2005.12.24, 02:57 PM
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#151
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Honor & a shot of sake.
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Staten Island.
Posts: 575
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I lost to Magic again last night.
And I'm not sure if my points last week should count...I was informed by Magic that the motor I was using was illegal.
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2005.12.24, 03:18 PM
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#152
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EMUracing
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: NYC
Posts: 7,417
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How is it illegal? It is a Speedy 05... all parts came with the motor, it was only broken in well and tweaked to perform well.
If we are not allowed to maintain, clean and tweak the 'legal' motors, we should be given handout motors.
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2005.12.24, 04:10 PM
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#153
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Reading,PA.
Posts: 734
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EMU
How is it illegal? It is a Speedy 05... all parts came with the motor, it was only broken in well and tweaked to perform well.
If we are not allowed to maintain, clean and tweak the 'legal' motors, we should be given handout motors.
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Just out of curiosity, what do you mean by tweaking a legal motor?
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2005.12.24, 04:14 PM
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#154
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EMUracing
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: NYC
Posts: 7,417
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gasman1
Just out of curiosity, what do you mean by tweaking a legal motor?
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Adjusting the timing (moving the commutator on the armature). For a PN event this would not be allowed. PN disallows the motors from being opened during the races, but supplies a motor for each racer which is supposed to be equal performance accross the board. However, like all manufacturing... it isnt. There will be faster and slower motors in the same batch.
We are restricted with the motors that we can use in stock class... Kyosho X-Speed, PN Speedy, Speedy BB, Speedy 05, Speedy 05 BB are the motors that we are allowed to use for the stock class (not sure about the Speedy NM). I used to race with the Atomic Stock BB motor.
From my viewpoint, as long as the parts of the motors are being used, you should be able to mix and match them however you like. I have a PN BB Can with an X-Speed armature. I told Al what I was using, and was not told it was illegal. Brushes should be replacable with any brush in my opinion. I will have to speak with Al about what is necessary for the motor to be legal. Racing is not only a driving comparison, but also a setup comparison as well. He has limited the motors to lower the cost of the newer racers, so they would not have to buy a new motor every time one comes out. In actuallity what makes people need the faster motors is his track layouts. They are designed for the top end speed, rather than limiting it by the speed in the turns. His shortest straightaways are the same length as my longest one at home. A mod car is equal to a stock class car at my home track as far as laptimes. The large track setup that he has only further increases people to want to cheat, break parts, and does not increase driver skill as much as a tight layout.
If he were to incorporate a mini-tile infield in his track, the motor choice would not matter as much.
Last edited by EMU; 2005.12.24 at 04:28 PM.
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2005.12.24, 05:10 PM
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#155
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Reading,PA.
Posts: 734
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EMU
Adjusting the timing (moving the commutator on the armature). For a PN event this would not be allowed. PN disallows the motors from being opened during the races, but supplies a motor for each racer which is supposed to be equal performance accross the board. However, like all manufacturing... it isnt. There will be faster and slower motors in the same batch.
We are restricted with the motors that we can use in stock class... Kyosho X-Speed, PN Speedy, Speedy BB, Speedy 05, Speedy 05 BB are the motors that we are allowed to use for the stock class (not sure about the Speedy NM). I used to race with the Atomic Stock BB motor.
From my viewpoint, as long as the parts of the motors are being used, you should be able to mix and match them however you like. I have a PN BB Can with an X-Speed armature. I told Al what I was using, and was not told it was illegal. Brushes should be replacable with any brush in my opinion. I will have to speak with Al about what is necessary for the motor to be legal. Racing is not only a driving comparison, but also a setup comparison as well. He has limited the motors to lower the cost of the newer racers, so they would not have to buy a new motor every time one comes out. In actuallity what makes people need the faster motors is his track layouts. They are designed for the top end speed, rather than limiting it by the speed in the turns. His shortest straightaways are the same length as my longest one at home. A mod car is equal to a stock class car at my home track as far as laptimes. The large track setup that he has only further increases people to want to cheat, break parts, and does not increase driver skill as much as a tight layout.
If he were to incorporate a mini-tile infield in his track, the motor choice would not matter as much.
