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Old 2012.03.11, 08:19 PM   #31
Felix2010
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Guys — I feel for you having traction issues on new SP.ED. RCP… That’s not what I would have expected from RCP? If the material looks the same just a different color, maybe it is just chemical residue or dryness all the way thru? I have found vacuuming with a good vacuum (>Powerful, not the have-dead vacuum in the garage) the RCP-material gets a little re-newed or something because I love running after just vacuuming the RCP (vacuum part blows though..)

If you have a spray bottle with water and mist water (just a little) over the entire track - Not wet, just to get moisture in the air. Let sit 10minutes; Vacuum. If these 2 things don’t work, I would get in touch with RCP.
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Old 2012.03.11, 08:49 PM   #32
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Trust me. If it doesn't get better ill be emailing, calling or whatever needs to be done. I too was simply expecting the same quality in a new color.
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Old 2012.03.14, 09:15 PM   #33
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confirmation provided from the factory,
Quote:
" The factory responded and said the material and grooming process on the specidal edition tracks are identical to the black tile tracks. The only difference on their end was the color of the tiles and rails."
wanted to pass this along to you guys.

that being said, this doesn't mean there isn't some tangible difference in how they perform right out of the box. it could be packing, shipping contamination or manufacturing residue that normally gets shaken or wiped off that wasn't. i'm sure the environmental conditions at the time of manufacturer also play into the performance.
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Old 2012.03.15, 03:06 AM   #34
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Maybe its the dye color itself.
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Old 2012.03.15, 04:57 AM   #35
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hmm... i saw a video of a race on atomic tracks that use gray as their primary track color...

check out this video -Atomic Mini Z Championship 2009 A Final ~ Round 1 and here's the related thread - click me

if i remember it right, participants had traction issues as well... try asking the guys who went and participated... stephen bui, sai tam, mike ma to see if characteristics of the atomic track and rcp special edition are identical...

i haven't had the chance to try out the atomic track so i can't really say anything about it...

probably wash it off with soap and water to take out any residue?

Last edited by herman; 2012.03.15 at 05:03 AM.
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Old 2012.03.15, 02:39 PM   #36
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i think washing it down is something we are going to try. just need to coordinate my schedule to pick, wash and return the track.

in the long run, i think it will need to be broken in over time, more so than black tiles. this was all very much unexpected however. there is no going back at this point though so i need to try my best to work with it. i doubt i'm going to get it replaced and can't afford to order another 3WL and wide turn kit.
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Old 2012.03.15, 05:03 PM   #37
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At least it wont traction roll I prefer low grip to high grip... traction should come up, but possibly not as much as the black track. What tires have you tried on this new surface?
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Old 2012.03.15, 06:30 PM   #38
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If you guys are having problems with traction, try these tire combos:
- Kyosho 20* slick rear w/ PN 15* slick front
- Kyosho 20* slick rear w/ PN 15* x pattern front

If you still need traction, try loosening the diffs a bit, and/or running 19mm wheels. I know that these tires work good on tracks with medium to low grip, so I hope this helps. All of these tires are very soft and tend to flex a bit.
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Old 2012.03.15, 07:29 PM   #39
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Well, there is traction problem and then there is serious traction problem... We all run Kyosho 20... But there was no way to get any grip... I am not particularly fast but was able to regularly lap the track in the 4.40s and 4.30s with a best of 4.23... But that's on my home track. My best time at Hobby Works was a 5.3 something, drifting my way around with my throttle EPA down to 50.
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Old 2012.03.15, 07:38 PM   #40
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I also tried the PN6 radial, i put them on my son's car. There were pros and cons; the pros: i got no wear on the tires, the cons: i got about the same level of grip as with the kyosho...
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Old 2012.03.15, 09:03 PM   #41
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Same here. I run kyosho 20 slicks on the rear and 30 slicks on the front Trued. There was just no getting any grip, period. I went from doing a fast lap of 4 seconds to 5 seconds and running 102 to 108 laps to 88 to 84 laps. I changed diffs to different cars and nothing really worked. There was grey dust all over the tires. The only thing I can think of is trying 40 radials in the front and 10 radials in the back. The tires didn't even remotely have any wear by the end of the day. But I never change anything on my cars other then grease on the damper and kingpins if needed from track to track. I set the end points on the radio when I get the chassis and leave it alone. I find it pointless to fight the car by constantly changing radio and car settings. Once i got the car set up like i want it, it seems to run good anywhere. It's all up to me knowing how to drive and I definetly have my days. But I don't think their is anyway to run a solid set up on this track in its current condition unless I go back to racing the AWD again. Which I did take it around the track Saturday and did well. But it's costly to do.
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Old 2012.03.15, 09:39 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by herman View Post
hmm... i saw a video of a race on atomic tracks that use gray as their primary track color...

