2006.11.20, 11:53 PM
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#1
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Here kitty, kitty, kitty
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Phoenix, Arizona
Posts: 863
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Durable Paint
I have several kits on the bench and I’m looking to paint them in a way that will last for awhile under race conditions.
My first car, the Rainbow Studios McLaren, was painted with Testors Model Master enamel paints and sealed with a dozen coats of Model Master Lacquer clear. Sadly the paint began chipping off badly on the first day.
(This is after a few months)
http://mini-zracer.com/forums/showpo...&postcount=116
The Kyosho Autoscale bodies by contrast are nearly indestructible. After weeks of racing they usually have only tiny superficial chips and scrapes in the hardest hit areas. So the question here is two fold:
1. What paint and sealers does Kyosho use to manufacture the ASC bodies? (An unobtainable process for the general public I’m sure)
2. What type of paint and sealer will hold up best under abuse for a hard plastic body?
My thinking to get around the shattered paint has gone in two directions- Use a lacquer paint to bite better across layers and plastic, or use the softer more flexible acrylic paints. Here is where my research has lead:
Tamiya Lacquer:
Synthetic ‘fake’ lacquer.
Works well with Tamiya enamel and acrylic.
Pactra Lacquer(Racing Finish):
Couldn’t find much information. Can be used safely on hard plastic bodies.
Shoot at 20-25psi.
Dupli-Color:
Real auto body lacquer
Real lacquer bite. (Found recommendation for Plastikote primer to be plastic safe)
Will it work with hobby lacquer clear coats? If not, will Dupli-Color clearcoat harm decals?
Faskolor:
Prime with Enamel or Lacquer
Seal with Enamel or Urethane, NO LACQUER
Flexable but weaker water based adhesion
Troublesome thick for spray. Must crank compressor to 40-70psi.
Tamiya Acrylic:
Water based.
Softer, more flexible layers? How well does it hold up under abuse?
I’ve used Testors enamel since I graduated from finger paints, and so it’s well within my comfort zone. I’ve always achieved good results from my old friend, plus I already own a box full of them. Saves money.
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2006.11.21, 01:08 AM
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#2
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Master of Thrash
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Arkansas
Posts: 4,980
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The Tamiya spray can stuff is the best as far as the way it look's, and the way it lasts. Don't let the word "synthetic" put you off of it, as all laquer type paints today are synthetic. The old nitrocelulose(sp) laquers that I have read about was used on the old model T fords with pigment from lampblack. It is a good step up from the Testors and Model Master paints. Just the only drawback is the paint layer will be thin and show every flaw in the body. Even with a thin layer is is tough. The clearcoated ones the scuffs are minor, and buff right out. My Mini Mad Force body that has multi layers of different colors still look's good as many times as it has flipped and rolled over. It still look's as good as the two days it took to paint it. The acrylic paints are best used for the detail areas, as that can rub off. It sticks well to the laquer base.
One thing I didn't like about the glosscoated ASC bodies, the shiny grills and vents. That made the body look more lexan than a scale car would be.
The only other one on that list I have tried is Dupli-color. spay cans again. I did my clod hard body with it. Some areas that I masked the paint pulled up. Somehow it don't stick to the Tamiya plastics well. I have done a few Kyosho Z bodies with it. I can use my 911 as an example, it was done with a Mirage kit. The Mirage kit paint is a little softer than the Auto paint. It shows scuffs badly.
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2006.11.21, 04:51 PM
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#3
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Brooklyn. Got a problem with that?
Posts: 1,498
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I second that. Tamiya sprays are the way to go. Never encountered problem of lifting the paint with them when masking is removed. Sticks very well to autoscales. If i go for more than one color paint scheme, i always keep the front, rear and sides single color. If i want to fix the paint, i mask the rest and spray a little of color on damaged areas - very easy fix.
Tamiya seem to run very easy so be carefull when spraying and do only light coats at a time (you probably know that, but i find tamiya easier to run than others). I'll post a pics of a 9 month old mclaren body i'm using for racing later tonight.
Last edited by michvin; 2006.11.21 at 04:54 PM.
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2006.11.21, 11:39 PM
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#4
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Brooklyn. Got a problem with that?
Posts: 1,498
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promised pics. Black is the RCP dust - forgot to clean it
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2006.11.21, 11:40 PM
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#5
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Brooklyn. Got a problem with that?
Posts: 1,498
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some more - sorry
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2006.11.22, 03:00 AM
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#6
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Here kitty, kitty, kitty
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Phoenix, Arizona
Posts: 863
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Yep, mine looked like that after only a few months. I also noticed your damage looks more like scraps and rubs, whereas mine is cracking off in chunks, as though the paint were brittle and shattered.
So, it does look like the Tamiya lacquer hangs on better. I set out to get some today but was thwarted at every attempt. Two hobby stores (Bench and a local), and I came away empty handed. Naturally the one Hobby Bench I know has TS paints is the longer drive. Figures.
