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herman
2018.12.06, 03:20 AM
i may have missed it, but can anyone point out a mr03 rwd review? was wondering apart from using the stock kt531 radio and kt432, are there any other radios that are compatible with the mr03 rwd?

also how does the mr03 rwd series compare to the mr03 asf? which is easier for you to drive? does the rwd have better electronics than the asf?

although, i haven't tried the new rwd chassis, i feel that the asf might still be a better choice since the asf can handle a whole lot better range of radios (through the use of a module, or the radio itself being dedicated to asf) compared to the rwd, which can only use kt531 and kt432... however the mr03 asf is getting harder to come by these days.... can anybody confirm that it will be replaced by the rwd version?

race rules question... are high end radios allowed in stock races? how about box stock races? (maybe answering my own question by saying not really "box stock" if you use the high end radio)

thanks for any reply...

arch2b
2018.12.06, 07:06 AM
Yes, ASF tiki tiki is discontinued. Only FWD, RWD, AWD, Pro, and EVO moving forward. ASF and sports will eventually exit the supply chain so if you want one, don’t sleep on it.

Depends on your interpretation of ‘box stock’ ;). I would go back to a kt-18/19 for anything now that I run better radios. I don’t think most venues would exclude based on radio.

EMU
2018.12.06, 12:37 PM
While my experiences with the RWD are somewhat limited to one day's use, I have a good impression from it. The response in the electronics is noticeably faster than ASF, especially compared to one being driven by a Helios.

The real negative of the FHSS system is lack of a lower cost radio with good features. In 2018, even toy grade RC have digital radios with curves and advanced features, which is why it baffles me that kyosho outfitted the FHSS models with an analogue trim radio, and the only replacement is $200+.

As far as I know, the only TX that works with kyosho FHSS is the kt-531p, and the kt-432pt. I would probably swap out some slow or dead ASF boards for the RWD board if I could get an inexpensive transmitter that had digital trim, end point, and curve adjustment. The feeling of the steering just feels so responsive and accurate.

I found it difficult to shell an ASF car with my own radio after a few races with a few RWD cars. The timing difference between the two became very apparent, and has me stuck trying to think if I need to upgrade my transmitter, and swap out boards to update my fleet. I dare say that the response difference between ASF and FHSS was as large as AM to ASF. Once I ran ASF for a battery pack, I readjusted, but swapping back and forth between the two in the same day, I kept noticing how sensitive the steering and fast the response in the FHSS was.

On the ASF, I basically use my wrist to steer, on the FHSS like my sanwa, I use my fingers and steer in very delicate but accurate movements. It makes driving ASF feel like you're driving a large truck, where FHSS felt like a lightweight F1 even though both were box stock cars.

I know that some rules dictate stock transmitters, but nowhere that u race do they mandate that. I don't know if I would participate, as I do not own such transmitter, and would need to build a new car to participate.

From my understanding, brushed ASF mr03 has been discontinued for quite a while, when the sports model was first released. They supported ASF on the brushless models.

bobbyz
2018.12.06, 02:36 PM
For the RWD is there a reverse delay like older ASF boards, or has that been taken care of in the RWD boards? Thx

EMU
2018.12.06, 02:53 PM
I didn't notice any delay. I remove delay in all of my ASF cars

Qball41
2018.12.06, 05:28 PM
I'm re-new to the hobby. (Was new during the old AM radio days and am new again after being out for a long time). So I never messed with the ASF stuff.

I get that people like to use the fancier radios and that they are super adjustable and convenient, but I don't get the knock on the stock radios.

Back in the AM days, I qualified for the PN world's with a stock radio. Are the time you could pick them up on eBay for $5 all day long.

Now, I plan to stick with the stock radio because I don't want new people to our group thinking you have to buy a fancy radio to go fast.

EMU
2018.12.06, 06:01 PM
When you run many cars, you want to try to make them feel similar for your muscle memory to work effectively when racing. The adjustments available on the stock radio simply don't permit you to do that.

