by all means. I hope that it will be accepted into a wider group by introducing FWD new chassis."

I don’t think the creators of Mini-Z imagined they would be raced the way they are. Top-level racing Mini-Zs are often so modified and so covered in alloy and carbon fiber parts they barely resemble their original platform. Not that I think there is anything wrong with that, and clearly neither does Kyosho, but it’s probably not what Kyosho imagined and not the market they want to cater to even now. They’ve left that up to the aftermarket community.

Kyosho is a Japanese company. The Mini-Z racing crowd is very "Americanized". Lots of money, stupid ridiculously fast cars, extensive mods, anodized aluminum and carbon fiber, big race tracks, foam tyres. Flashy, in other words. That’s all find and dandy and Kyosho is happy to sell chassis to that crowd, but they don’t expressly support them, and they certainly don’t design cars with that kind of competition in mind. The GP limited chassis is probably the biggest exception to date.

Instead, I imagine Kyoshos philosophy towards mini-Z is more subtle. They emphasize scale detail and the quality of the finished product. They refine the design incrementally instead of abandoning it with each successive generation. They could easily have gone 1S lipo and brushless years ago. Losi had them beat in 07 or 08. But the Losi product is inferior in every way. It has no backwards compatibility with any other Micro Losi stuff. It’s not that well thought out. It uses cheap, chintzy and poorly molded plastic. The electronics are terrible. It’s designed to be fast and impressive out of the box, but not refined or sophisticated, and it probably won’t hold your interest even half as long. Mini-Z is aimed at a different market.

Anyways. My opinion. Not facts. Just an observation on why the community seems to feel "let down" with some of Kyoshos recent releases. I know many are pining for hard-core factory racers. I'm definitely keen to try a FWD mini-Z

I wish Kyosho did a better job of marketing/product information distribution. Why are we finding this on retailer websites vs. their own blog or brand website? Has anyone asked Kyosho USA if they know anything about this and could share information? given the ETA release of October, it's surprising kyosho hasn't been discussing this yet. especially with other markets where retailers could be better positioning their inventory to accommodate new products. it doesn't show up on their new release schedule on their main website.

I remember reading ages ago that Mini-Zs are a passion project for Kyosho. They release stuff when they feel like it and as they see fit. They know they don't have to bother marketing stuff because, well, look at us all chomping at the bit for more info on new products. They don't need to advertise to us :p I doubt very much that Mini-Z continues to be a profit center for Kyosho, and probably the biggest reason they keep developing products is because they want to, not because they have to. I can’t imagine they’d want to invest too much time and energy into a product that has already seen it’s rise and fall in popularity. The sport series seemed like an attempt to broaden the products appeal, as does this FWD chassis, but I think Kyosho relies heavily on word-of-mouth and the small but passionate remaining Mini-Z community to promote it on its behalf. I was recruited into the Mini-Z community by someone who was already in it, for example.

But generally I agree. Kyosho can be a pain in the butt to deal with and often appears indifferent to their fans wishes.

It looks very much like an AWD platform with a unique chassis. The motor is just above and behind the front axle. There is probably a spur/crown gear in place of the driveshafts bearing carrier. The servo set-up is mysterious. Curious where it fits since on the current AWD, the servo sits where the batteries appear to sit on the FWD chassis. Rear end looks like the original MA010. It will probably have low limits and traction roll effortlessly. I'm imagining 40 degree rubber tires, enjoy battle motors and lots and lots of understeer :)

It’s an interesting prospect though!

EMU
2017.09.05, 10:14 PM
For Kyosho, their vision is to "play" with the mini-z. Few upgrades to make it more tunable/driveable, but not really to make it a competitive race car like HK/EU/USA like. We're all about winning the race, through as many miniscule details in setup to gain micro seconds on the track.

Kyosho aims for the mini-z to be relatively competitive with other almost box stock models in the same category so they can be raced for fun and have close battles. The idea is for scale realism, and they have done that very well. This chassis adds to that realism, much like how Tamiya does the same in 1/10, and has fwd chassis for their Tamiya cup which has less option parts permitted than other series of races. Kyosho was similar with the mini-z cup, but discontinued that.

I like the idea of the chassis, but feel that it could have been designed better. It won't be competitive with other chassis, but would make a nice box stock like class for fun racing.

arch2b
2017.09.06, 07:44 AM
well, for me anyway, the scale appearance and realism is what drew me to Mini-Z v.s competitive racing so this is a refreshing turn. Don't get me wrong, i like competitive racing as well but ultimately, this is a hobby in which i strive to have fun and enjoy so i don't get all twisted up in what it takes to always 'win'. If i can win the race so to speak while enjoying myself and what i like so much about the product at the same time, thats a real win for me. :p i realize i'm certainly in the minority on this here in the US.

not sure this is enough to drag me into an AWD like platform though. i spent enough time with AWD to know it takes more time than i have available to get right and keep it right. i like small hot hatch cars but the ASC offerings don't really appeal to me either. could make 90mm classes a lot of fun though.

