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Old 2015.04.20, 05:27 PM   #16
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Lipo was a given but I wanted to incorporate a link style 1/12th rear end with the versatility of an open electronics packages. I have to shave a little material off the motor mount but a sensored motor will be going in this bad boy so this will most likely be the first true 2wd sensored bl with pivot ball/tri-shock mini z.
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Old 2015.04.20, 07:04 PM   #17
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Looks good. Keep us posted.
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Old 2015.04.20, 08:05 PM   #18
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thks It looks like I will be using the atomic mg digital servo as I have seen that that servo can be utilized for what I need. I should have the front end ready this friday and by next friday I should be able to get some track time.
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Old 2015.04.20, 10:22 PM   #19
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Couple more photos that have a little better light. Got the front end mounted except I am missing those two tiny upper arm screws so I have to wait for those to come in. Also does anyone know of some good M2 metric taps? I have the rear shock stay made out of steel but can't get the screws to thread so I might just order that in plastic too. Also does anyone know what kind of drill bit I should be using to countersink the holes? Saw some machining countersinks but they are kind of pricey. If you have any sugestions just let me know.


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Old 2015.04.21, 01:29 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DMALMAD View Post
Lipo was a given but I wanted to incorporate a link style 1/12th rear end with the versatility of an open electronics packages. I have to shave a little material off the motor mount but a sensored motor will be going in this bad boy so this will most likely be the first true 2wd sensored bl with pivot ball/tri-shock mini z.
Nice. 2WD is fun, but I'm beginning to look towards AWD for higher power setups, as there just seems to be no way to beef up a 2WD rear end to stay behind the front tires when giving it a good throttle. I hope your system is more stable in that regard, but I'm afraid the standard rims are just too narrow to provide the friction necessary to make the extra power useful. You will spend a lot of your time on the front end of your throttle switch just to stay going forward. Little too much, and there goes the rear. If you can ween in on it easy enough to get some speed, you can then hammer on it and rocket off to the other side of the track, but you really have to be subtle about it. Maybe I wasn't conservative enough with my gearing, but I'd hate to think that because I put more power in my car that now I have to do things to slow it down. At any rate, good luck and keep the pictures coming. They are more fun to look at.
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Old 2015.04.21, 05:25 AM   #21
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Looks great so far.
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Old 2015.04.21, 08:13 AM   #22
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Originally Posted by Jshwaa View Post
Nice. 2WD is fun, but I'm beginning to look towards AWD for higher power setups, as there just seems to be no way to beef up a 2WD rear end to stay behind the front tires when giving it a good throttle. I hope your system is more stable in that regard, but I'm afraid the standard rims are just too narrow to provide the friction necessary to make the extra power useful. You will spend a lot of your time on the front end of your throttle switch just to stay going forward. Little too much, and there goes the rear. If you can ween in on it easy enough to get some speed, you can then hammer on it and rocket off to the other side of the track, but you really have to be subtle about it. Maybe I wasn't conservative enough with my gearing, but I'd hate to think that because I put more power in my car that now I have to do things to slow it down. At any rate, good luck and keep the pictures coming. They are more fun to look at.
This chassis is really geared only to the absolute performance minded racer. Currently with either rubber tires rcp or foam carpet there is no lack of traction. Currently on foam carpet we run 32t tweaked motors with 7.4v lipo and there is no lack of traction. Rear end stays glued and we have tons of steering just watch our race videos. I think if anything it is time to be moving towards a lighter more nimble car. If anything AWD is more finnicky and at speed you run into a lot of issues.
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Old 2015.04.21, 08:54 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by DMALMAD View Post
This chassis is really geared only to the absolute performance minded racer. Currently with either rubber tires rcp or foam carpet there is no lack of traction. Currently on foam carpet we run 32t tweaked motors with 7.4v lipo and there is no lack of traction. Rear end stays glued and we have tons of steering just watch our race videos. I think if anything it is time to be moving towards a lighter more nimble car. If anything AWD is more finnicky and at speed you run into a lot of issues.
Does the foam/carpet have somewhat of a velcro effect? Seriously, lipo and 32T and no control issues? Hard to believe.

Don't let weight be as much of a hindrance on your design as much as how you displace it. If the design objective is only to cram the most store bought components on a slab of carbon fiber in an order that appears as if you've sneezed them on the car, the performance will show regardless.

What issues 'at speed' are you referring to with AWD? The issues I find with AWD is cost, and more moving parts leads to more breakdown potential, but performance-wise these little cars do nothing but benefit.
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Old 2015.04.21, 10:21 AM   #24
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You tell me if there is control issues: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rlhqzkQpxQ8

You represent mini-z bashers, this is most likely going to be a one-off or a small production run aimed for mini-z RACERS. Most race on prepared race surfaces specifically designed for mini-z. I have never experienced your sentiments because I don't race on the surface you do. Surface and tires is 90% of racing like I have always said. I think you are trying to find a solution for a problem that is not there. This chassis is to improve the suspension and allow open electronics packages to increase performance. When the prototype is complete I may look into different chassis options as I have a number of different designs I have but so far this is the one that I think will be the most succesful but only track times will tell. Comparitevly this layout puts more weight towards the rear f the car like the transverse v.s. in-line 1/12th cars which should yeild more steering. Currently (like I have already stated) tractin issues is a non-issue. I appreciate your input but it is not suited for the purposes of this chassis.