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how is that done? moving the comm on the armature? I know on 1/10 scale motors the can is rotated but how is it done on a 130 motor?
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2005.12.26, 12:54 PM
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#156
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EMUracing
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: NYC
Posts: 7,417
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The com is not 'attached' to the armature. It can rotate on the shaft a little. By moving the com, the brushes will give the current to the com at different timings. This is why some motors out of the box spin faster in reverse than forwards... Since the timing is more delayed. You would need to advance the timing to make it run correctly/better.
I am no motor expert, what I know I have learned from IbrakeIfry.
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2005.12.26, 01:07 PM
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#157
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Reading,PA.
Posts: 734
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EMU
The com is not 'attached' to the armature. It can rotate on the shaft a little. By moving the com, the brushes will give the current to the com at different timings. This is why some motors out of the box spin faster in reverse than forwards... Since the timing is more delayed. You would need to advance the timing to make it run correctly/better.
I am no motor expert, what I know I have learned from IbrakeIfry.
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thanks Emu, I did find othet postings about this
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2005.12.28, 12:46 AM
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#158
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 205
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-advancing the timing is good if you don't mind losing a little low end torque and general punch...i just like to set it forward a fingernail because anything more and you lose too much punch. advanced timing is ideal in a fet car since you regain that torque plus some!
-i would like to say that the motor in my car right now has no timing advance to regain the punch lost at the bottom end. you kind of need that when al makes his track tighter
-also Lionblade a timing advanced motor would be at a disadvantage to a normally timed motor in a tighter track like when i lended you my motor which is why i switched it back before i put it in my car for stock class. besides i saw that race and you won it fair and square you were going just as fast as magic was!
-on the other hand with long straights and a 9 tooth the timing advance is noticable in the way that you tend to have slightly more speed towards the end of the straight. although again on the turns it lags coming out.
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2005.12.28, 01:24 AM
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#159
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Registered User
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 205
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2005.12.28, 07:19 AM
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#160
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Registered User
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Reading,PA.
Posts: 734
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ibrake Ifry
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yeah, thanks. thats the thread I found. very interesting
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2006.01.02, 07:24 PM
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#161
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Honor & a shot of sake.
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Staten Island.
Posts: 575
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I was taking a look at my 02 today while it was on a ASC display...the front end looked like it sat way higher than the rear, but I noticed my fronts are down to the last bit of rubber, while my rears are holding well. Might explain why I was understeering a little. Anyone have decent 10 or 15 fronts? I've got 20's, but they need my semi-wide flat wheels, and I don't want to spend $8 for 2 tires at Al's.
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2006.01.02, 09:15 PM
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#162
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: makati, philippines
Posts: 8,702
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Quote:
I'd prefer something with no straight or 1 straight maximum. The layout now is nuts, I like the one we had a while back...
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how many rcp wide l's were used for that set up? (post #128)
thanks for any replies...
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2006.01.02, 11:29 PM
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#163
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EMUracing
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: NYC
Posts: 7,417
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herman
how many rcp wide l's were used for that set up? (post #128)
thanks for any replies...
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The track was ordered direct from RCP for the quantity of tiles that they wanted of each kind. I guess you could count the corners and straights to figure out how many wide Ls and expansion packs it would consist of... (I may do it someday while marshalling ).
Vin, I have some partially used tires you could have. Just running with them at the home track which causes less wear than at ARCMS.
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2006.01.03, 02:43 PM
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#164
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Honor & a shot of sake.
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Staten Island.
Posts: 575
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EMU
Vin, I have some partially used tires you could have. Just running with them at the home track which causes less wear than at ARCMS.
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Awesome, the flat style ones I have would look way too weird on the 575GTC...plus you know I'm OCD and all my wheels NEED to match.
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2006.01.03, 10:51 PM
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#165
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Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: makati, philippines
Posts: 8,702
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Quote:
The track was ordered direct from RCP for the quantity of tiles that they wanted of each kind. I guess you could count the corners and straights to figure out how many wide Ls and expansion packs it would consist of...
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don't really know how many corners and straights a basic wide l rcp track has... haven't actually seen one in person... anyway thanks for your reply... er i might have missed it but how big is it? in terms of dimensions? __ ft. X __ft. thanks again...
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