EMU
2017.09.06, 09:55 AM
I can relate about the scale realism being the draw to the scale/hobby. It was the initial draw for me. I love the realism and variety that you have with mini-z... then high levels of competition tend to remove variety because only a few bodies/wheelbase/chassis are truly competitive.

I tend to prefer the niche classes for racing, because the variety starts to show its face in them. I also like the more restricted classes, where its not all about having the hot hop ups. I loved semi-box stock, with wheels, bearings, and tires being the only upgrades permitted. Really tightens up the racing, and makes it more fun.

I think this chassis would make a great semi box stock class... bearings, tires, and probably differential (durability upgrade) as the only upgrade would lead to some good racing.

TeeSquared
2017.09.06, 11:31 AM
The realism and approachability are what got me hooked too :) I'd made half-hearted attempts to get into 12th scale and 10th scale touring cars but always felt put-off by the cost and the culture, though that could have just been my local racing clubs. I really like that Mini-Z demands driver skill to be competitive, and that you can’t buy your way onto the podium like you can in other classes.

My very first Mini-Z was an old, used AM MR02 with an Open Interface SC430. I set it up RM with only a T-plate, oil shock, xSpeed motor, bearings, knuckles and a tie rod and it was perfectly competitive back in the day for club racing. Plus it looked awesome! I didn’t always win but I regularly beat guys who had spent 10X as much on their cars. I liked that a lot. I never had that luck in 10th or 12th scale!

It would be really cool if this new chassis captures that spirit again. Like EMU said, I've had some of the most fun racing cars that are nearly stock and have low limits, because it really demands good driving!! You can't just plow through the pack with raw horsepower alone.

Felix2010
2017.09.07, 11:01 PM
Good info guys, thank you.:) I've wondered when a totally new-design Mini-Z would be released. Something to look forward to seeing this winter!

arch2b
2017.09.08, 07:03 AM
with an October release date on the various websites, we should be seeing these well before the holiday season.

bobbyz
2017.09.09, 08:01 PM
http://rc.kyosho.com/en/newitem/32422r.html

Looks like the new chassis is up on Kyosho's new product page. Looks like the new MAC are MR03 Sports models.

xmodcanuck
2017.09.09, 09:17 PM
Found much clearer pic of chassis.

Unfortunately it does appear that they're shooting themselves in the foot a bit. MA-03F uses transmitter Syncro KT-531P and the following is from kyosho website.

*Syncro KT-531P transmitter uses FHSS 2.4GHz and is not compatible with existing ASF/MHS/FHS 2.4GHz systems.

So it's an all new and incompatible 2.4GHz system.

Felix2010
2017.09.09, 10:14 PM
Another 2.4 Mini-Z radio system??? WTF?

Petrokl
2017.09.11, 03:21 PM
http://mini-zracer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=35213&stc=1&d=1505161218

http://mini-zracer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=35214&stc=1&d=1505161218

http://mini-zracer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=35215&stc=1&d=1505161218

http://mini-zracer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=35216&stc=1&d=1505161218

http://mini-zracer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=35217&stc=1&d=1505161218

Source: RC.P.Sanda

TeeSquared
2017.09.11, 05:48 PM
Appears to be a two cell chassis... Interesting! I'd been wondering since the 3D renderings appeared to show no room for 4 cells, but I figured 2.4-3 volts would be too little for something like this. Unless this is how they are switching to lithium batteries? Maybe it uses two AAA lion cells in parallel.

I agree that yet another radio protocol for Mini-Z is super lame though :rolleyes: Maybe Kyosho is trying to move away from expensive KO Propo stuff.

mleemor60
2017.09.11, 06:12 PM
Haven't they already gotten in the sack with Flysky? The KT432 and the It-4 are literally identical with the exception of the switchable chassis for lefty's and of course the additional protocol.

xmodcanuck
2017.09.11, 06:39 PM
http://mini-zracer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=35217&stc=1&d=1505161218

Source: RC.P.Sanda

Appears to be a two cell chassis... Interesting! I'd been wondering since the 3D renderings appeared to show no room for 4 cells, but I figured 2.4-3 volts would be too little for something like this. Unless this is how they are switching to lithium batteries? Maybe it uses two AAA lion cells in parallel.


