Mini-Z, Kyosho Mini-Z Racer, MR-03, MR-02, MA-010, Forums, News, Pictures, Parts, and Shop - Mini-ZRacer.com
Forums, Mini-Z, MiniZ, Kyosho Mini-Z, Kyosho MiniZ, Kyosho Mini-Z Racer
Mini-Z Hop-Ups, Mini-Z Parts, MiniZ Hop-Ups, MiniZ Parts, Kyosho Mini-Z Hop-Ups, Kyosho Mini-Z Parts, Kyosho MiniZ Hop-Ups, Kyosho MiniZ Parts, Kyosho Mini-Z Racer Hop-Ups, Racer Kyosho Mini-Z Parts

Go Back   Mini-ZRacer.com Forums > Mini RC

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 2009.05.21, 05:52 PM   #46
arch2b
Moderator
 
arch2b's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 32,796
Send a message via AIM to arch2b
i'd hold off a bit... again, your going to run into the scale issue. not all bodies scale exactly based on chassis scale. you may find the hpi chassis scale may not match up well with other manufacturer slot car bodies of the same scale.
you are absolutely correct in that you have a vast catalogue of manufacturers to cheery pick from however just because you can doesn't mean they will fit.

it's the same issue with mini-z, not all 1/28-27 bodies will work on the mini-z due to fudging of the scale in order to get it to fit properly.

we have/had the same problem with the epoch.
arch2b is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009.05.21, 06:59 PM   #47
benmlee
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 375
I agree, just because you have a vast selection of 1/32 scale bodies, does not mean it will fit. More important, does not mean people will buy the car. The trend is towards ready to run. Traxas is doing very well. Tamiya plastic model is dying. If you have to file drill and hack at the body, you will only appeal to a small segment of population that have the skill and patience to do it. Within that group, only the very skilled craftman can make a body fit a chassis as good as Kyosho mini-z. This means no blob of glue stick to hold things together. Also means maching the wheels to the correct offset and pressing bearings into it.
With our instant gratification society, if after spending just an hours on a body, and it does not look perfect, that customer will not be coming back.
benmlee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009.05.21, 09:09 PM   #48
color01
Moderator
 
color01's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Los Angeles (Pasadena), CA, USA
Posts: 2,809
Quote:
Originally Posted by ianc View Post
They've got to be fast with the smaller size, 130 motor and 2.4 GHz electronics, plus it looks like they come with unequal-length control arms and adjustable tie rods right out of the box. The design has gotta be 10 years newer than the 02, and I'm sure HPI has learned some lessons from Kyosho in that time.
That's no 130-can motor in there... did you see HPI's comparison with the Racing32 vs. a 1/32 slot car? The slot car has a 130; the Racing32 probably has an N30-can motor (Micro-T sized, by the looks of it).

It does indeed appear to have a dynamic strut front end, but we won't know till we see the knuckles. It's very easy to make a fake one that looks real, just look at a Mini-Z F1 from a distance.
__________________
Brian Ma

Greyscale RC

PN Racing | My TinyRC Blog
color01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009.05.22, 03:26 AM   #49
mugler
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: SoCal
Posts: 265
I noticed the motor being micro-T sized also which is a noteworthy point . Also even though the part count is very low and the design is simple one of the things I would want to find out after release would be just the general quality. The last two HPI entry level on road cars have had serious QC issues in both finished parts & built. These would be the Switch & The Cup racer. Incidentally their both sub par performers to competition for on track performance as well. So I think I'll wait a while after it comes out to see if it's a worthy purchase and I hope it is. Not happy about Kyosho's paranoid marketing which lead them to full on integrated electronics vs modular which would have been much more user friendly and enjoyable really.
mugler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009.05.22, 12:47 PM   #50
Skv012a
Registered User
 
Skv012a's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,922
Send a message via ICQ to Skv012a Send a message via AIM to Skv012a Send a message via MSN to Skv012a Send a message via Yahoo to Skv012a
Quote:
Originally Posted by mugler View Post
...full on integrated electronics vs modular which would have been much more user friendly and enjoyable really.
I think because this HPI mini uses separate parts it could make for extremely easy custom chassis builds and thus accomodate all available bodies.

