Mini-Z, Kyosho Mini-Z Racer, MR-03, MR-02, MA-010, Forums, News, Pictures, Parts, and Shop - Mini-ZRacer.com
Forums, Mini-Z, MiniZ, Kyosho Mini-Z, Kyosho MiniZ, Kyosho Mini-Z Racer
Mini-Z Hop-Ups, Mini-Z Parts, MiniZ Hop-Ups, MiniZ Parts, Kyosho Mini-Z Hop-Ups, Kyosho Mini-Z Parts, Kyosho MiniZ Hop-Ups, Kyosho MiniZ Parts, Kyosho Mini-Z Racer Hop-Ups, Racer Kyosho Mini-Z Parts
Old 2002.08.18, 10:18 AM   #1
DAMZer
Zen_gineer
 
DAMZer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: The Border, SC
Posts: 1,363
Stock Class Racing

Speed is fun!! I enjoy tweaking my car and suspension to maximize the handling to the track. Key word here is "TRACK". I enjoy bashing and running in the driveway, but nothing compares to driving a track with other cars equally prepared. You see the skill of the driver and the caliber of car set-up.

I've been racing stock motor classes in 1/10 for almost 2 decades. The governing bodies have bent to the will of suppliers and battery manufacturers. My opinion is that this is wrong.

Read on before you hit the reply button.........

Stock class was originally designed to offer an entry level to the masses, Novices if you prefer, I don't. It was made to be a battleground of equally equiped cars with similar batteries and motors. A true drivers' class. Then came the battery advancements that made modified racing possible. And then came the motor advancements that allowed the use of the total MAH capacity of the batteries developed for the mod racers. The self advancing commercial loop was started and has yet to be closed, it is now a spiral that has no end in site. And everybody benefitted.......WRONG!!

What started out as a class that anybody could enjoy has become a specialist class equal to modified in every way except straight line speed. I've run laps with the new stock motors that were only 1-2 seconds slower than the A-main 10th place qualifier in modified. Just fact no brag, I am not alone is this aspect, I've seen many stock class times Better than mod!!

So what am I rambling about? Speed is exciting but speed with control is the ultimate high. Nothing can be compared to driving down a long straight with 2-3 cars in competition for the first corner line and finding that your car dives in and out of the corner better than the other cars. Pride-skill-car all tied together to make it possible. You may tag the next corner and finish last but that perfect corner will leave an indelible mark on the brain that it will crave for you to repeat.

How do we get this feeling out to more people to "hook" them to the hobby? True stock class racing.

Governing bodies be damned!! for not recognizing this point and keeping the hobby alive with new converts.

How does this apply to Mini-z's? A harder issue now that internal turbo's are commonplace. Maybe the the new Yokomo chassis will alow a full inspect of the ESC, motor and batteries, as all the components are surface mounted and visible.

We hashed this out in other threads but I would propose that true stock class would involve checked and sealed hand-out motors and 700 mah NiMh cells from 1 Mfg. Speed checked before and after runs to maintain that nothing was changed. Chassis mods would be allowed as long as a minimum weight was maintained and the chassis remained intact.

I am venting because I see so much potential in the hobby with so little room for new guys to enter and be competitive at their own level. Thankfully the forum allows this venting and helps maintain my center.

My advice to all that enter into the world of Mini-z's, when you have modded to the point that it is no longer fun, get back to the stock mode and set up a track of some sort, involve some friends and get the cars equal. 2EZ and I have had a ball running comparitively equipped stock cars on our little local track.

Save the Insane speed runs for that long stretch of smooth concrete that says DRAG strip. Most of us won't see a speed track like that beautifully awesome Connecticut Speedway. But in stock mode on a small track, the Highs will come and the enjoyment will continue.

As always, JMHO. Keep the Faith!!
__________________
Racing is a state of mind....and I've lost it
DAMZer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2002.08.18, 10:36 AM   #2
Mondo
Mini-Zedologist - Fear me
 
Mondo's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: Bristol, England
Posts: 3,611
Re: Stock Class Racing

Quote:
Originally posted by DAMZer
My advice to all that enter into the world of Mini-z's, when you have modded to the point that it is no longer fun, get back to the stock mode and set up a track of some sort, involve some friends and get the cars equal.
DAMZer,

Agreed, a Mini-Z with a hot motor and twin-turbo presents grip problems. Overcome them with a tyre and you have handling problems.
Mini-Z tintops will always be limited on how much you can effectively improve the handling.
Sure, the H-Plates, Toe-in bars and spring/damper sets do help, but it repaidly gets to a point where the design limitations kick in and you end up uninstalling the Turbo and reverting back to an X-Speed type motor.