check out this video -Atomic Mini Z Championship 2009 A Final ~ Round 1 and here's the related thread - click me

if i remember it right, participants had traction issues as well... try asking the guys who went and participated... stephen bui, sai tam, mike ma to see if characteristics of the atomic track and rcp special edition are identical...

i haven't had the chance to try out the atomic track so i can't really say anything about it...

probably wash it off with soap and water to take out any residue?
The Atomic Track is a carpet track not RCP. I haven't raced on RCP in a while since going carpet (just love the carpet). But in short, I don't see why the grey RCP should give different traction, give it some time for the grey dust/powder to come off. I've ran on some black (traditional) RCP that had the same issue (very dusty), you just have to run on it a few times, traction will come up and traction roll will follow once again
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Old 2012.03.25, 12:04 AM   #43
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you may see other opinions posted but we washed the track thoroughly in the rain today. we used a VERY small amount of a green all natural cleaning product just in case the issue was a residue other than the fine almost talcum like track dust produced by the special edition track.

some interesting findings.

the track dust produced is best described as talcum powder like. it is much more fine and much more dry than the normal new tile dust. it essentially makes any rubber tire no little better than drift tires.

when unpacking the new special edition track, it contained a far greater amount of dust or texturing residue than what i've seen in at least 9 of the new track sets i've purchased over the years. it had a sheen to it as well.

as the track dried out, the traction level dropped. right after washing we mopped dry and vacuumed the track and started running laps. no standing water and no water buildup in the car either. let it drip dry then mop dry enough and you can race safely, which we did for hours. it was clear that as the track dried out, portions of the track got more slippery. granted by this time our tires were also saturated but under steer was predictable as a result vs. unpredictable track conditions. you can best describe it as driving in the winter and hitting black ice. you can't see it precisely but portions were quantifiably more slick. as an example, you can block the car and pull the throttle and under normal conditions your diff would slip as the rear tires may spin at first but there is enough friction with the tile to prevent burnouts. on this track, you could find spots as the track dried that offered very little resistance allowing you to block the car and both back tires would burn out as if you had drift tires on. move the car to another spot and traction similar to normal, move down some more and your on ice again.

it may be coincidence or not but the lighter the tile color the slippery it tended to be. there is no measurements to back that claim other than our personal experience.

in general, the track, wet, after cleaning had improved traction. not nearly what you would expect from a new standard track but better than before the cleaning. rene still has the track and will be running more laps on it as it fully dries out to see what becomes of our experiment. initial testing shows some improvement but also showed that any improvement may drop off as the tiles fully dry out.

i did see tire wear after the hour or two of laps so it is improved to some degree.

interestingly enough, i like driving on a wet rcp track. i've demonstrated it to be safe and oddly enough fun. fun for me anyway as it felt like a much more natural pavement experience. it would make for an awsome addition to a long endurance race to have a 'rain' section where the track is moistened and dries over time.

further results to come....
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Old 2012.04.03, 08:11 AM   #44
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we race again this weekend! post track wash results are promising as traction has improved. it requires defining a new standard tire combination though, which is not totally unexpected from a new track. i anticipated that to some extent. i'm hoping that as the track breaks in, kyosho 20/30 become the norm again as they are simple to source and make it very easy for everyone vs. the golden corral like buffet of PN, Atomic, RR tire options.

the important thing to take away from this is (based on our experience);
1. special edition tracks MUST be washed thoroughly prior to use
2. special edition track dust is present in greater quantity right out of the box
3. special edition track dust is very fine and feels/behaves similar to talcum powder

we will also be altering the bump out tile color to make it stand out more. user experience is, it is more difficult to see on the grey tile. swapping out with standard bump rails is the simple solution until the rail coloring can be done.
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Old 2012.04.17, 12:09 PM   #45
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thanks for posting the information on this.
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