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Old 2003.06.23, 10:58 PM   #1
95_civic_gsr
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Another Water Breaking In Motor Question

I have searched for two hours on this forrum and I can't find anything about
drying and lubricating the motor after breaking it in using the water method.

I know that you have to dispace the water out of the motor. Should
you use WD40 (Water Dispacing agent #40) or is there something else
that works better. What about Contact Cleaner? Canned Air??

I don't want to take my motor apart after breaking it in.

Once it has been cleared of all water, then it needs to be re-lubed correct?
What kind of grease, oil, or spay do I need to use on the motor to replace
what the water took out? Where on the motor do I need to add this
lubricant and how much of it should I apply.
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Old 2003.06.23, 11:30 PM   #2
herman
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after drying the motor out.... just place a drop of bearing oil on both ends of the armature (where they stick out of the motor can).... and that's it...
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Old 2003.06.23, 11:41 PM   #3
95_civic_gsr
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This isn't some kind of NooB initiation thing to get those new to Mini-Z to buy
new motors? Who has ever hear of putting anything electric in water.

Last edited by 95_civic_gsr; 2003.06.25 at 01:23 AM.
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Old 2003.06.24, 12:07 AM   #4
hilljd
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Thumbs up It's for real

"Water dipping"started years ago in 1/12 scale racing.
The original motors had enclosed brushes and would take hours to run in the brushes.
With the water breakin, the brushes contour to the comm without the high temperature arcing that damages the comm.

Put your motor in a glass of water and run at about 1/2 racing voltage till you just start to see dust in the water.
Use a no-residue spray cleaner to get water out.
Use a SMALL drop of oil, like Trinity brand bushing oil on each bushing.
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Old 2003.06.24, 01:08 AM   #5
herman
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didn't believe it myself the first time i heard it... well the water break in thing is basically up to you... some guys do it... some guys don't...

just don't forget to clean the motor after a couple of months running them... thought one of my motors was dead, until i cleaned it with motor spray....
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Old 2003.06.24, 05:06 AM   #6
Ken Mifune
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Contrary to belief, water is not conductive unless there are particles in it (contaminated), which is why I've always used a "big" jar of water because as the brushes seat against the comm, the water will start to contain a certain level of brush dust (conductive). Then you ask yourself... "What is the ratio of brush dust to water that will create an electrical short at such a low voltage?" I don't know (actually, I do.)
but I do know that electrcity will find the path of least resistance. ie. the brushes in contact with the comm.

and water is an insulator, so electricity(high voltage) will dance over and around any water to find it's ground. Then you also ask yourself... "Why will a hairdryer electricute somebody in the bathtub?" ...because the path of least resistance, which is from the surface of the water then through the plumbing, is YOU.

here's a question:
If you submerge a toaster in a bucket of water, then turn it on, will that trip the circuit breaker or heat the water?
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Last edited by Ken Mifune; 2003.06.24 at 05:20 AM.
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Old 2003.06.25, 01:22 AM   #7
95_civic_gsr
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I remember back from chemistry that pure water is an insulator just like you said, so i picked up a gallon of distilled de-ionized water @ 65 ¢. I was just worried about the aftermath of water on such small electrical parts. I can't imagine what rust would do to such a small motor.

I ran the motor with one alkali battery for 5 minutes, then went to two batteries for 5 minutes and then I went to three batteries for 5 minutes. I dried out and then cleaned out the motor. Just to make sure I took it slow for about 15 minutes around the track before opening up the throttle full blast.

Once I did I was quite upset. It seems that my car is not very fast at all when compared with three of my friends cars that didn't break in there motors. My car has not sparked once like theirs did when they first ran them. I read from above that sparking was bad. Is there something that I did wrong? I changes out the batteries with a freshly charged set with the same results.

So I didn't open it up anymore but I ran out the freshly charged set of batteries on the motor running at slow speeds in hopes to break it in the old way. I placed a freshly charged set in and it had not changed since the first break in of the motor. It is still very slow when compared with three other Mini-Zs.

Any Ideas? It is a brand new Mini-Z.
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Old 2003.06.25, 05:01 AM   #8
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ken... lol... man looks like you got into big scale cars before...