I bought a Bolink Legend 1/12 to race, as a club near me races these oh-so-basic 1/12 scale cars.
They slap limitations on the cars too regarding motors and batteries.
Only one motor type and one 7.2 Volt battery type may be used.
I have never got around to assembling the Bolink Legend, but I do have everything needed to make it run.
Fortunately I have watched a Legends race and it all boils down to driver skill and not how much money you can pump into the Bolink Legend - due to rule limitations.

So, I got distracted and bought a Micro RS4.
I've pumped hundreds of Dollars into it.
If I were to race against some more standard RS4's, I know that my Micro RS4 has the potential to outclass them. This could make up for my deficiency as a driver, so I am a middle pack driver with a big budget car and I can stick it out with the top drivers and their middle-budget Micros.
Agreed DAMZer, it isn't fair is it?

I think it's hard to get back to basics and I justify this statement by admitting my modified Mini-Z tintop is a lot more fun to drive than my almost standard one.
I couldn't imagine driving a standard Micro RS4 either.
Also, it's nice to show off exactly what lives under the bodyshell.

So, tell me, how exactly do we get back to basics?
__________________
Mondo
__________

The UberMod is back in town...
Mondo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2002.08.18, 11:24 AM   #3
GME0VR
Look mum.. no hands!
 
GME0VR's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Perth, Australia
Posts: 138
what attracted me to mini-z racing in the first place was an enthusiasm for motor racing, a (not so) passing interest in radio controlled hobbies, and a love of technology. imho mini-z offers a means to satisfy those 3 basic interests.

you discuss issues of 'getting back to basics'. its a great concept, but one that i would argue will never happen. consider the different ppl who own a mini-z. most have had experience with other r/c racing, some are beginners to the r/c scene, others appreciate the 'bang for their buck' a mini-z provides, and some just have too much money with spare time to match it.

its these factors that suggest to myself an inherent problem with getting back to basics. on the one hand you have the r/c racing "experts" who will not be satisfied by racing stock cars as they have the experience and skill to handle a modified mini-z. on the other hand you have ppl who have seemingly endless piles of $$ to plough into performance parts and probably are looking for nothing more than another 'trophy' item. then you have the genuine enthusiast, the guy who doesnt care if his car is stock coz he just loves the thrill of racing.

essentially, you have many ppl from different walks of life with different ideals and in the end different goals.

i for one enjoy my mini-z. i dont care if i'm racing someone with the worlds fastest motor, or with a barebone stock mini-z. i'm in it for the entertainment. i dont need to complain when someone beats me "because they have a faster motor" or because "they've got more $$" to spend on this great hobby. what i desire is to share my enthusiasm with ppl with a similar enthusiasm for a hobby i have grown to love.

so whats my point?

my point is just get out there and have fun.. forget about your ego, ignore the limitations of your wallet, and just have FUN.

mini-z is a great hobby, so enjoy it for what it is

of course you can get technical and work out different race classes: stock, mod, super-mod etc. but i would suggest you would then take away the hobby and replace it with a sport. i myself would like to keep it as a hobby
__________________
where there's rubber i'll burn it..
GME0VR is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2002.08.18, 07:54 PM   #4
DAMZer
Zen_gineer
 
DAMZer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: The Border, SC
Posts: 1,363
I agree with all said......
__________________
Racing is a state of mind....and I've lost it
DAMZer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2002.08.19, 02:49 AM   #5
herman
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: makati, philippines
Posts: 8,437
all great ideas...

hobby vs. sport... where do you stand?

nowadays... it seems that everybody is after speed... everybody wants to go faster... it's now come to a point where internal turbo's, special hand wound motors, and high tech chargers now play a big part and paint a whole new picture...

it is kind of sad to say that there are no regulations when it comes to races (at our track)... which is why i guess they call it "open modified class"... people will stop at nothing to make their car go fast(er)...

it is pretty hard especially now, to go back to basics when you've been bitten by the speed bug... and everything points, and is geared towards going faster...

just where does it stop? i just recently posted somewhere on these forums that i tried a car with 12 fets in it... oh man... speed is a drug...

once you've been bit... you'll just have to go all out, just to stay up with the guys...


on the other hand, i do reminisce about the first time i took the z out of the box and ran it box stock... it was just pure fun, no speed, no nothing... just fun...

i still look for the day when they will bring back 'stock class' races to the tracks... that way you won't have to spend much, there will be more participation (hopefully)... and winners will be determined by his (or her - you can never count them out) driving skill.... that way, everybody will have fun...


