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Old 2008.01.14, 12:54 AM   #31
color01
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Isar, this is freaking genius, lol... definitely above my head as to how you got this far! And you're so right about the possibilities, you can plug in additional modules as you see fit to monitor different things... totally blown away, awesome work. We gotta see this final thing in action.
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Old 2008.01.14, 01:17 AM   #32
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You're announcing a discharging device! That's fantastic and very interesting news. I hope you do well with it and it allows many people in the hobby to share data that has been measured with comparable devices. I know a lot of people like to have gadgets, some like to be more professional in the way they race and others like to turn their pit area into a lab experiment - I hope it appeals to all The dark side to this is that we wouldn't want to blight the Mini-Z hobby with the level of battery wars that has put me off 1/10th... Hmmm...

Well I think geniousity is a new word on me, "brevity" is the one I need to take most notice of - I use 20words to your 1 and our signal to noise ratio is similar ! There is a popular sideline hobby of rewiring CDROM brushless outrunner motors for model aircraft and building your own brushless speed controller using microprocessors - I confess the sensorless brushless controller beat me - you have to be a lot more serious to get one of those to work - that was for me a maths exam of the worst kind.

Yes your argument about using an esc with a real motor is sound/common sense, I have thought about that and I dismissed it because I thought that the motors are subject to wear and then over the life of the unit the results would not be consistent but then... arrggh too early to think properly!

I will go through my task list at work and drop you a note!


Edit: Sorry color our posts crossed - I'm sat at work and listening to peoples weekend stories. I hope to get this telemetry sorted to a point others can make them very easily. It might appeal as a side hobby to some and a usful tool for chassis designers such as yourself.

Last edited by lsarccc; 2008.01.14 at 01:21 AM.
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Old 2008.01.14, 01:48 AM   #33
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In fact it is just a individual discharger with discharge rate and cutoff voltage adjustable for our battery packs. It can also be used for single cells. It doesn't have the capability to log the data (at least commercial one )

I aggree with the cost of batteries in larger scales and I also like way it is now for mini scale. However I think we've already reached the barriers of current plastic chasis so our products are just a little step ahead. We are trying to keep our costs and also prices down in order not create another vallet monster.
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Old 2008.01.14, 06:49 AM   #34
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Well that's still a nice product - I look forward to hearing more about it. TGR seems very active at the moment, I'm racing in the Hurda challenge in Stafford later this month - I suspect I'll struggle to be on pace but I'll get to see things like the Sinister and learn more off the Stafford boys and girls about these small cars .

I have a background with 1/12th pan cars so the Sinister chassis is very attractive to me - I have 4 kids so like all parents I have pictures in my wallet where my money used to be - no real room for wallet monsters anymore !


So thinking through the next steps, I need to make the current sensor and calibrate it and also drive the car around the hall with the bug transmitting to make sure the signal is still stable.


You have pm Wolf...
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Old 2008.01.14, 08:58 AM   #35
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This is the product I've mentioned previously, it has some missing hardware as you can see. They will be also ready within few days.



I don't want to distract this thread neither I want to open a new product anouncement thread yet. So everyone; questions and comments in Ask TGR forum please.
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Old 2008.01.14, 10:54 AM   #36
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you will be amazed at the sinister chassis arthur

i have a few ideas on sensor placement and operation,ill save them for the meet
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Old 2008.01.14, 12:19 PM   #37
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That is a beautiful piece of kit I think you will definitely win over the gadget freaks and pit poseurs! The variable rate and cutoff with get the racers too - nice presentation! Now a USB output and you'd get the lab rat boys too - less of them people about I guess so wise to choose that level of functionality.

I'm going to mention dead shorting - now this may be an immotive subject and I don't want to start a 'riot', but I have never seen anyone mention this. These AAAs remind me of the very flat Sub-C 3000s we were running a while back that loved to be dead shorted, but no mention of it on Mini-Z forums. Many people say don't go below 0.8v but that sounds like my grandma talking? Dead shorting is about number 3 on my list to try with a set of say Sanyo 800s - thoughts?