Also, Arch, aren't there any 1/32 bodies you'd love to use on a RC or do Zs perferctly satisfy you right now? I'd like to ask everyone else here the same question too.
__________________
New site.
Skv012a is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009.05.22, 01:10 PM   #51
arch2b
Moderator
 
arch2b's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 32,796
Send a message via AIM to arch2b
sure there are. however, i've already put well over a year and much money into 1:32 rc's. in the end, i had more fun with the mini-z. i'm not going to jump into a new scale just for bodies i guess is my answer.
arch2b is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009.05.22, 08:13 PM   #52
bermbuster
GF Racing
 
bermbuster's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Metro NYC
Posts: 2,959
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skv012a View Post
I think because this HPI mini uses separate parts it could make for extremely easy custom chassis builds and thus accomodate all available bodies.

Also, Arch, aren't there any 1/32 bodies you'd love to use on a RC or do Zs perferctly satisfy you right now? I'd like to ask everyone else here the same question too.
The z s did satisfy me but the new hand polish and the slipping attention to detail along w the higher prices is making me hungry....

The real thing is how much will they cost in relation to the mini z and will HPI be there in the long haul. I suggest we all go slow and see how things develop. For starters they definitely use a different battery technology and you will need another TX (hopefully just a module)
__________________
GF Racing Team Driver
Dream Killr Racing.....Live the Dream
"The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands in moments of comfort, but where he stands at times of challenge and controversy."
bermbuster is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009.05.22, 10:03 PM   #53
mugler
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: SoCal
Posts: 265
Quote:
Originally Posted by soulstice View Post
I use to be in the toy biz briefly and the biggest reason Kyosho probably went 1/28 scale is for licensing reasons.

Over 400 autoscale variants have been made to date. If Kyosho went 1/24 or 1/32 they would have had to spend more resources on securing exclusive licensing, especially for premier brands like Ferrari. Starting a new scale like 1/28 10 years back is kind of a work around to get exclusive licensing at a particular scale.

To the same effect, since HPI had already resourced licensing for 1/32 slots, it only makes sense that they get the most bang for their buck by extending that license with an RC version.

If true about costs of licensing i n different scales which sounds like it is, then this reasoning solves the scale choice mysteries of the 2 company's for me.
mugler is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009.05.22, 10:24 PM   #54
kydawg1
Registered User
 
kydawg1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Motor City BURBZ
Posts: 17
I will take em......when and how much????
kydawg1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009.05.22, 10:52 PM   #55
Fovea3d
Registered User
 
Fovea3d's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Strasbourg France
Posts: 755
Quote:
Originally Posted by soulstice View Post
I use to be in the toy biz briefly and the biggest reason Kyosho probably went 1/28 scale is for licensing reasons.

Over 400 autoscale variants have been made to date. If Kyosho went 1/24 or 1/32 they would have had to spend more resources on securing exclusive licensing, especially for premier brands like Ferrari. Starting a new scale like 1/28 10 years back is kind of a work around to get exclusive licensing at a particular scale.

To the same effect, since HPI had already resourced licensing for 1/32 slots, it only makes sense that they get the most bang for their buck by extending that license with an RC version.
Not totally refuting the licensing theory but here is something I have read about choice of 1/28 scale. Aki Susuki said in an interview years ago "the base concept was to be able to use the model on a dining table, so what is important is the turn radius, a 1/24 scale would have need much more space" in the french "Auto RCMag"
Also regarding licensing, keep in mind that Kyosho also produces 1/18 and 1/43 static models, not to mention the dNaNo now. I doubt they would have to pay a licence for each scale.
Regarding the HPI I think 1/32 would not be too far from some compact Mini-z cars like the Mini Cooper, Stratos, also the Caprice Taxi was more 1/32 (1/313 to be exact) given its dimensions in real size. I think the HPI and mini-Z may compete in a special class where the MZ would be set to minimal dimensions (O offset, 86mm WB, while the HPI would have extended WB and offset. The bodies would be some compromise between the two scales (compacts or mega big cars) Such a class would clearly become interesting given the technical differences used by the two brands.