========
i still do keep one car box stock and take it out one a while for a spin, i just hope that one day i'll be able to take it out to the track for a race...
herman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2002.08.19, 09:18 AM   #6
2EZ
Mini Z Driver!
 
2EZ's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: SC
Posts: 474
Send a message via AIM to 2EZ
DamZer

Thanks for mentioning me in your post. I do thrill in our days at the track. I believe the most fun is had when we are equally matched (cars) and the driving skills are the only real measure of difference. I take great pleasure when I do finally make that great move to pass you and lead out of a turn only to have you out break me into the next corner and me get the ever familiar view of the rear of your car. The fun comes when I close up again and we make several laps battling for the front spot. I also like the fact after a run you help with ideas to make MY car faster. Now that shows how competive you are and that the fun to you is being challanged not walking away with a win. I am better because of your help, you could beat me in every race but I will still come back because I am getting better and will soon beat you. That is where the fun in our sport is and if we don't keep it possible for the others in the race to feel they can also win they will go away and do something else.

I like stock racing, as it keeps it fun and aforadable. I also have cars that are no longer stock and find those to be fun also the key is to make the rules so the dollar dosen't buy the win. Dosen't have to be stock but has to have it's limits so the car that wins does so because the driver and the setup of the car made the differance not the money. Races need to be close no matter who wins.

That is the real problem!!
__________________
2EZ

Last edited by 2EZ; 2002.08.19 at 09:23 AM.
2EZ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2002.08.19, 09:27 AM   #7
butler
Mini-Z Chief
 
butler's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: UK, Hemel Hempstead
Posts: 692
Send a message via MSN to butler
Aye. Me and a Belguim friend have done a few bike trackdays together on 160mph beasts, but we had more fun racing 50cc Suzuki Street magics round a go kart track.

Close racing at any level is great. Its hard to have close racing in a mod class because of the differences in spec and generally the higher speeds mean bigger gaps.

Take Touring cars vs F1.
__________________
Haynes Manual: Prise away plastic locating pegs...
Reality: Snap off...

Haynes Manual: Lightly...
Reality: Start off lightly and build up till the veins on your forehead are throbbing then re-check the manual because this can not be 'lightly' what you are doing now.
butler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2002.08.19, 06:23 PM   #8
DAMZer
Zen_gineer
 
DAMZer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: The Border, SC
Posts: 1,363
2EZ, this Sunday at 2:00, let me know!

I agree with you all, the hobby and sport offers enough variation and speed to attract and keep our attention. Speed, custom bodies, body collecting, theme cars, racing cars, electronics upgrading, alloy madness, detailing, racing, comradery, bench racing, youth racing, etc...........

I'm glad to see others enjoy the art of friendly competition too.

BTW, we race with hopped up chassis's, stock ESC's, high dollar radios, 2EZ uses a 1 in a 100 stock motor, I use a stock motor with Neo mags to keep up with him on the straights. On our tight track, the Mini-Z BB motor is about the max you can run. No Turbo or you'll fly awwwwaaaaayyyyyy.
__________________
Racing is a state of mind....and I've lost it
DAMZer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2002.08.20, 12:26 AM   #9
wrcracer
Offroad Specialist
 
wrcracer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Wilmington NC USA
Posts: 1,647
Send a message via AIM to wrcracer
i agree with:

D) All of the Above.

mainly cause what i have to say has already been said, im gonna keep my mouth shut. anyway, 2EZ, i think i emailed you about racing, just wanted to let you know, if you hadnt seen the email. what kind of track do you guys race on? is it at a hobbyshop or in someone's garage?
__________________
My truck is like my fat girlfriend. All it does is f*** me and take my money.
AIM - TheBigGreenGMC
'Wheelin is Life.
WRCRacer's Gallery
wrcracer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2002.08.20, 02:07 PM   #10
mini-z
Administrator
 
mini-z's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Posts: 8,487
Cool thread guys! Basically it boils down to stictly enforced classes really. Some of the most fun I've had was racing stock F1s until the batteries died, constantly jockying for position, capitalizing on the others' mistakes etc. At the same time, trying out a new idea and reaching a new insane speed is a blast too!
mini-z is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2002.08.20, 05:47 PM   #11
DAMZer
Zen_gineer
 
DAMZer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: The Border, SC
Posts: 1,363
wrcracer,

The track is at Hobbies and More in Darlington. Not much as tracks go, PVC pipe and pipe insulation in the corners. It's on top of the concrete pad in the front of the store. It is covered by the building awning. Front straight into a long side straight, 180, straight, 270, 90, 90, 90, back onto the front. Kinda tight and technical, but there are 2 long straights. The 270 is tough! Lanes are close to 3' wide.

Medium to soft grip rears are a must. O-plate or stiff h-plate.

