2013.08.31, 04:06 AM
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#1
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Guest
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Help: Setup & PN Tires.
Hi guys.
For the last year most people around our track (smooth side) has used PN RSF15 front tires and RRR06 rear tires.
Amazing grip, and these have been the fastest tire by far. (ModGT cars)
The track shop ran out of RSF15 for a few weeks ago, but now they got a new batch from PN.
This new batch are not the same compound. They are harder than the 1301 RSF15, harder than the RSF20 and even harder than some older RXF25 I tried.
Some people still have the previous RSF15 left and they are so much faster now than what us others have to use.
On a 7 second lap it differs 2 - 3 tenth! Thats a lot over a 5 and 8 minute run!
What can be done to gain enough steering to be competitive again?
And PN: Are you coming out with all tires in different compounds now, so maybe the RSF10 can be used? These have been way too soft before, but maybe if the compounds are harder it can work?
Please advice
Edit: Forgot to tell. We are using MR-03's, both VE and regular. PN double a, tri dampers etc
Last edited by Tapir; 2013.08.31 at 04:19 AM.
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2013.08.31, 08:31 AM
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#2
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Moderator
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 35,480
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this is actually not uncommon and a reason why most recommend stockpiling tires you know work. GPM used to be the king of the mountain till their batches were so far off almost no one buys GPM anymore. inconsistency in tire batches can cause real damage to a brand. in my opinion, i've had the best luck with kyosho tires in terms of consistency. it can't hurt to post the question on specific tire types regarding consistency of shore rating in the PN subforum and they have an answer and or are aware of the issue. i'm sure you are not the only one affected.
what are others that have been affected at your track changing to as a result? what choices can be eliminated for example. you may be back to zero needing to grab a bunch of stuff and go through the exercise all over again, which really sucks.
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2013.08.31, 09:46 AM
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#3
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PN Racing Team Driver
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Myrtle Beach, SC
Posts: 1,700
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i would run the rxf15. the x patterns tend to have a better grip than the slicks for me.
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2013.08.31, 11:28 AM
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#4
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PN RacingTEAM Driver
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: southern calfornia
Posts: 1,530
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i have found that with the new front tires it takes a few packs to break in
and also requires a degree more camber in the front
with the 1301 i ran 1deg camber....2 degree was way too much steering and would traction roll with out even trying!
since the 1301 went out of stock we have been working hard to re create it and at the same time it is helping me to find different setups that can make it work!
i have found that running 2 deg camber to be as fast as the 1301 with 1deg
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2013.08.31, 04:24 PM
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#5
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Guest
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Thanks!
Regarding the tires needing some time before seating in, that is the same we have experienced.
Still they offer lot less grip than the 1301. A lot!
We have been seeing a lot of new members in our club this season, and it keeps on increasing. It is not good now to have people that have come over from other classes due to the fun and good price level that Z racing offer to suddenly have all kinds of setup issues. Demotivated members are the least thing that Mini-Z needs now.
I will definetly try incresasing the camber on the car to see i this can help some.
With double a, and 1 degree lower arms this would have the exentric positioned how?
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2013.08.31, 04:53 PM
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#6
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PN RacingTEAM Driver
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: southern calfornia
Posts: 1,530
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tapir
Thanks!
Regarding the tires needing some time before seating in, that is the same we have experienced.
Still they offer lot less grip than the 1301. A lot!
We have been seeing a lot of new members in our club this season, and it keeps on increasing. It is not good now to have people that have come over from other classes due to the fun and good price level that Z racing offer to suddenly have all kinds of setup issues. Demotivated members are the least thing that Mini-Z needs now.
I will definetly try incresasing the camber on the car to see i this can help some.
With double a, and 1 degree lower arms this would have the exentric positioned how?