EDIT: Small Mini-Z vs Big 1/32 slotcar The Stratos has 86mm WB just like the Torino
__________________
3d printed bodies and parts
mini6z
European mini-z forum
My mini-z collection

Last edited by Fovea3d; 2009.05.23 at 11:51 AM.
Fovea3d is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009.05.22, 11:07 PM   #56
-J-
Registered User
 
-J-'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Charlotte, NC
Posts: 201
Send a message via AIM to -J- Send a message via MSN to -J- Send a message via Yahoo to -J-
Kyosho does have to pay for licensing for different scales, at least in the dNaNo's case. This is why the Ferrari dNaNos are more than say the Subarus or the Skylines. The licensing cost more to obtain for the Ferraris than the Subarus.
__________________
#$^**&^$#^*(()*^%$#@@#%
-J- is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009.05.23, 12:31 AM   #57
Skv012a
Registered User
 
Skv012a's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,922
Send a message via ICQ to Skv012a Send a message via AIM to Skv012a Send a message via MSN to Skv012a Send a message via Yahoo to Skv012a
Honestly, why try and combine these with Zs when a good deal of you are getting into Dnanos, as an example? I don't see a problem with trying new scales and IMO they'd only fall if no one ends up giving them a shot.

I think that if slot guys decide to pick these up we'll get a nice boost of fresh meat and everyone will enjoy it.
__________________
New site.
Skv012a is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009.05.23, 12:39 AM   #58
-J-
Registered User
 
-J-'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Charlotte, NC
Posts: 201
Send a message via AIM to -J- Send a message via MSN to -J- Send a message via Yahoo to -J-
Quote:
Originally Posted by Skv012a View Post
Honestly, why try and combine these with Zs
Because unless these take off right after their release date and fast, most people who end up with these won't have anyone to race these with for a year minimum.
__________________
#$^**&^$#^*(()*^%$#@@#%
-J- is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009.05.23, 08:09 AM   #59
soulstice
Registered User
 
soulstice's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: VA
Posts: 1,069
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fovea3d View Post
Not totally refuting the licensing theory but here is something I have read about choice of 1/28 scale. Aki Susuki said in an interview years ago "the base concept was to be able to use the model on a dining table, so what is important is the turn radius, a 1/24 scale would have need much more space" in the french "Auto RCMag"
Also regarding licensing, keep in mind that Kyosho also produces 1/18 and 1/43 static models, not to mention te dNaNo now. I doubt they would have to pay a licence for each scale.
Regarding the HPI I think 1/32 would not be too far from some compact Mini-z cars like the Mini Cooper, Stratos, also the Caprice Taxi was more 1/32 (1/313 to be exact) given its dimensions in real size. I think the HPI and mini-Z may compete in a special class where the MZ would be set to minimal dimensions (O offset, 86mm WB, while the HPI would have extended WB and offset. The bodies would be some compromise between the two scales (compacts or mega big cars) Such a class would clearly become interessant given the technical differences used by the two brands.

EDIT: Small Mini-Z vs Big 1/32 slotcar The Stratos has 86mm WB just like the Torino
I'm sure the quote you're referencing was definitely a real consideration of theirs but in the end IMO the licensing issue is what drove the selection of 1/28 scale because there are some substantial costs associated with securing licensing. By creating a new scale they don't have to compete with other companies, thus giving them more flexibility and less cost.

And yes they do have to pay licenses for each scale unless it's a blanket contract that gives them freedom to produce whatever they want.