As for the AWD torque steer and breakages are a serious issue. Also eradict handling is also an issue. The AWD tweak easy but I guess if your only inention is micro rc speed runs then maybe an awd would be better suited for your purposes.

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Old 2015.04.21, 11:02 AM   #25
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Neat video...

All those cars were 2WD?

No, I don't see control issues. Actually, I see that the race came down to who had the least mistakes as it should have, more than one car having WAY better performance than a moderately modified mini-z, and I would bet that most of it came down to a fancy radio with good settings and a practiced knowledge of the track.

No bashing here, just curiosity. Like how you could have traction that could be described as allowing you to drive up a wall, without having a lick of hindrance on your forward motion. That is weird....however if the hindrance is equal on all racers that does lead to a good race. You're right, I don't even run on mini-z tracks. Just try to maximize as cheaply as I can, however that is relative I guess because I've spent way more than I've anticipated.
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Old 2015.04.21, 12:25 PM   #26
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We all race with pretty much the same equipment except with some slight variations to match our drifferent driving style. This race I won because I had managed my tires very well and was able to minimize mistakes but also because I had tq and was able to get into a rythm early on. Our club represents a small portion of the racing community not only because we run foam tires and lipo but also because everyone spends hundreds and thousands on their gear. Of the competitive racers I probably run the most budget. I have a used radio and although it is a high quality Ko propo helios it is not the 500$ ex-1.

As for the traction different foam tires have different effects. Certain compounds give more forward grip but less lateral, some decrease corner speed but really lock the car in. It really depends on setup and tire maintanance. All the cars there are 2wd, the 4wd cars are at least 3 tenths a lap slower but on this paticular layout it is closer to 1/2 second a lap.

Anyways back on topic, does anyone have a suggestion for a motor pod that you would like to be made compatibe with this? I might try and design it so that the motor pod screws on to the link part of the current chassis and to accomodate it I would redesign the shock layout. Anyways let me know.
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Old 2015.04.25, 04:23 PM   #27
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So I got the front end completed and it is butter smooth. I had to tweak it a little (flip upper arms upside down) and polish the reflex kingpins a little but it feels just right. Speaking of just right, I was amazed at how tight yet smooth the rear pivot is. There is no slop in any direction but it moves absolutely free. There is no hint of it catching or sticking which is great. I also fitted the battery and put the shock parts on to give an idea of how it is going to work. Now all I am waiting on is the links and the servo and the plastic rear shock stay. Recently shapeways added a 3d printed stainless steel medium but it looks like it is too strong! Basically I had a hard time finding a metric tap so when I tappped it using sae hardware the threads didn't work right. A little disapointing but the shapeways plastic is very sturdy and should do the job with ease. Anyway here are some pictures to show my progress thus far:












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Old 2015.05.03, 02:00 PM   #28
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9plI...ature=youtu.be

AHA! The steering works! I finally got my most of my mail in and got the steering servo mounted and all the links installed. The rear links work well and the pod has plenty of articulation. But the Steering is awesome. Super smooth with this atomic digital metal gear servo. The way the links are makes the steering precise, even more so than the 03 because there is no slop but everything moves freely. Also there is no bump steer. I was contemplating a drag link system to save space for my esc but this just works so well I cannot bring myself to do it. However, since the servo is mounted dead center on the chassis ther is not enough room to mount all the electronics. Also I have discovered that the sensored motor will not fit so with that in mind i designed a new chassis that I have taken a considerable amount of material from the pod so that I could elongate the main chassis enough fit all the electronics. So now I am delayed another week or so while I wait for the new chassis but am pretty happy with the progress because basically once I get the next chassis everything will be working properly and I can hopefuly put some laps down.
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Old 2015.05.03, 06:04 PM   #29
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May have found a solution to my space issue. Does anyone have any experience with the hobbyking 10a micro sensorless speed control. It has a decent amount of programable functions and should be plenty powerful. The part number is 913000001. Either way I already am getting the chassis with extra space but I think this will just make things easier and allow me to use the car before my updated chassis comes in. I am even thinking about getting two of these to try and fit one into an MRX. If anyone else is reviving an MRCG or something else like that it is worth giving the Hobby King esc a look as it is only 12 dollars shipped from the USA
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Old 2015.05.03, 08:54 PM   #30
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Sounds like good development, look forward to see and hear how the revised chassis fits and runs.
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