I don't know about 2 cells, website states 4AAA required for chassis.
And that bottom view looks like another battery door.

TeeSquared
2017.09.11, 07:11 PM
Good call. Hadn't looked too carefully at that picture...

Kyosho does not always post accurate information about Mini-Zs so I usually don't trust the posted specs until it's been confirmed by the community.

EMU
2017.09.11, 09:13 PM
The rear suspension looks like its carried over from the AWD platform, so aftermarket rear suspension compatibility looks good. Hard to tell if an a-arm front end will work from these pics...

I would assume at the least that the differential and swing shaft design is the same as AWD.

arch2b
2017.09.12, 06:23 AM
Found much clearer pic of chassis.

Unfortunately it does appear that they're shooting themselves in the foot a bit. MA-03F uses transmitter Syncro KT-531P and the following is from kyosho website.

*Syncro KT-531P transmitter uses FHSS 2.4GHz and is not compatible with existing ASF/MHS/FHS 2.4GHz systems.

So it's an all new and incompatible 2.4GHz system.

it also states that in a manner that applies to the radio specifically. it does not address the PCB in the car, which like MHS, could operate on more than one system. i'd certainly like to know because if it is indeed a stand alone system, i will avoid it like the plague. i already skipped anything sports specifically to not have to deal with FHS vs. ASF. ASF/MHS are at least cross compatible thank goodness. I have no intention what so ever of buying another system that requires it's own transmitter. The PCB now has a white antenna so it's a new board and yet another one to track as we now have black (ASF), blue (FHSS) and red (MHS).

TheRinger
2017.09.12, 09:01 AM
I was excited to hear about this chassis until I read "it has a new radio and system not compatible with any existing systems" so I'm done.

arch2b
2017.09.12, 09:48 AM
It's also noted to have the mr-03 servo motor so it may be a simple board swap provided the sizes are the same.

If this is indeed a full stand alone frequency system, I cannot recommend our LHS carry these as it's already a burden dealing with FHSS, ASF and MHS. They don't want to stock more radios when we already have 4 for the line.

xmodcanuck
2017.10.02, 02:59 PM
The rear suspension looks like its carried over from the AWD platform, so aftermarket rear suspension compatibility looks good. Hard to tell if an a-arm front end will work from these pics...

I would assume at the least that the differential and swing shaft design is the same as AWD.

It's too bad they didn't go with the dws rear suspension. I guess they're going for entry level price point. Maybe dws rear will be a later version.

TeeSquared
2017.10.02, 03:43 PM
Should be a cheap upgrade, since you only need the externals (arms, bearing carrier, bulkhead, ect) and not the diff or driveshafts. The old Atomic 1rst gen SAS might also fit/can be found inexpensively.

Fingers crossed you can swap the MR-03 electronics into it...! :)

arch2b
2017.10.02, 09:59 PM
That's what I'm hoping as well. If no, I'll pass.

gctkaz
2017.11.19, 03:22 PM
A bit late to the discussion, although I had been following for a while.
Personally, not very interested as a while ago I had tried to set up a MA-010 as FWD by removing the rear dog bones, and it was incredibly difficult to keep it driving in a straight line as it would dart towards the wall barriers any time it hit a bump in the track, and eventually I just gave up on it without ever having it tuned to a drivable setting. I was already using a hard gear differential as recommended for taming the same problem in AWD.

I do want to make a note about radios, that *if* it runs on FlySky protocol like the Sports series, that's not too bad of a situation. It's possible to run a FS-TM002 module with KO PROPO radios and I have done it myself with a Sports series PCB and EX-1UR. I don't know if it's any different with a FS-RM002 but I would guess they are mostly the same thing. Unfortunately it doesn't sound like it uses FlySky here though.

Real life has been busy and as a result I have been out of the loop for a while. Still have too much technology to catch up on before this FWD ever becomes a priority, although I do like the new bodies being released with it. I have yet to go VE like the rest of the members in my local club.

SuperFly
2017.11.19, 04:53 PM
I do want to make a note about radios, that *if* it runs on FlySky protocol like the Sports series, that's not too bad of a situation. It's possible to run a FS-TM002 module with KO PROPO radios and I have done it myself with a Sports series PCB and EX-1UR. I don't know if it's any different with a FS-RM002 but I would guess they are mostly the same thing. Unfortunately it doesn't sound like it uses FlySky here though.

I'm curious about this. How did you adapt the module to the EX-1UR? I have an EX-1UR, and I'd love to ditch the KT-19 I have for stock class. It looks like Ko Propo actually made a module for FHSS (RF-903FH), but it's discontinued, of course.