95civicgsr... beats me... could be a lot of things... are your friends using hot motors? could they have an internal turbo? are they using bearings? do you guys have the same set up?

are you using a ball diff? maybe the axle is too tight... or maybe your rear bearings are dirty...

or maybe (but unlikely) you got a bum motor?... interesting enough though... there are some mutant stock motors that run wierdly fast... i know i got one... and it just goes compared to some others i got...
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Old 2003.06.25, 10:31 AM   #9
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My car is entirely stock. It was just taken out of the package. My freinds cars are entirely stock two weeks old. Mine pales in comparison with all three cars, even with the rechargeable 750mAh Energizer batteries. Again, I have messed with nothing. My differenctial actually turns better than the others. I keep hopeing that my car will break in and get faster. So either they have three hot stock factory motors from Kyosho, or I have a mutant dud motor from Kyosho.
Mine: Calsonic Skyline
Theirs: 2003 Corvette, Imprezza WRX STI, Supra
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Old 2003.06.25, 11:59 PM   #10
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hmm... i suggest try putting one of their motors in your car and find out if there's any difference...

things to check... front tire bushings/rear axle bushings... make sure that the rims aren't screwed on too tight... that's the only thing i can think of at the moment.... p.s. you guys have a neat track...
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Old 2003.06.26, 12:46 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by herman
hmm... i suggest try putting one of their motors in your car and find out if there's any difference...
Funny that you should say that. I just tried it tonight. And I guess it is my
motor. Because when I put a freinds motor into my car. It was just as fast
as any of the other cars.

Quote:
Originally posted by herman
p.s. you guys have a neat track...
Thank you, I just lost my finger and thumb prints tonight racing everyone.
Even though my car is the slowest I managed to win one because the track
is so tight that a better line will beat a faster car.

Back to my problem: ( cause of problem ?)
1) bad motor from kyosho
2) water break in method produces slower motor
3) any ideas?

It is not that I can't afford a $9-20 motor. It is just that I want to remain
competitive with my freinds and if I get a hopped up motor. Then I stand
a chance of beating them by speed and not by driving.
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Old 2003.06.26, 12:48 AM   #12
Ken Mifune
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I agree, swap motors and maybe other stuff (one at a time) to try to single out the source of trouble.

have the bushings been oiled since the break in?

a thing I said in another thread: "I've done larger but never a 130 motor."
My approach is... less than 6volts on a 130 can just aint worth it.
Plus, I'm not that hardcore anymore. Just have fun. You don't need to win to have fun, but if you're getting womped on from a gang of wolves on a wilding spree, you need to start finding solutions. keep us updated.

herman, yes I was into 10thscale offroad. Once I actually did that hack-racing-tip where you connect the "double" and land on the car in front of you. On the outside I was "Oh, sorry dude." but on the inside I was "Whoa! That was too cool! I totally buried that guy!" Needless to say he was not happy and tried to hammer me in the other heats.


edit: 95_civic_gsr, oops. I guess you figured out it's the motor. Have you indeed oiled the bushings?
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Last edited by Ken Mifune; 2003.06.26 at 12:51 AM.
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Old 2003.06.28, 03:46 AM   #13
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I think your motor has not completedly run-in. In my experience, a motor needs more than 10 packs of batteries run to just partially run-in a motor. After that, I will use this motor for a month. You will find that the motor is going faster and faster, than clean the motor by motor cleaner or put it in water and run-in again.


Quote:
Originally posted by Ken Mifune
Contrary to belief, water is not conductive unless there are particles in it (contaminated), which is why I've always used a "big" jar of water because as the brushes seat against the comm, the water will start to contain a certain level of brush dust (conductive). Then you ask yourself... "What is the ratio of brush dust to water that will create an electrical short at such a low voltage?" I don't know (actually, I do.)
but I do know that electrcity will find the path of least resistance. ie. the brushes in contact with the comm.

and water is an insulator, so electricity(high voltage) will dance over and around any water to find it's ground. Then you also ask yourself... "Why will a hairdryer electricute somebody in the bathtub?" ...because the path of least resistance, which is from the surface of the water then through the plumbing, is YOU.

here's a question:
If you submerge a toaster in a bucket of water, then turn it on, will that trip the circuit breaker or heat the water?
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Old 2003.06.28, 03:56 AM   #14
95_civic_gsr
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Quote:
Originally posted by mryung
I think your motor has not completedly run-in. In my experience, a motor needs more than 10 packs of batteries run to just partially run-in a motor.... You will find that the motor is going faster and faster, than clean the motor by motor cleaner or put it in water and run-in again.

I hope this is the problem, but I ran my car for over 15 hours of run time and it is still as slow as the day I broke it in. The other cars dominate. I did use bearing oil on the motor after cleaning it out. I think I will go to the Hobby store and get a new can of electrical motor cleaner and see if maybe that will fix anything?
If not I think I will get a new Motor.
Do you need a turbo upgrade for the Kyosho X-Speed motor? If so I will probably contact Drac for a stock motor, or two, in order to conduct an experiment on this water breaking in thing.
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Old 2003.06.28, 06:12 AM   #15
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Xspeeds are safe with the stock ESC. no turbo upgrade is needed.
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