2EZ has a nice modular track.
__________________
Racing is a state of mind....and I've lost it
DAMZer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2002.08.29, 04:22 PM   #12
lightfighter
MINI-Z SOLDIER
 
lightfighter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: MOTORCITY, MI
Posts: 601
Stock is Stock!!!!!

Maybe only upgrade should be

bearings

and tires

Batts should be limited to Allkalines.... or hand out rechargeables
lightfighter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2002.08.29, 04:30 PM   #13
lightfighter
MINI-Z SOLDIER
 
lightfighter's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: MOTORCITY, MI
Posts: 601
cool thing about mini-z for less than $100 you can get into this sport without breaking you wallet and you can practice driving at home.........can't drive at home with my 1/10th scale...

For us guys who have the means to hopup and modify our cars there a class for us.........always.......never forget the newcomers to the sport.............I remember the first time a raced at a organized Rc Track there were guys with RV's working on there Cars and I had spent $400 of my hard earned money just to break into the racing scene only to find out that a kid making a few bucks won't stand a chance against someone who is got 10k evested in his RC operation!!!!!
So I have always raced a stock car, and a modified to help support the newcomers and make their first organized R/C race something that they would want to do again!!!!!!!

Cause if your the only one at the track then it anit a Race is it????
lightfighter is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2002.08.29, 04:57 PM   #14
ScottMcLeod
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2002
Location: Ottawa, Ontario
Posts: 890
Send a message via ICQ to ScottMcLeod Send a message via AIM to ScottMcLeod Send a message via Yahoo to ScottMcLeod
Stock racing owns... I don't think I could handle any more top end, or acceleration in most of the places I end up racing in.

Speaking of which, I snuk into the school today, with my l33t tech crew key, and raced a giant "imaginary oval" in the gym... I eventually got the car up to such a high speed that it was drifting circles 30-40 foot wide with the throttle wide open and not even the slightest input from me.... held it wide open for about 2 minutes.. then got dizzy from standing in the middle...
__________________
-Scott
ScottMcLeod is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Salt Lake Mini-Z Racing Regulations briankstan Salt Lake Mini-Z 0 2008.01.17 09:56 AM
Best body for stock class lnc0321 Mini-Z Racer MR-02 25 2007.09.11 02:24 AM
MR-02 RM Stock Racing Setup Spoon Mini-Z Racer MR-02 19 2006.05.10 05:13 PM
stock racing mrpat90 Beginner Questions 3 2005.04.30 09:37 PM
I am racing stock Brett Setups 12 2002.01.02 08:34 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:39 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.3
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2011 Mini-ZRacer.com
Mini Inferno Sale - Up to $85 Instant Savings!
Micro-T Hop-Ups
RC18R, M18, Micro RS4, Mini-LST, TamTech-Gear, Minizilla, RC18T, RC18B, RC18MT
shop.tinyrc.com Products

more»
Tiny RC Community News
[03/22/17] MZR was on vacation, didn't... : All kidding aside, the host experienced a bit of a server meltdown last week and efforts to restore the site to a new server took longer than anticipated. The current server is temporary until - more»
[11/25/15] Did You Hear? Our Black... : Hey Racers,
We're getting started a bit early with our Black Friday sale this year.  Generally we're not supporters of retailers opening early on Thanksgiving, but in our case, we're - more»
[06/30/15] shop.tinyrc.com: Have You... : Hey All! Just a quick reminder to everyone that we post all of our shop.tinyrc.com Newletters here on the MZR Forum. If for some reason you miss them in your email inbox, you can always see the - more»
Mini-Z, Mini-Z Racer, MR-02, MA-010
M18, M18T, RC18T, Mini-LST, Mini-T, Micro RS4, XRay, 1/18, 18th scale
XMODS, XMOD, Micro Flight, ZipZaps, ZipZaps SE, Bit Char-G, MicroSizers, TTTT, Plantraco Desktop Rover, SuperSlicks, Digi Q
Mini Inferno, Mini Inferno ST, half EIGHT, 1/16, 16th scale
Epoch, Indoor Racer, 1/43, 43rd scale
E-Savage, eSavage, eZilla, e-Zilla, HPI
Robots, Bots, Bipeds, Wheeled, Manoi, Roomba, NXT, Lego, Hacking
Crawling, Crawlers, Micro, RC, Losi Mini-Rock Crawler, Duratrax Cliff Climber
Kyosho Minium, Caliber 120, Minium Forums
Mini-Z Hop-Ups, Mini-Z Parts, Mini Inferno Hop-Ups, Mini Inferno Parts, M18 Hop-Ups, M18 Parts