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normally i run flats in... with the new tires i run flats up
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2013.08.31, 06:43 PM
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#7
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Guest
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arch2b
this is actually not uncommon and a reason why most recommend stockpiling tires you know work. GPM used to be the king of the mountain till their batches were so far off almost no one buys GPM anymore. inconsistency in tire batches can cause real damage to a brand. in my opinion, i've had the best luck with kyosho tires in terms of consistency. it can't hurt to post the question on specific tire types regarding consistency of shore rating in the PN subforum and they have an answer and or are aware of the issue. i'm sure you are not the only one affected.
what are others that have been affected at your track changing to as a result? what choices can be eliminated for example. you may be back to zero needing to grab a bunch of stuff and go through the exercise all over again, which really sucks.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chad508
i would run the rxf15. the x patterns tend to have a better grip than the slicks for me.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yasuji
normally i run flats in... with the new tires i run flats up
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arch. The track shop does this, but some hundred pairs of tires usually goes trough to fast and to keep things level most people agree to change at rooughly the same time when there are batch changes. For bigger races its no problem because then people usually has some "only for big races stash" hidden away
There are not a single person in our club that has found the same speed with the new ones. A plus is that on the rough side they seem to work.
chad: Thanks. Will ask if its possible to get some of these in the shop. They threw away a lot of them because the previous they had just melted and when trued they were full of hard lumps inside the tires. Maybe the new ones are good so this can be an option.
yasuji: Thanks. Will definetly give it a try. Do you know if the 8 and 10 tires also will come in a harder compound this time? Maybe they could be worth a try.
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2013.09.10, 04:26 PM
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#8
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Guest
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A littlebit more steering found with adjusting the camber, but still these tires offer lot less grip than before.
Even on the rough side they are not good.
The new rear radial 6 are also lot less grippy than before.
This is something we have heard other clubs complain about also.
Why the change
Are there new tires coming in soon that are more like the old ones?
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2013.09.12, 11:58 AM
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#9
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PN Racing Team Driver
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Myrtle Beach, SC
Posts: 1,700
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I know on or track I was running the newest 6r and also the new 5r and they have great grip and last forever. Have kyosho tire been ran a lot on your track lately?
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2013.09.12, 12:32 PM
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#10
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Guest
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Our track have been using PN tires exclusevly for over 5 years, and since the track was new.
Never Kyosho or other brands of tire.
When the 1212 batch RRR06 ran out (they were very good), we changed to the new batch. Voila: Grip lasts only to the thread is gone.
The new 5's have also been tested with the same results. No grip after only a couple of 5 minute runs. The 1212 batch lasted until the spur touched the track and still do for those who have left.
With the new RXF15 and RSF15 front tires we again experience the same. Lot less grip than the previous batch and struggle all the way.
Lots of frustration with this.
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2013.09.12, 12:44 PM
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#11
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: South Bay Area, CA
Posts: 117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tapir
No grip after only a couple of 5 minute runs..
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This is exactly the experience I've had with the new PN6. Good for the first couple runs, after that absolutely no traction.
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2013.09.12, 02:27 PM
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#12
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PN Racing Team Driver
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Myrtle Beach, SC
Posts: 1,700
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do the tires appear to "glaze" over. i had this happen when we ran carpet but i could bring them back with a little scuff on a truer
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R1Wurks
LET's Go Racing
MBMZR
DG Designs
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2013.09.12, 04:45 PM
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#13
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Registered User
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: South Bay Area, CA
Posts: 117
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chad508
do the tires appear to "glaze" over. i had this happen when we ran carpet but i could bring them back with a little scuff on a truer
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I haven't had that issue with the rear tires yet. I've had that occur with the front tires in the past and found the same solution to be the remedy.
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2013.09.12, 07:52 PM
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#14
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MINI-Z BODY NUT
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: pa.
Posts: 5,028
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I will say the batch thats in stock right now is great. The 15 front slicks and X are also good.
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DG DESIGNS - PN RACING - MANTISWORX
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2013.09.13, 04:26 PM
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#15
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Guest
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lfisminiz
I will say the batch thats in stock right now is great. The 15 front slicks and X are also good.
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Strange! For modified?
Can you confirm the batch#?
Chad508: No glazing. The front tires just seems "dry" and hard. The rear tires are a bit strange, and dont come in as the 1212 and older batches.
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