TheRinger
2017.11.22, 05:32 PM
From what Iíve heard the kt 432pt will be compatible via software update.

arch2b
2017.12.04, 07:19 AM
so, anyone get some wheel time with these?

It would be great if there is a parts kit list for upgrading from MA-010/020 to this 03F. i'm sure it will be a popular upgrade route to get to a better weight distribution chassis layout.

herman
2017.12.04, 07:49 AM
Just came across this... From kyosho blog - from Ishikawa 12/03/17 (via google translate) from Here (https://kyosho.amebaownd.com/posts/3326740)

Hello Ishikawa.

Everyone who waits for MINI - Z FWD information, I kept you waiting very much.

Last weekend test drive meeting started at MINI-Z service station !!

I think that some people already experienced a unique front movement,

From Saturday, December 2nd to Sunday 24th (Sunday)

You can experience maneuvering at your nearby Minute Station.

The store holding the test ride can be checked here !

By all means, please take this opportunity to experience the driving of MINI-Z FWD.



By the way, who saw the first image and thought "Why Beetle!?"

I'm sorry that it is not Demio m (. _.) M



Demio is currently producing it at a secret factory,

I could not finish just 30 pieces first.

This time, it will be a test ride of the FWD chassis combining the Beetle.

Please note.



To the numerous bodies that have been lineuped to Minutes in the past,

Originally, front wheel drive chassis is quite suitable.

Vitz and fit, golf, etc.

FWD chassis can adjust the wheelbase,

You can also enjoy it in combination with these bodies.

Since VW Beetle will be sold until this winter,

For those who like it, please consider purchasing along with FWD chassis on this occasion.



Although it is the running characteristic of the FWD chassis, depending on the grip level of the road surface

It can reproduce the same movement as a real car called tack-in peculiar to the front wheel drive car.



If you pull the throttle all at once in a steady state,

It is a technique to slide the rear grip coming off quickly,

For beginners it may be difficult to navigate.

In such a case, change the rear tire to 20 degrees,

Please change the rear tie rod to "C" of MDW003 and increase the toe-in.

(It is information for the store manager of Minutes Station.)

The tuck-in is reduced, and navigation is easy movement like this video.

Finally, we apologize to everyone.

Problem occurred in the production line at the mini secret factory,

MINI-Z FWD Toyota Prius PHV

Honda NSX of MINI-Z RWD

Readyset, Autoscale Collection, and white body shipments related to these two models

I found that it was delayed greatly.

Everyone who is looking forward to release, I am really sorry.

As soon as production is ready, we will announce the release date again.



Regarding MIMI-Z FWD's Demio,

I am doing my best to be delivered to you by Christmas.

We appreciate your understanding and we appreciate your understanding.



Today's responsible person was Ishikawa.

arch2b
2017.12.04, 11:25 AM
Is he saying they are all delayed or just the Prius?

HaCo
2017.12.28, 05:45 AM
They seem to be finally released:
https://ameblo.jp/super-rc/entry-12339626405.html

This new chassis pulled my attention back to this hobby, put a small carpet track on my ceiling. Was running my cars yesterday and had a lot of fun...

Looking forward to the Mazda 3!

herman
2017.12.28, 10:15 AM
Thanks for the info...

Pics from the link
https://stat.ameba.jp/user_images/20171227/15/super-rc/84/0a/j/o3264244814099478840.jpg

https://stat.ameba.jp/user_images/20171227/15/super-rc/f6/84/j/o3264244814099479965.jpg

herman
2017.12.28, 10:29 AM
Wished they came out with better looking rims...

Still kinda mixed about getting a fwd... (another radio to deal with)...
Might get the autoscale at the very least... want to see what a compact looks like on a LL chassis setting...

Looks like Hiro garage already has the body kits up for sale as well...
https://stat.ameba.jp/user_images/20171227/15/super-rc/4c/38/j/o3264244814099480204.jpg

HaCo
2018.01.03, 12:02 PM
Still not more news for the moment.

At the moment RWD drift chassis with front motor are very popular in 1/10 drift racing. I wonder if this chassis can be adapted to RWD, since it is very similar to this drift chassis layout.

Here you can see a similar layout:
http://cdn.******.com/images/mst-532123-4.jpg

r46
2018.01.03, 06:42 PM
Interesting, shame photos so huge

HaCo
2018.01.04, 12:59 PM
And more images on this website with removed motor and servo cover.
https://ameblo.jp/guruguruminiz/entry-12340511220.html

HaCo
2018.01.13, 01:52 AM
Another AWD mod:
https://imgur.com/E2SW30R
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGVPDx8U4C0

I hope I can order one on monday, the online shop let me know it would arrive then :D