Matt - you might want to save all the old CDROMs and DVD drives you can get your hands on. Under the outrunner motor there are 3 hall effect sensors - they are really small and light and linear. Start collecting them mate! (put the cdrom motors and platter motors to one side for me if you don't need them)

Edit for picture...

I guess you know what I mean but just incase:

The three black things under the stator.

Last edited by lsarccc; 2008.01.14 at 01:52 PM.
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Old 2008.01.16, 01:46 PM   #38
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Smile A distraction...

I was thinking about how to calibrate the current sensor and decided that I'd use this as an opportunity to test the discharge side of the discharger by using that to supply different currents to help calibration.

When I was looking at the allocation of the pins on the pic chip I realised I had enough spare to drive a graphic LCD rather than the 20x3 character LCD I originally planned. I reckon this will allow more data to be displayed and graphics LCDs are definitely more bling than character ones. Luckily I have a stock of these graphics LCDs (cost about £5 off eBay).

It wasn't completely straight forward and it took me a couple of hours to get it all to work and get to a stage where I can display what I like...



Should look neat with a load of data on display in each cell and the current run time, discharge rate, lap etc counting up.

I have started to program the pwm and will have the discharge part sussed soon, then the interesting stuff can begin...
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Old 2008.01.16, 02:19 PM   #39
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again no clapping smiley,well done dude
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Old 2008.01.16, 04:13 PM   #40
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Crikey Arthur, Can't wait to meet up again soon. I may well be able to supply some of those hall effect sensors.

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Old 2008.01.18, 08:12 AM   #41
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Cheers guys, work is progressing - I hope to make some major advances this weekend and be able to have a trace of the load going around the track next week.

I was just looking again at fixed current discharging vs fixed load discharging. (With fixed load the current decreases as the battery voltage decreases.).

I think I should make the discharger able to be expanded to do fixed current discharging in the future.

I think fixed (and static value) load is worthless.

I think a fixed load that varies in a similar fashion to the load on the track is superior.



I'll stay on course with the variable load idea but the possibilty of adding selectable fixed currents later will be built in. I need a better current sensor/fixed current load.


My free sample rfPic chips arrived today - super tiny, I'm wanting to collaborate and create some really good telemetry bugs. Theres a good application paper on this: tyre pressure telemetry

No comments on dead shorting cells?
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Old 2009.01.06, 05:33 AM   #42
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any progress ?
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Old 2009.11.01, 12:56 PM   #43
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hi everyone, i have finished a new design circuit, with "pwm" *i can sell the design for 100 usd if anyone is interested to produce and sell. pcb is included
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Old 2013.08.20, 07:22 AM   #44
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We made a discharger/test rig a bit over a year ago. Two of these made, first prototype in the picture. Some features:

- MCU controlled calibrated constant discharging current, 0-4500mA, 2mA resolution
- Four point measuring of cell voltage, contact losses don't effect the voltage reading
- 0.1mV calibrated voltage resolution
- DAC controlled discharging circuit with automatic closed loop correction to maintain discharging current
- Individual cell temperature monitoring
- Internal resistance measurement
- Can be coded to do PWM discharging, constant load, pulse discharging etc.
- 128x64 display
- Can be connected to LogView via USB, discharge curves directly to LogView and can be processed further in Excel etc.

Attached a picture of the prototype device and a picture of some 60 batteries discharged and plotted in Excel. Next version will have a charger circuit and SD-memorycard onboard and the goal is to make a device that does automated and identical battery break-in and testing with one push of button.

https://docs.google.com/file/d/0Byzk...it?usp=sharing
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0Byzk...it?usp=sharing
Attached Images
File Type: jpg Boksi_pienennetty.jpg (393.5 KB, 31 views)

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Old 2013.08.20, 08:45 AM   #45
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Very interesting setup to say the least.
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