I’ve worked just a little with Metalizer Lacquers and they achieved a fantastic finish, so I’m looking forward to working with the Tamiya TS. Too bad I can’t find it in the bottles though, I have an airbrush and compressor.
I’ve seen some terrific results from Tamiya paints, even acrylic. Check out the modeling diaries on this guy’s site. He’s a real pro at making high quality static display F1 models.
www.cifesystem.com
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2006.11.22, 05:31 AM
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#7
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Moderator
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Stafford, Va
Posts: 6,064
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I'm willing to bet its some kind of polyurathane and they most likely use ultraviolet rays to dry it fast. I don't think it's a process you can mimick.
Unfortunately to keep detail a thin coat is needed much like your rainbow mcl. i recently painted up a murci body and emptied a small can of clear coat on it. I haven't raced it with other racers but I don't imagine it will last forever.
Probably should use a matching color primer nice and heavy coating of that and clear.
-Byebye
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2006.11.22, 11:51 AM
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#8
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Brooklyn. Got a problem with that?
Posts: 1,498
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dusty Weasle
Yep, mine looked like that after only a few months. I also noticed your damage looks more like scraps and rubs, whereas mine is cracking off in chunks, as though the paint were brittle and shattered.
So, it does look like the Tamiya lacquer hangs on better. I set out to get some today but was thwarted at every attempt. Two hobby stores (Bench and a local), and I came away empty handed. Naturally the one Hobby Bench I know has TS paints is the longer drive. Figures.
I’ve worked just a little with Metalizer Lacquers and they achieved a fantastic finish, so I’m looking forward to working with the Tamiya TS. Too bad I can’t find it in the bottles though, I have an airbrush and compressor.
I’ve seen some terrific results from Tamiya paints, even acrylic. Check out the modeling diaries on this guy’s site. He’s a real pro at making high quality static display F1 models.
www.cifesystem.com
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I know that pointing to other vendors is not a good taste, but since the shop here doesn't carry it... Go to t o wer site. They have sprays (two sizes i think), bottles, and more.
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2006.11.22, 12:00 PM
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#9
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Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Brooklyn. Got a problem with that?
Posts: 1,498
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Quote:
Originally Posted by byebye
I'm willing to bet its some kind of polyurathane and they most likely use ultraviolet rays to dry it fast. I don't think it's a process you can mimick.
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not really. It's a primer followed by 3 coats of tamiya "ferrari red", although this guy mixes it himself. Here's how he's doing it
http://www.cifesystem.com/2003ga.html
Unfortunately to keep detail a thin coat is needed much like your rainbow mcl. i recently painted up a murci body and emptied a small can of clear coat on it. I haven't raced it with other racers but I don't imagine it will last forever.
Probably should use a matching color primer nice and heavy coating of that and clear.
- Byebye[/QUOTE]
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2006.11.22, 12:21 PM
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#10
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Master of Thrash
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Arkansas
Posts: 4,980
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michvin
Tamiya seem to run very easy so be carefull when spraying and do only light coats at a time (you probably know that, but i find tamiya easier to run than others).
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I never had a problem with paint running. Ok' once but with a cheap enamel spray paint. I used it in warm weather with no problems. But on a cold day, temp 32 degs or lower. The paint gobbed together and just made a mess, mostly on the garage floor. That may be true with any paint you use.
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2006.12.14, 03:05 PM
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#11
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Registered User
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Toronto
Posts: 372
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Ok after reading this thread, i guess painting with tamiya paint then clearcoating is the best way to protect the paint from rubbing off/chipping.
But what if i want a flat black car? I know tamiya has a flat black colour. Would it be ok to just paint flat black and apply a few more coats to prevent it from rubbing off? Im askin this because i dont think clearcoat is the best thing for flat black. It will give it the gloss affect (which i dont want)
__________________
Go kimi
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2006.12.14, 04:13 PM
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#12
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Master of Thrash
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: Arkansas
Posts: 4,980
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The flat black is tough enough, what you do knock off can be touched up with the bottle stuff. I used it in the bed of my Clod and Midnite Pumpkin bodies, I have had stuff sliding loose in there without much damage to the paint. That is without the clearcoat on it. Now if you used a knife or other sharp object you may scrape it off though.
This H1 the hood vent and grab handles, along with the bumpers was done with Tamiya flat black spray. The smaller detail items like the door handles and small vents was hand painted with the bottle stuff. All that was done after the clear was layed over the silver base. I still need to make the back door to complete this body. This started as an unpainted white body with a few mods.
Last edited by HammerZ; 2006.12.14 at 04:23 PM.
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2006.12.14, 05:31 PM
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#13
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: SoCal
Posts: 921
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I just finished my C5-R with the Tamiya TS primer, paint, and clear coat. I haven't run it yet and most likely I'll shelve it since it's the first one I did, but if I do run it I'll let everyone know how the paint held up.
oh yea...you can check out the thread just few threads below.
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