With stock motors, I almost always use a positive throttle curve to have my trigger pull similar to that of modified cars. Can I be just as fast with a stock radio in box stock, definitely, however it will greatly hurt my modified performance. For me, it is less about the steering feel than it is about the throttle feel. I destroyed my lap times with the kyosho stock RWD with stock radio compared to my ASF cars with my helios. I just really didn't like the throttle positions that I needed to use, and couldn't make any adjustments on the fly if the steering was a little off center or I wanted to reduce dual rate.

After using the RWD radio for 3 runs and all of practice, going back to my helios felt very alien. My biggest gripe with kyosho is why they are offering such a low end radio when even toy grade cars come with radios that offer considerably greater functionality. There is no median offering, and in comparison, a $50 radio should offer a whole lot more than the kt-531p does. Sure, it comes with the rtr, but at least include EPA, and curves to give some fine adjustment to the car. This should be standard this day and age on a hobby grade car.

Qball41
2018.12.06, 06:30 PM
With stock motors, I almost always use a positive throttle curve to have my trigger pull similar to that of modified cars. Can I be just as fast with a stock radio in box stock, definitely, however it will greatly hurt my modified performance. For me, it is less about the steering feel than it is about the throttle feel. I destroyed my lap times with the kyosho stock RWD with stock radio compared to my ASF cars with my helios. I just really didn't like the throttle positions that I needed to use, and couldn't make any adjustments on the fly if the steering was a little off center or I wanted to reduce dual rate.


Very valid. I appreciate the point of view.

I also agree, I would very much like to see a middle of the road radio, and the technology is definitely out there at that price point.

arch2b
2018.12.06, 09:04 PM
A replacement of the 5-UR is needed (middle range option). That was a fabulous radio, my personal favorite actually.

herman
2018.12.10, 04:39 AM
wow thanks for all your responses... lots of good points, and great input from emu... to summarize...

"limited to one day's use, I have a good impression from it."

"response in the electronics is noticeably faster than ASF, especially compared to one being driven by a Helios."

"After using the RWD radio for 3 runs and all of practice, going back to my helios felt very alien."

"The feeling of the steering just feels so responsive and accurate.... I dare say that the response difference between ASF and FHSS was as large as AM to ASF."

"....swapping back and forth between the two (ASF/FHSS) in the same day, I kept noticing how sensitive the steering and fast the response in the FHSS was."

"On the ASF, I basically use my wrist to steer, on the FHSS like my sanwa, I use my fingers and steer in very delicate but accurate movements. It makes driving ASF feel like you're driving a large truck, where FHSS felt like a lightweight F1 even though both were box stock cars."


sounds pretty promising... but as of the moment, it can only be controlled by the stock kt531 or the kt432...

kinda feeling a bit bummed that the mr03 asf / helios combo got whooped by the mr03 rwd / kt 531 as emu put it "...I destroyed my lap times with the kyosho stock RWD with stock radio compared to my ASF cars with my helios."

but well i guess that's technology working and moving forward for you... i've got quite a collection of asf cars... and after emu's inputs, i'm quite curious in getting a RWD to find out myself...

i kinda like Qball41's philosophy of sticking "with the stock radio because I don't want new people to our group thinking you have to buy a fancy radio to go fast." as it will encourage new racers into the hobby....

but as soon as you grow your fleet, having different bodies will have different driving characteristics... and having some adjustability (epa, throttle curves, steering response, etc.) that higher or moderately programmable / adjustable radios offer, is such a welcome thing to have....

i liked the idea that you could use a wide range of radios with the asf protocol... i guess it kinda helped the platform running it with different radios... kinda sad to see the asf go... but i guess it might be for the better...

wonder how the mr03evo will do when it comes out.... heard that the rx will not come cheap...

thanks again for all replies... very much appreciated...

EMU
2018.12.10, 05:31 AM
I may have been a little harsh on the asf/helios combo. It isn't bad, but back to back driving with the RWD a or a sanwa based 1/28 tablet makes the estimate difference noticeable. If I were to only drive with the helios, I would not feel disadvantaged. It is only when switching between radios, since the timing of how you drive the car changes.