It depends on the licensor, but contracts can be for one scale, or a number of scales together. It can be exclusive worldwide, or to a particular region, or a particular country. The terms are usually limited to a certain number of years. And type of application plays into it too, like is it a static model or an RC.

Ferrari's licensing costs are some of the highest in the biz because it's also one of the most coveted. If you are familiar with video game series Gran Turismo, you may remember that for a long time, they didn't have any Ferraris. This is because another company had secured a multi-year, worldwide, exclusive license on the brand for use in video games. It wasn't until that license was up for review that Sony was able to make a bid to gain the license and start using ferraris in their game.
__________________
My Mini-Z Collection: Z Madness
My Lego Habit: FoundryDX

Last edited by soulstice; 2009.05.23 at 08:15 AM.
soulstice is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2009.05.23, 11:45 AM   #60
Skv012a
Registered User
 
Skv012a's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 1,922
Send a message via ICQ to Skv012a Send a message via AIM to Skv012a Send a message via MSN to Skv012a Send a message via Yahoo to Skv012a
Quote:
Originally Posted by -J- View Post
Because unless these take off right after their release date and fast, most people who end up with these won't have anyone to race these with for a year minimum.
I feel its the same as Dnanos right now, but a good deal of you are indeed stocking up on them. They are taking off from the looks of it and they're really a black sheep as far as RC scales go currently.
__________________
New site.
Skv012a is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Futaba 1/20 Scale Indy Cars Mondo Mini RC 54 2006.05.12 09:35 PM
1/32 wws cars.... herman Mini RC 12 2004.08.27 11:47 AM
Tom Thumb Hobbies -- Race Report 12/13/2003 latency Tom Thumb Hobbies, Columbus OH 0 2003.12.14 01:23 PM
1:1 scale cars RallyNut Off-Topic 71 2002.06.08 02:07 AM
All my small scale RC Cars with Clod Buster ricerocketinwa Autoscales, Bodies, Cars and Drivers 4 2002.05.23 08:02 PM


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:53 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.3
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 2011 Mini-ZRacer.com
Mini Inferno Sale - Up to $85 Instant Savings!
Micro-T Hop-Ups
RC18R, M18, Micro RS4, Mini-LST, TamTech-Gear, Minizilla, RC18T, RC18B, RC18MT
shop.tinyrc.com Products

more»
Tiny RC Community News
[03/22/17] MZR was on vacation, didn't... : All kidding aside, the host experienced a bit of a server meltdown last week and efforts to restore the site to a new server took longer than anticipated. The current server is temporary until - more»
[11/25/15] Did You Hear? Our Black... : Hey Racers,
We're getting started a bit early with our Black Friday sale this year.  Generally we're not supporters of retailers opening early on Thanksgiving, but in our case, we're - more»
[06/30/15] shop.tinyrc.com: Have You... : Hey All! Just a quick reminder to everyone that we post all of our shop.tinyrc.com Newletters here on the MZR Forum. If for some reason you miss them in your email inbox, you can always see the - more»
Mini-Z, Mini-Z Racer, MR-02, MA-010
M18, M18T, RC18T, Mini-LST, Mini-T, Micro RS4, XRay, 1/18, 18th scale
XMODS, XMOD, Micro Flight, ZipZaps, ZipZaps SE, Bit Char-G, MicroSizers, TTTT, Plantraco Desktop Rover, SuperSlicks, Digi Q
Mini Inferno, Mini Inferno ST, half EIGHT, 1/16, 16th scale
Epoch, Indoor Racer, 1/43, 43rd scale
E-Savage, eSavage, eZilla, e-Zilla, HPI
Robots, Bots, Bipeds, Wheeled, Manoi, Roomba, NXT, Lego, Hacking
Crawling, Crawlers, Micro, RC, Losi Mini-Rock Crawler, Duratrax Cliff Climber
Kyosho Minium, Caliber 120, Minium Forums
Mini-Z Hop-Ups, Mini-Z Parts, Mini Inferno Hop-Ups, Mini Inferno Parts, M18 Hop-Ups, M18 Parts