When I drove with the helios after the red, I constantly turned in too late and often went wide for the first few laps, then adjusted. The setup of the RWD cars were all pretty similar, big McClaren, 8t, 20/30 tire combo. My ASF car was one that I had won a few decent box stock races with, and was a good car, but it might not have been the best setup for this specific layout. I also tried a brushless car and an awd with 70t and one with a 48t. The track is pretty small, and the 8t pretty much maxes it out. A 9t would not be advantageous on that layout.

Im in no rush to swap from ASF, but am considering a faster response radio like a eurus which should be a noticeable improvement over the helios, but give me similar ergonomics to my familiarity.

SuperFly
2018.12.10, 12:10 PM
but as soon as you grow your fleet, having different bodies will have different driving characteristics... and having some adjustability (epa, throttle curves, steering response, etc.) that higher or moderately programmable / adjustable radios offer, is such a welcome thing to have...

Model memory. I find it indispensable once you own three or more cars. Also, once you start running fast motors, I find throttle control beyond basic trim is a requirement.

arch2b
2018.12.10, 01:21 PM
Which is why the 5-UR was such a nice middle of the road upgrade. It gave you model memory and much of what you need for fine tuning without the high end cost. It was also very familiar ergonomics from the old AM radio.

herman
2018.12.11, 02:44 AM
Model memory. I find it indispensable once you own three or more cars. Also, once you start running fast motors, I find throttle control beyond basic trim is a requirement.

yes how can one forget model memory (isn't it ironic? dontcha think? it's like raaaiin.... but now back to regular programming)...

a great big plus saving all the settings you've done on the car after adjusting it to your liking based on each car's set up...

i've pretty much moved on to the kt18 exclusively.... since there isn't too much of a miniz scene here...

herman
2018.12.12, 10:58 PM
just great input EMU... wasn’t really looking to get another chassis to find out what another platform would be like… but now i'm just on the fence about thinking if i should get a RWD to find out what it's like...

i did get a fwd… but haven’t driven it around a lot to compare it to my other asf cars… (don’t run on a track or anything) but one thing that was quite welcome is that the fwd doesn’t spin out as much as the asf cars… simply because…. It’s front wheel drive…

compared to any rear wheel drive platform, any dust on the rear wheels on the asf (and even perhaps the new RWD)… and it’s spin city…. Not so with the fwd… was initially wanting to swap the fwd electronics to asf… but in view of the above posts, not so certain now…

wondering if an upgrade to a better radio like the erus... or maybe the ex6 or ex6r... would enhance or increase your performance in terms of driveability, and hopefully translate into lower lap times...

looking into the different controllers that are being offered by kyosho.... and with all the different protocols being used… it initially does seem to be a bit confusing (I’ve attached a compatibility table on protocols and radios below)...

http://mini-zracer.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=35646&stc=1&d=1544673467

at least the asf has several options of upgrading to a better radio… as arch2b mentioned, the ex5ur seems pretty reasonable at 110usd approx. compared to the other higher priced radios ex6r (350usd approx)…. a fleabay search showed second hand helios (used with a special module) 130usd approx. or erus (again used with a special module) 140usd approx.. seem quite attractive and could be good options if you choose…

on the other hand, the only option for a better radio for the new RWD and FWD is the kt432 as this radio is compatible with the FHS (sports and sports2 models) and FHSS (FWD and RWD) protocols… and at 220usd approx. seems a bit steep at the moment to just use it for your mini-z, compared to the second hand helios or erus, which you can use for other scales, if you have the module and receivers…

decisions, decisions…

arch2b
2018.12.13, 07:48 AM
Anyone brave enough to create a chart that includes the EX5-UR, EX-10 Helios, EX-10 Eurus and other radios now confirmed compatible with the new EVO receivers? I’d be happy to credit the creator and make it a sticky reference post:D

herman
2018.12.13, 06:07 PM
Oh forgot to mention the source of the table coming from a kyosho site...
Perhaps they'll get around to doing it eventually... ?